1. There's more to this forum than meets the eye!

    We have a vibrant community here conversing about all sorts of non-snow topics such as music, sport, politics and technology. Simply register to reveal all our Apr├Ęs topics.

    NOTE: This notice may be closed.

    Dismiss Notice

Poll 2015 poo thread

Discussion in 'Backcountry' started by Bloke, Sep 14, 2015.

Tags:
?

Kosi NP users: do you carry out your poo

  1. Yes, always

    26 vote(s)
    44.1%
  2. Mostly, unless i'm somewhere less frequently visited

    15 vote(s)
    25.4%
  3. No, that's gross!

    18 vote(s)
    30.5%
  1. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Messages:
    24,552
    Likes Received:
    19,885
    Location:
    Dubbo NSW
    Why is more visitors to the park a good thing for the park?

    The park is there as a reserve of land from which development is excluded or minimised so that animals and plants and stuff can do their thing.
     
  2. Moondog55

    Moondog55 One of Us

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2014
    Messages:
    1,979
    Likes Received:
    1,075
    Week-end or a few days maybe but what about those of us who do spent extended time OB and who also want to do the "right thing" and shopping bags are definitely NOT biodegradable and UV degrade over years not weeks
     
  3. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Messages:
    24,552
    Likes Received:
    19,885
    Location:
    Dubbo NSW
    You must have big shits. I reckon i could lay 20 into one bag and there'd still be room for more. How long are you planning on staying up that high?

    Bag ends up in a hole in the ground so who cares if it ever breaks down. This is about getting nutrient load out of a very small part of the country and putting it some place where it can be dealt with better.
     
    piolet likes this.
  4. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    41,844
    Likes Received:
    32,391
    Location:
    the sunny illawarra
    There are more visitors to the park. Is is good. They are at the PB tobogganing hill.
     
  5. Ubiquitous Steve

    Ubiquitous Steve Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    10,100
    Likes Received:
    4,276
    then I am happy cos my fellows humans are out experiencing the superb bush and can I say without thought of ridicule ..hey they are" enjoying themselves."....

    stop locking up the state for your own selfish purposes bears are squealing in the background...

    are you advocating winding back the hands of time here....
    its 2015 my man......you have got to move with the times..

    Repeat after me...."people in national parks are good "...
    lots of folk good but dispersed best of all...you don't have a right to dictate to others about what they want...

    a couple of huts and dunnies and fireplaces and people having"fun" is just too much for your greenie mentality????:):):):)
     
    rM788 likes this.
  6. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    41,844
    Likes Received:
    32,391
    Location:
    the sunny illawarra
    LOL

    'Locking up' by not installing dunnies huts and firewood. Ya killin me!

    Jeezys. Sounds like 95% of places on my bucket list are locked up.
     
    piolet and Telemark Phat like this.
  7. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    41,844
    Likes Received:
    32,391
    Location:
    the sunny illawarra
    Actually the funniest thing is calling SB a follower of 'Greeny Mentality'.
     
  8. Angus_McCrory

    Angus_McCrory Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2005
    Messages:
    24,023
    Likes Received:
    12,013
    Location:
    Lurking
    Steve, there is no locking up, just that the condition of entry dictates that visitors tread lightly. And that means no camping in catchments, no high alpine huts and carrying everything possible out, including poo.
     
    skifree likes this.
  9. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    41,844
    Likes Received:
    32,391
    Location:
    the sunny illawarra
    "I want to go somewhere but it's hard, make it easy for me please"
     
    sidetrack, DJM, Telemark Phat and 2 others like this.
  10. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    19,967
    Likes Received:
    21,983
    Location:
    Canberra
    I feel like an Alpine Sphagnum Bog
     
    piolet likes this.
  11. Ubiquitous Steve

    Ubiquitous Steve Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    10,100
    Likes Received:
    4,276
    so lets get this straight...when the Main Range Warriors come to Feathertop or Bogong they refuse to use our dunnies and huts and see every body that does as some lower form of life....and its a serious issue cos "new people are coming to check out the mountain and try out their skills in the mountains"

    so climberman do you come up to Main Range via Hannels Spur the hard way or do u catch the chairlift/skitube or drive to Perisher and park....and then the approach is pretty god dam easy across a few gentle hills and across a few creeks..
    its pretty easy thanks to the road and ski resort etc.....
    man u have already got it easy..... I was hoping that u would earn those turns by at least doing it from Geehi Flats...

