Bushfire 2020-2021 fire season

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beard stroker
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Jul 13, 2006
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First ping of the season
29AB6FE9-2205-41B0-9C25-9A2B992DF726.png
 
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sbm_

One of Us
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Dec 10, 2017
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Terry Hills RFS doing a set of pretty aggressive hazard reduction burns on the Sydney northern beaches this weekend - 27 degrees today and a sea breeze.
 

KylePee

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Terry Hills RFS doing a set of pretty aggressive hazard reduction burns on the Sydney northern beaches this weekend - 27 degrees today and a sea breeze.
Often have issues in Northern Beaches district with fuel moisture and local climate that prevent burns from being feasible. They have to account for the weather and fuel moisture
 
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Donza

Dogs body...
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Apr 21, 2004
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Heathcote Watch and Act. Hazard Reduction has spotted across the highway and taken off. LAT heading in for a drop.
Yup.
Traffic heading home from down the coast heavily affected.
 

KylePee

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Yup.
Traffic heading home from down the coast heavily affected.
Looked at some of the details. Sounds like the traffic has been affected all day, due to crew safety for the burning, and now due to the increased activity. 7news helicopter live streaming

1 LAT drop completed. Birddog still over the fire, so expect another one
 
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Donza

Dogs body...
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Looked at some of the details. Sounds like the traffic has been affected all day, due to crew safety for the burning, and now due to the increased activity. 7news helicopter live streaming

1 LAT drop completed. Birddog still over the fire, so expect another one
Screenshot_2020-10-10-17-31-26-76.png
 

Stephen Allen

Addicted
Jun 17, 2014
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Given the wind and humidity forecast, WTF did RFS and NPWS conduct the burn Sat 10 Sept. Winds at nearest weather station (ANSTO) gusted upto 50klm. I sometimes wonder their thoughtfulness.
 

Longys

Hard Yards
Jul 9, 2019
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Another controlled burn lost. I'm not against controlled burning, but sooner or later somebody is going to have to step up and take responsibility for these things.
 

KylePee

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Inspector Scott Deller
Introducing fire into the landscape is inherently risky, particularly as we head towards the warmer part of the year.
When implementing such activities, multiple controls are applied both in the planning and implementation stage, to reduce and manage the risk.

One of the main controls utilised is referred to as a ‘prescription’. A prescription is a set of conditions or parameters that provide limits or thresholds on whether an activity should proceed or not, based on expected fire behaviour.
A burn prescription often includes parameters such as fuel dryness, in addition to diurnal weather conditions peaks and troughs, such as temperature, humidity, wind direction and strength.

Choosing a prescription is a complex mix of the right ingredients - with flexibility applied by balancing and offsetting various conditions, which are highly variable.
An example of flexibility is burning when conditions are windy, but only if fuels are moist and the fuel load are light.
If fuels loads are high and conditions are dry, you need to be more cautious, particularly with lower humidity and changes in wind strength.

Another important component when introducing fire into the landscape, is how the fire is ignited. Lighting a line of fire will result in fire reaching its intensity and rate of spread quickly, where if multiple spots are introduced instead, it will spread slower.
Looking at recent events locally, there will be be community scrutiny surrounding the safe implementation of hazard reduction burning, as there should be!

In any event when things don’t go to plan, it will be subject to review by the various agencies who participated. The aim of which is to understand what occurred and to ensure that reoccurrence is avoided in the future.
A week ago a hazard reduction burn was implemented at Woronora Heights, where crews worked hard to get it to burn, a week later, a hazard reduction escapes with conditions more akin to a summer wildfire.
It is a timely reminder, despite being in a La-Nina year, that fires in the landscape can still be problematic.
 

Longys

Hard Yards
Jul 9, 2019
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Glenmore Park
Good to see it will be reviewed and accountability will take place. Clearly with the fire behaviour on the weekend the prescription was wrong.
 

sbm_

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Dec 10, 2017
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Another hazard reduction burn escaped containment in North Sydney today. Rain is forecast tonight and tomorrow though so it doesn't sound like it's much of a concern.
 
