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Racing 2015/16 FIS Alpine World Cup

Discussion in 'Events & FIS' started by Heinz, Oct 21, 2015.

  1. sly_karma

    sly_karma Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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    Oh now that is a faux pas if ever there was. Ouch.
     
  2. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    I don't think too many skiers would get away with that. Lucky she's verging on GOAT status.

    The Austrians will not be amused.
     
  3. sly_karma

    sly_karma Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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    If she decides to extend her career a bit further and chase Stenmark's win record, she might need a contract extension with Head. That will be an interesting negotiation...
     
  4. crackson

    crackson A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    Really? You only just realised she's a massive d'head?
     
  5. person s

    person s Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    how can that be possible if she stripped off and got body-painted?
     
  6. sly_karma

    sly_karma Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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    Ms Vonn apparently got over her fit of pique and took a second place the following day, securing the DH title as well. That is a mind-boggling 20 crystal globes for her. And she's back in the lead for the overall as well.
     
  7. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    Only 10 wins off Stenmark's 86.
     
  8. kaegee

    kaegee One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    What a sight to watch was I Stenmark. Bro:metun:.
     
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  9. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    Excuse me while I name drop but Phil Mahre talks about Stenmark like Seinfeld does about Newman.

     
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  10. skinavy

    skinavy One of Us

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  11. person s

    person s Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    how much slower than the slowest Australian?
     
  12. skinavy

    skinavy One of Us

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    About 31 seconds behind Emily Bamford who was 18.9 behind Tina Maze.
     
  13. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    Wow that's slow.

    Em is the perfect example of someone who made all the Olympic qualification requirements (tested at the CAS too), a very solid skier, but is clearly not a world-beater. She had a chance to go to the Olympics and made the most of it.

    I haven't raced in years, but I'm confident that if I walked out the door to a ski resort right now, I'd come within 30 seconds of Em, and I am a million miles away from qualifying legitimately for the Olympics.
     
  14. person s

    person s Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Vanessa Mae actually made it to the bottom of the hill unlike Eddie the Eel's performance in the pool
    if she had worn a bullfighter suit like that Mexican guy it would have been more entertaining
    or she could have played the violin on the way down
     
  15. crackson

    crackson A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    Any butthurt pros that think an amatuer participant is wrong need to learn about the history of the games.

    Not so long ago, pros were banned for being self-obsessed corporate prostitutes.


    In the majority of olympics held, amatuer participation was core.


    Letting pros in was a mistake.
     
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  16. skinavy

    skinavy One of Us

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    Nothing wrong with having an amateur participant, what is wrong is the manipulation of the rules, if not out right falsification of results, (one of the races was the "Thailand Junior Championships", with only a single Thai competitor who was 35 years old at the time, Vanessa Mae, and the field included a retired nation level skier who was there purely to change the way points would be calculated such that Vanessa Mae would achieve the required qualification points for Sochi). Admittedly the rules allowed national associations to put on extra races to enable their athletes to qualify however I doubt many were as dodgy in there conduct.
     
  17. crackson

    crackson A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    At least they didn't buy her for a meaningless medal.

    Dale Spammer anyone.

    We buy pro a'holes for historical glory despite how seedy and dodgy they are at the time.
     
  18. skinavy

    skinavy One of Us

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    However Dale qualified for the Olympics through the standard steps, no dodgy extra events with suspect officals to enable qualifying results. Also he had to sit out of international competition for a number of years and achieve Australian citzenship (have to be a citzen to compete for a country at the Olympics, hence Quade Cooper currently doesn't qualify for rugby 7s at Rio) in order to represent Australia. I also doubt we 'bought' him given he was independently wealthy and Canada wouldn't allow him to have a training program that worked around his business, hence moving a country that was prepared to allow that.

    You mightn't like him because of how he made his money(and frankly he doesn't come across well in the media), but the fact remains that it wasn't illegal and he became both a World Champion and Olympic gold medal winner. You don't achieve that without a huge amount of dedication and work.
     
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  19. sly_karma

    sly_karma Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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    Lots to debate in that post, and there's more than one point of view for sure. Yes, the olympics were once strictly amateur only. But in the mid 20th century, you had political regimes using the olympics as a platform for their nationalistic aims (Nazi Germany, the Soviet bloc countries) and so you had systematic state funding. Athletes elsewhere rapidly found they had to become full time professionals in all but payment in order to match the under-the-table pros they were facing. It didn't take long before athletes grew discouraged at their full time unpaid status and so parallel professional leagues appeared in many sports (including ski racing). The IOC wrestled with this for many years until the loss of top athletes to pro competition had become sufficiently widespread that they felt the olympic brand was under threat of dilution and irrelevance.

    How to go back to amateur-only olympics? Can we go back? Should we go back? There are some sports where there is already a massive pro league and I really question their place in the games - tennis and basketball come to mind. For me, the olympics is a showcase for sports that don't have a significant world audience outside the games, a bundling of events if you will. So I'd give tennis and basketball and ice hockey the flick (even though I'm a hockey fan). Those sports have their own market access and don't need olympic medals for legitimacy.