    so how do u guys lower yourself to come to Bogong....and Feathertop with the peasants and their huts and their fires....

    and their dreaded dunnies

    maybe some of us are not on an ego trip pretending that's its hard cos last time I looked at contour map Kosy was like around 2,000m and every other peak below...

    man your lost in the past.....let me say there is is nothing tough about being up in the mountains ....a luxury of warm jackets,sleeping bags ,mats .tents,stoves etc etc.... everything is high tech ..numerous posts in forums outlining the best gear to buy.... your no better than the next person ...and your abilities are no better than anybody else...:deadhorse:
     
  12. Ubiquitous Steve

    Ubiquitous Steve Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    10,100
    Likes Received:
    4,276
    right there........ the animals are certainly doing their own things pigs,raindeer foxes cats wild dogs,horses..like the animals are out of control...

    and weeds seen in no short supply.. yep fauna/flora certainly doing their own things..
    pity that indigenous species cannot keep up with all the action....

    is that why we have Parks.....that's so old school its not funny...

    Try again>>>>> people are good and we like to see them in our national parks.....

    green fundamentalists are bad there is no doubt.....:cry:
     
  13. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Messages:
    24,552
    Likes Received:
    19,885
    Location:
    Dubbo NSW

    You seem a bit confused. You've just pointed out all the infrastructure that currently exists to make it relatively easy to access the main range for skiing. Noone is saying it is hard. We are just saying it doesn't need to get any easier.
     
  14. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Messages:
    24,552
    Likes Received:
    19,885
    Location:
    Dubbo NSW



    NPWS have been trying to advocate culling of ferals in KNP for years. It's not the greenies that are against the idea. It is the horsey people that won't let them do that.
     
    #364 Snow Blowey, Sep 28, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 29, 2015
    SkiMountaineer and Majikthise like this.
  15. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    19,967
    Likes Received:
    21,983
    Location:
    Canberra
    I think Steve is fully aware and advocates a low impact desirability on the MR. He just has different ideas on how to achieve it, and is entitled to voice them. In the end though I think we need to settle on general consensus
     
    Majikthise and skifree like this.
  16. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    41,844
    Likes Received:
    32,391
    Location:
    the sunny illawarra
    I dunno if you understand this forum :p
     
  17. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    19,967
    Likes Received:
    21,983
    Location:
    Canberra
    No. I just argue for the sake of arguement
     
    Majikthise likes this.
  18. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    41,844
    Likes Received:
    32,391
    Location:
    the sunny illawarra
    Phew, you've got it :)
     
  19. Ubiquitous Steve

    Ubiquitous Steve Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    10,100
    Likes Received:
    4,276
    general consensus....OMG...nothing is ever worse than the general consensus...

    like minded folk encouraged to maintain the status quo by peer group pressure...

    lets argue the benefits or otherwise of Lake Albina Hut...

    cos if it still stood then more folk would be staying down there and with modern techniques pollution apsects could be delt with..so the masses or many of them staying or camped beside Lake Albina Hut////

    now no need to tell me its a glacial lake and camping is not permitted...but supposing it still existed...

    a major area for camping maximizing turds into a safe haven..

    and I am not buying that we don't have technology to treat effluent totally....
    so a hut with dunny and many folk all doing the right thing and crapping at the installation....or helicoptor out waste from here
    so much crap concentrated on one area...

    and is cost prohibitive.?....then what of Vic and its dunnies serviced by helicoptors they seem to get buy within the budget..

    no not dunnies spring up all over the place but a couple in good locations....

    U guys see everything like the deck of cards...one falls over and the whole pack then has to go likewise...

    no controlled camping where effluent is properly handled.....