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_Yossarian_

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I don't think the fire agencies and Bureau have the requisite scientific understanding, technologies, and procedures in place to conduct spring hazard burns in our new climate.

One got away in Tasmania a few weekends ago near St Helens
 
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KylePee

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Ripped from Facebook:
Credit to Jordan Blake

9F267015-97FD-4014-9BA4-26AFA6ABCBFA.jpeg
Good location for spectacular photos. I have seen plenty from crews. Typical of this coastal heath, plenty of flame, but they contained it with a secondary line and most of the activity seen was from the backburn put in to contain the extension. Focus was on looking after the historical assets in the area
 

_Yossarian_

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Undies

Pizza!
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Anyone see the ABC show last night on extreme weather or whatever it was called? With that dude from the Chaser. Some amazing footage, and more than a little terrifying in general!
 

KylePee

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Anyone see the ABC show last night on extreme weather or whatever it was called? With that dude from the Chaser. Some amazing footage, and more than a little terrifying in general!
Yeah I mentioned in the other 20/21 fire thread. Is mostly quite good, though the usual dose of misunderstanding, or completely incorrect information. I was on a few strike teams with Mullins, he is a good guy to have on the ground, with just a little bit of experience :)

My favourite was the claim that the woman at a local fire brigade who runs their facebook page, was responsible for triggering the emergency alerts including SMS etc. I can assure everyone that is is a much more stringent process! And some of the other footage from the state control centre showed a couple of the guys who are often in that role, and at the time appeared to be posting either an emergency alert or major fire update
 

Seafm

Too far from the snow
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Jun 5, 2014
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Thankfully North Queensland doesn't get massive bushfires like you southern folk have to contend with. This is in the hills behind Trinity Beach near me. It started Thursday afternoon just below the abandoned building at the top of the ridge and has basically soldered away to the right and left from where it started. No threat at all to life and property so I think the firies are just going to let it burn itself out.
20201024_113451.jpg
 

KylePee

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Today 27/10 is the anniversary of the Gospers Mountain fire ignition.
We were driving home over Mt Lambie when wifey looked north and said WTF is that?!
And already Sydney fairies had been deployed to the north of the state for some time. I was helping a friend in Port Macquarie keep up to date with fire threatening her fathers house. The funny part being that he is a senior volunteer and was tied up, so the kids were in charge and not sure of what was going on. What a past 12 months we’ve had.
 
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Untele-whippet

beard stroker
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Can’t imagine the impact for you of not only the result, but how long the worry was there for
Almost 2 months waiting and watching.
Thx to RFS and you for great intel!
Too much rain this week for the rebuild, so different to last year, yet overall, arctic sea ice hasn’t started to form this year yet, the latest in recorded history......
 

KylePee

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Almost 2 months waiting and watching.
Thx to RFS and you for great intel!
Too much rain this week for the rebuild, so different to last year, yet overall, arctic sea ice hasn’t started to form this year yet, the latest in recorded history......
Do you have shed access yet, or is it all locked off as a building site?
 

Seafm

Too far from the snow
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Jun 5, 2014
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Shed almost finished to lockup, hopefully next week and then we can start to store some stuff in it. Will be sharing the space with the builder.
We were building a house in Mareeba some years ago and rented the house next door. I'd known the builder as a work customer for many years, he still hated the fact that we were there 24/7 watching over himLOL
 

KylePee

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Marysville tip on fire yesterday.
Today 2 fires in Narby - one 2km to the east (campfire escape?), the other in the southern part of Narby (burnoff that got away). Both still out of control.
So many out camping, boatin, fishin last weekend when I drove around it's not a surprise that something could go wrong. Was damp in the morning but surprised how dry across the ranges up high
 

teckel

"I'm not a cat"
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Confirmed.The one just east of Narby was a campfire. The culprits left in such a hurry, they even left their trailer behind. LOL Hopefully they can track them down from that.

The other one in Narby was a bloke (weekender) burning a hedgerow from about a hectare of what I understand to be illegally felled trees (apparently to create a firebreak) that got out of control.
 