    Then there are the niche sports that are essentially still amateur today (for example: luge/bobsleigh, archery, judo, biathlon, etc), there's no issue there. The tricky part comes with sports where a handful of top pros are making some money but the sport in general isn't supporting a well funded pro circuit. Ski racing falls into that category, so do many others like track & field, swimming, etc. The key problem is this: forcing the field back into amateur status will drive away the very best athletes and result in an olympic field with the sport's stars missing; many fans will mentally put an asterisk next to the results. All the issues that occurred before the move from amateur would recur very quickly: under the table payments from sponsors, in-kind payment of living, equipment and travel costs, and so on. We didn't have a level playing field in the officially amateur games era and we don't have one now. The money was always there, at least now it's a little more transparent.
     
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  20. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    [​IMG]

    162 World Cup wins.
     
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  21. person s

    person s Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    I wonder whether the rules get manipulated that way in other olympic sports, summer and winter - just this case has been publicised
     
  22. person s

    person s Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Thatcher gave Zola Budd instant citizenship
    didn't pay off - she collided with Mary Decker, as I recall
     
  23. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    I can really see where skinavy is coming from. Plain fact is that those that just want to represent their country are in it for a different reason to those that are in it for themselves and their coaches.
     
  24. crackson

    crackson A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    Jumping nationality is a selection scam.

    Except for Kostya Tszyu. He is aussie.
     
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  25. crackson

    crackson A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    Something irks me about Vonn.

    My gut instinct thinks she is another Lance.

    :out:
     
  26. sly_karma

    sly_karma Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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    We are all disillusioned after Lance, and with the cash dangling out there for those who make it to the top of many sports, the possibility of athletes crossing the line is always there. But how exactly does one cheat in ski racing? Big strength helps, but it has to be applied with pinpoint control and coupled to otherworldly technical skills. Sure, DH athletes tend to be fairly burly types (and Lindsey is moderately large of frame for a woman), but by no means all of them are. The large radius turns and gliding in DH reward those who are patient and subtle on the edge and have a good feel for the ski on the snow. I don't think there's a drug that heightens those skills.

    It wouldn't surprise me if the odd ski racer gets caught with some steroids in their system, either from strength training in the off season or recovery from injury in midseason. Are those drugs an unfair advantage though?
     
  27. sly_karma

    sly_karma Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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  28. skinavy

    skinavy One of Us

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    Interestingly the article mentions Alain Baxter for taking methamphetamine, but fails to mention that it was proven it came from taking an over the counter Vicks inhalation that had a different formulation to the UK version he normally used and that he was given a 3 month ban that was then overturned on appeal.

    http://www.bbc.com/sport/winter-sports/35292538
     
  29. crackson

    crackson A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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  30. sly_karma

    sly_karma Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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    I'm guessing for the reasons my initial response listed - the view that skiing is a skill sport so drugs have little point. But it's also true that it's a very high intensity anaerobic effort, there's definitely stuff you can take to improve that...
     
  31. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    I think drugs would certainly help a top skier be even better, more strength for a downhiller would be gold, aerobic capacity for a GS skier, the list goes on.

    Look at the guys that have dominated downhill - Hermannator, Cuche, Svindal etc, all enormous animals.
     
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  32. crackson

    crackson A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    They should get up to speed on testing so there are no doubts ever. Not wait for a scandal.
     
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  33. sly_karma

    sly_karma Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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    Woohoo, she finally did it! Canada's Anne-Marie Gagnon stood atop a world cup podium at the alpine combined in Soldeu yesterday. She's had some good results this season in technicals but hadn't broken through until now.

    And Ms Vonn wins yet another speed event and closes in to within 10 of Stenmark's record. This despite crashing out of the previous day's SG and damaging her knee with a small fracture at the very top of the tibia. There's some gruesome selfie footage online of her having blood drawn from the knee to reduce swelling. Then she goes out and wins the next day and extends her lead on Lara Gut for the overall. We're a long way from the SI swimsuit issue, Toto.
     
  34. person s

    person s Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    there would have been testing pre, during and post Sochi?
     
  35. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    Presumably
     
  36. skinavy

    skinavy One of Us

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    Vonn didn't win, she came 13th and picked up 20 points, Gut was DNF.
     
  37. sly_karma

    sly_karma Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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    That was in the alpine combined. She won a standalone SG yesterday, also in Soldeu.
     
  38. Heinz

    Heinz Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Season over for Vonn. Closer examination of injury showed it was worse that initially diagnosed.
     
  39. person s

    person s Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    jeez, that's a bugger
    it's almost like we expect her to be indestructible
     
  40. Telemark Phat

    Telemark Phat Pass the butter Ski Pass: Gold

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    So she did not make a drama.
     
  41. kaegee

    kaegee One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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  42. kaegee

    kaegee One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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  43. Heinz

    Heinz Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Marcel Hirscher leading after the first run in the GS at Kranjska Gora. With a good result in the second run he can possibly claim both overall and GS World cup titles.
    Go Marcel!
     
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  44. Heinz

    Heinz Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    :woohoo: Marcel does it by over half a second!
     
  45. Heinz

    Heinz Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    So wins Giant Slalom World Cup and on top of that wins the overall title for the 5th time and in a row! :clap:
    Now equals Marc Girardelli with the most World Cup overall wins for the men. :thumbs:
     
    #445 Heinz, Mar 5, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2016
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  46. Heinz

    Heinz Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    and Girardelli calls him on Skype.
     
  47. person s

    person s Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    they need a special award for surviving the season
     
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  48. Heinz

    Heinz Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Marcel had that close call with that stupid drone
     
  49. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    We will see some good things coming from Henrik in the future.
     
  50. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    Yep it's been a war of attrition this year!