    When I travel to the West Kiewa the former gold battery has special ponds and other goodes:love: to take care of dangerous products from the extraction process...and is heavily policed by Mines Dept etc....and guess what it works like clockwork every body happy...

    so u try to tell me that a dunny cannot be made to work in the Main Range because of this that or the other...
    any excuse is good enough for the boys and the status quo is maintained....all things new on Main Range must be opposed and ruled out cos that's your mindset.....yes form a consensus based on obtuse thinking....it wouldnot matter what anybody proposed u guys would oppose it....

    no wonder I need rum and coke ....its like dealing with folk that are on a parallel trajectory....hey u guys are so fixed in your ways.....:love:

    The SM project has some gifted people working in earlier years....they made tunnels ,dams.aquaducts roads and generating stations...

    hey and KNP cannot even get a dunny to work at Rawsons Pass 24/7
    and like Seamans Hut well KNP will have devised a strategy by 2040 if we are lucky...

    Pioneers had vision,ability and talent what ever happened to it all...cos now u got to wonder...yep Team Bears seeing 2040 as the likely start up date for a Seamans Hut strategy study.....
     
    #369 Ubiquitous Steve, Sep 28, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2015
  20. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    41,844
    Likes Received:
    32,391
    Location:
    the sunny illawarra
    I don't think anyone is saying it can't happen. I think they are reading the tea leaves and saying it won't happen, at least not quickly. Anyway, thats's what i'm saying.
     
  21. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Messages:
    24,552
    Likes Received:
    19,885
    Location:
    Dubbo NSW
    It is refreshing to read your flexible views also steve.
     
  22. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    19,967
    Likes Received:
    21,983
    Location:
    Canberra
    Im staying in a hut thurs night ( not MR ) so guess im out of the Boys club. No dunny there though.
     
  23. Ubiquitous Steve

    Ubiquitous Steve Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    10,100
    Likes Received:
    4,276
    so lets see we have geological time which is pretty slow I gather and our visionaries in KNP that also have their own version...:thumbs:

    actually my views are flexible and I take note when somebody does some thing bright...

    Team Bears suggest that the Main Range Warriors wait till a thunderstorm fires up over the area and then go hold up your ice axes on Mt Carruthers ..we are hoping that a severe electrical shock will bolster mental energies so that the group think consensual thinking is challenged and debunked.....o_O...
     
  24. Ubiquitous Steve

    Ubiquitous Steve Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    10,100
    Likes Received:
    4,276
    well that's good... no doubt u have lots of gopro footage to edit but remember to restock with firewood unless your on natural gas.....

    must have been a lot of Main Range Warriors up Eskdale lately as firewood has diminished but "maybe they are putting the firewood back in the bush" just to be annoying little pricks..

    hey they probably been pulling sleeping folk out of the huts and given them a Main Range Big Boys talk about being wimps...LOL
     
  25. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    19,967
    Likes Received:
    21,983
    Location:
    Canberra
    Gopro ? not this little black duck. Firewood? Will leave plenty and possibly burn a bit to go with my Tawny Port. Should I dig a deep pit and put up sign saying toilet this way or let folks pick their own random locations /
     
    Ubiquitous Steve likes this.
  26. Rimey

    Rimey One of Us

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2010
    Messages:
    1,652
    Likes Received:
    1,056
    Location:
    The modest end of the Great Divide
    No. But you'll need to rig up a handrail. Give us gimps a go. I'm a certified one 'till 2017.
     
    Kletterer likes this.
  27. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Messages:
    24,552
    Likes Received:
    19,885
    Location:
    Dubbo NSW
    Oh Steve. Stocking huts up with wood so you can whinge about people using it.