Artisan

Hard Yards
Dec 8, 2020
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Artisan, Ken explained that it was One of the earliest starts to the fire season on record. And the record specifically refers to the modern record of reliable meteorological data that can be used to objectively analyse fire weather risk. Finding a newspaper report of earlier extreme fires (which may or may not be exaggerated) in no way invalidates this.

Michael, this idea of a particular date for a fire season seems to me is a recent invention, it is not something I ever heard around the farm areas until the last ten years or so. I suspect it is an artefact of our computer era where outputs of wx ‘models’ for public consumption need a set date - hence my question to Ken Kato to get a gist of it.

Re the historical use of the term ‘fire season’. Reading the few Trove articles that mention the term ‘fire season’ do not mention a start date as such. The impression I get from reading the old timer reporters in Trove is when a bush fire is seen it is now fire season.

My closer look at the recent focus on the use of ‘fire season’ as a metric to determine if a fire should or should not be burning relates directly to the focus on fuel load aspect that Ken argues against. From what I can see, if there is a high fuel load then the potential for a fire is there at any time of the year, it don’t matter what yer computer model tells you.

When dealing with bush fire risk using fuel load as the main metric, not the only metric, puts the onus back onto the relevant government officials and departments to properly attend to bush fire control. The current use of climate as the main metric allows incompetent do-nothing government officials and departments to hand-wave blame to the climate.



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Tweekin

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Sep 29, 2016
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Michael, this idea of a particular date for a fire season seems to me is a recent invention, it is not something I ever heard around the farm areas until the last ten years or so. I suspect it is an artefact of our computer era where outputs of wx ‘models’ for public consumption need a set date - hence my question to Ken Kato to get a gist of it.

Re the historical use of the term ‘fire season’. Reading the few Trove articles that mention the term ‘fire season’ do not mention a start date as such. The impression I get from reading the old timer reporters in Trove is when a bush fire is seen it is now fire season.

My closer look at the recent focus on the use of ‘fire season’ as a metric to determine if a fire should or should not be burning relates directly to the focus on fuel load aspect that Ken argues against. From what I can see, if there is a high fuel load then the potential for a fire is there at any time of the year, it don’t matter what yer computer model tells you.

When dealing with bush fire risk using fuel load as the main metric, not the only metric, puts the onus back onto the relevant government officials and departments to properly attend to bush fire control. The current use of climate as the main metric allows incompetent do-nothing government officials and departments to hand-wave blame to the climate.



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I would suggest fire season relates to the bushfire danger period which around here runs from October to march . During this period you need a permit to burn due to heightened fire risk
 

Artisan

Hard Yards
Dec 8, 2020
487
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North West of Brisbane

I hadn’t seen that globalfiredata.org site before. Looks interesting.

Looks like the ‘data’ goes back about 20 years. Wonder why only 20 years? Satellites been around since the 1970’s - thats how the largest known fire in Oz recorded history were identified.

I would suspect the ‘data’ available would change as technologies changes.

Edit: Been looking further at globalfiredata.com and it would appear they exclude small area fires from certain data sets? I have not yet found what they define as small fires.

Further edit: Did a search of the people running the globalfiredata web site and see it one of those CO2 scam sites. I would put a very high credibility risk factor to any of the sites info.




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Chookfooter

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I would suggest fire season relates to the bushfire danger period which around here runs from October to march . During this period you need a permit to burn due to heightened fire risk
In NSW the fire season is the time of year when you need a permit to have a fire, and it runs from the start of October to the end of March. If conditions dictate, this can be extended, but requires government approval. Extensions are done on a shire basis, so if the northern Monaro is in the middle of a drought and a hot windy September is predicted the season is extended for the whole Snowy Monaro shire, even if we are under a metre of snow. The same applies to the daily fire danger ratings, if it is hot and windy at Bredbo they may call a High Fire Danger even though it could be pouring rain here. It seems to me that these area boundaries should have stayed as they were before the merger, but that horse has long bolted.
 
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