    You provide a level of service (pre-stacked firewood) at the huts. People arrive to a stocked hut and get the feeling that stacking the hut with wood is someone elses job. They burn the wood and feel its not their job to replace what they burnt. Steve whinges.
     
    sidetrack likes this.
  28. Rimey

    Rimey One of Us

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2010
    Messages:
    1,652
    Likes Received:
    1,056
    Location:
    The modest end of the Great Divide
    Steve feels entitled ...
     
    sidetrack likes this.
  29. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    19,967
    Likes Received:
    21,983
    Location:
    Canberra
    All that money spent on paving the track to Balor hut ( 6 km ) and no dunny, rails, pedalcar ?
     
  30. Moondog55

    Moondog55 One of Us

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2014
    Messages:
    1,979
    Likes Received:
    1,075
    Been a long while since I was in KNP [ Albina hut was still being used and camping was still allowed at Blue Lake] but my last trip there was 7 weeks above the snowline and I care if it breaks down or not, plastic does not belong in a hole in the ground if it isn't biodegradable
     
  31. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Messages:
    24,552
    Likes Received:
    19,885
    Location:
    Dubbo NSW

    Whether the bag is biodegradable or not it's going to end up as waste and in this country we bury waste. So whether it stays as plastic under the ground, or breaks up into small pieces of plastic under the ground it will suffer the same fate. It will end up in the ground.

    What do you do with all your old camping and skiing gear when its done? Biodegradable pack? Biodegradable merino thermals? Biodegradable Goretex? What's natural? Why is plastic made from fossil oils different to that made from non-fossil oil? It's all just carbons and hydrogens bound together whether it grew in a swamp 100 million years ago or on a corn crop yesterday.
     
  32. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    May 12, 2000
    Messages:
    80,277
    Likes Received:
    53,561
    Location:
    Les Hautes Montagnes
    That's the feeling I got at Michell on the weekend - someone actually mentioned how much wood there was earlier in the year and mistakenly thought it was PV providing it.

    There was barely a stick when we arrived, we cut quite a bit that night and other groups took over for the following nights, more than enough was left on Sunday for a party to light a fire in inclement conditions but I wonder if leaving more than that is counterproductive?
     
    sidetrack likes this.
  33. telecrag

    telecrag Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2007
    Messages:
    30,102
    Likes Received:
    41,891
    Most huts are made out of wood, so in an emergency you could just burn the hut down.
     
    Rimey, sidetrack and DJM like this.
  34. Telemark Phat

    Telemark Phat Pass the butter Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2008
    Messages:
    19,462
    Likes Received:
    16,647
    Location:
    Jindabyne
    The problem with you're position US is that its an emotional and not a rational one (like every other position on this issue). You clearly display this by using ad-hominem attacks against anyone with a differing position. If you want to convince anyone here that your management choices are the best you're going to have to do a lot more than fling insults.
     
    sidetrack and DJM like this.
  35. coolair

    coolair One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2007
    Messages:
    945
    Likes Received:
    1,316
    Location:
    NSW
    US, love the work you do, always read your posts, late August I made the Thredbo - Kosi pilgrimage, I made sure things where empty before I left, should I have been stuck over night I had a plastic bag . On this trip I did not see even yellow snow, four weeks beforehand in Blue Gum forest/ acacia flat there was heli lifted in dunnys, but there was still shit & paper within 1m of the track with in 80m of the dunny.
    The dunny was disgusting I would rather poo in a bag, It was possible animal attack at the that made the mess in the heli loo, but it was fresh human mess with paper along the track.
    Some people dropa load and don't give a shit.
    It would have been a 3-4 m dig to access the Rawsons pass dunny. porta loo could be half buried over night, people wont dig access through 1m of wind blown for a crap in a blizzard., after the blizzard the doors frozen shut ,no one can smash the ice to open the door, does not get used.
    Education in places like this , eco tourisim sites ect will be the only way.
     
    Untele-whippet and Angus_McCrory like this.
  36. AndrewA

    AndrewA One of Us

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2012
    Messages:
    722
    Likes Received:
    628
    Location:
    Melbourne
    Re firewood in huts like Michell's - maybe a simple sign saying something like " please replace any wood you burn for the next person who might need it more than you". I wouldn't be surprised that some visitors might think that wood was provided as some Govt incentive/whatever.

    I do however feel that the stove in Michell's is a unnecessary luxury - for those rare hypothermic folk visiting, maybe a few chemical hot packs and some fleece blankets could stay in an "emergency use only" box in the hut.

    But I digress from dunnies. I'd rather bag it and carry it than use a drop dunny with turds and toilet paper blocking the entrance hole ( yep, I've poked a few of these down with a stick over the years - made me wonder whether someone would leave their home toilet with turd all over the bowl), and that horrible E. coli replete moisture that builds up under the seat.

    A
     
  37. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Messages:
    24,552
    Likes Received:
    19,885
    Location:
    Dubbo NSW
    And when people know there is a toilet where they are going they won't take anything to deal with the eventuality that the toilet may be out of service. Just drop it on the ground near the out of service loo for the NPWS crew to deal with. Afterall they failed to keep the loo in service so it's their fault. A bit like people who drop rubbish bags on the ground next to the full to overflowing bin.
     
    Rimey and Angus_McCrory like this.
  38. AndrewA

    AndrewA One of Us

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2012
    Messages:
    722
    Likes Received:
    628
    Location:
    Melbourne
    Nimwits. All of them.
     
  39. sidetrack

    sidetrack One of Us

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2005
    Messages:
    3,186
    Likes Received:
    545
    Location:
    Sunbury
    quite possibly the most intelligent post in this tread.
     
  40. Angus_McCrory

    Angus_McCrory Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2005
    Messages:
    24,023
    Likes Received:
    12,013
    Location:
    Lurking
    And coffee drinkers should be banned as well.....

     
    Snow Blowey, skifree and Kletterer like this.
  41. skifree

    skifree A disciple of the blessed avi giraffe Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 1998
    Messages:
    28,492
    Likes Received:
    24,249
    Location:
    Middle Oz
    Speak for yourself big A, this example is exactly why I moved to instant (you know God did not strike me down, odd but true) coffee. So there is no solid waste apart what I'm already dealing with. A sacrifice, but something had to be done.
     
    Angus_McCrory likes this.
  42. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Messages:
    24,552
    Likes Received:
    19,885
    Location:
    Dubbo NSW
    You sure it's still "solid" after you've been drinking that stuff?
     
    skifree likes this.
  43. telecrag

    telecrag Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2007
    Messages:
    30,102
    Likes Received:
    41,891
    Ah mate, that was sarcasm. I like huts, and would like to see suitable facilities at all huts.
     
    Untele-whippet likes this.
  44. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    41,844
    Likes Received:
    32,391
    Location:
    the sunny illawarra
  45. telecrag

    telecrag Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2007
    Messages:
    30,102
    Likes Received:
    41,891
    Including a kebab van.
     
  46. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Messages:
    24,552
    Likes Received:
    19,885
    Location:
    Dubbo NSW

    If you didn't want to stay at huts and have fires in them you may enjoy yourself more. Seems to big your major source of angst when posting in here. Rules around huts and fires in huts. Looking at the hierarchy of controls elimination is at the top. Get rid of huts and fires and your problems go away.
     
  47. telecrag

    telecrag Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2007
    Messages:
    30,102
    Likes Received:
    41,891
    But to counter that, dont let anyone in the parks, and ALL your problems go away.

    I want my cake and eat it too. All huts should have loos and plenty of informational signage. They are a spot where beginners go, and that is a chance to edumacate. Maybe some sort of information on volunteer or sponsorship too.

    I dont use them much anymore, but have many times over the years, and had some great experiences.

    Had a bit of trouble trying to replenish the wood at Seamans, one time, that was an epic story that never happened.
     
  48. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    41,844
    Likes Received:
    32,391
    Location:
    the sunny illawarra
    These pretzels are making me thirsty!
     
    telecrag likes this.
  49. Telemark Phat

    Telemark Phat Pass the butter Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2008
    Messages:
    19,462
    Likes Received:
    16,647
    Location:
    Jindabyne
    No soup for you!
     
    telecrag likes this.
  50. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    41,844
    Likes Received:
    32,391
    Location:
    the sunny illawarra