Travel Life 2021/2022 - Canada Plans

sly_karma

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Backward steps for BC on the Covid road. Surging new cases among the unvaxed in the interior and so we are back to mask order again. Appears to be having the desired affect in the central Okanagan where the acceleration has slowed. 90% of covid patients in hospital and ICU are unvaxed.

The BC govt announced a week ago that a vaccine passport system will be in force by October, required for most non essential activities such as restaurants, pubs, gyms, theaters, sporting events, etc. With BC and most other provinces closing in on 80% fully vaxed, there is good support in the community for the passport, both as a reward for the vaccinated and an incentive to the unvaxed. In the week following the announcement there was a strong surge of first shots and bookings for upcoming shots. Seems like we may get to 90% of eligible population vaxed and only the actual resisters left to their own devices. Still, that is around half a million people, easily enough to overwhelm the system and cause great upheaval if left unchecked, as many think should happen.
 

SnowRabbit

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Backward steps for BC on the Covid road. Surging new cases among the unvaxed in the interior and so we are back to mask order again. Appears to be having the desired affect in the central Okanagan where the acceleration has slowed. 90% of covid patients in hospital and ICU are unvaxed.

The BC govt announced a week ago that a vaccine passport system will be in force by October, required for most non essential activities such as restaurants, pubs, gyms, theaters, sporting events, etc. With BC and most other provinces closing in on 80% fully vaxed, there is good support in the community for the passport, both as a reward for the vaccinated and an incentive to the unvaxed. In the week following the announcement there was a strong surge of first shots and bookings for upcoming shots. Seems like we may get to 90% of eligible population vaxed and only the actual resisters left to their own devices. Still, that is around half a million people, easily enough to overwhelm the system and cause great upheaval if left unchecked, as many think should happen.
Here in Australia we here the term eligible population. What does the term mean in the Canadian context.
 

Chalkie

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Here in Australia we here the term eligible population. What does the term mean in the Canadian context.

Those eligible to receive a vaccination in Canada are anyone aged 12+.

This is the 2020 age distribution of the Canadian population:

Canada Population 2020.jpg


Assuming that there's an even spread in each year of the 10-14 cohort, there are approximately 32.75 million Canadians who are eligible to receive the Covid-19 vaccine.
 
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Chalkie

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That's weird considering they didn't fly that route pre Covid.

Qantas has flown SYD-YVR on and off for years. It's been a regular scheduled service via Honolulu using 767s (I flew it in the 1990s), and a regular and seasonal service (winter/summer) using 747s (I flew that once or twice in the 2000s, but switched to Air New Zealand as I loathe doing an international transit through Sydney and preferred that I could fly YVR-AKL-MEL very seamlessly (and more comfortably; the 747s QF was operating on SYD-YVR were ancient) with NZ. I think that the choice of YVR as a "re-opening" destination for QF has been driven by lots of considerations:

- Canada may be regarded as a Covid safe destination and CA will recognise AU vaccinations and vice-versa, so Australians will be fairly readily be able to go there
- taking advantage of pent up demand for overseas ski travel and Canada's a better placed candidate for 21-22 NH winter than other places
- taking advantage of pent up demand for overseas travel generally (see the first item in the list)
- there's freight opportunities
- the 787 is way more cost effective to operate than the 747s which used to ply this route for QF
- many other former QF routes won't return in any hurry or will be severely cut back (eg, some North American and South American routes; China routes (including Hong Kong - Qantas has closed its lounge there)

It will be interesting to see whether SYD-YVR survives any length of time as a regular service. I've booked my Mum on a QF Syd-Yvr flight in April 2022 so she can come and visit. I have my fingers and toes crossed it happens and survives at least until then.
 

SnowRabbit

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Qantas has flown SYD-YVR on and off for years. It's been a regular scheduled service via Honolulu using 767s (I flew it in the 1990s), and a regular and seasonal service (winter/summer) using 747s (I flew that once or twice in the 2000s, but switched to Air New Zealand as I loathe doing an international transit through Sydney and preferred that I could fly YVR-AKL-MEL very seamlessly (and more comfortably; the 747s QF was operating on SYD-YVR were ancient) with NZ. I think that the choice of YVR as a "re-opening" destination for QF has been driven by lots of considerations:

- Canada may be regarded as a Covid safe destination and CA will recognise AU vaccinations and vice-versa, so Australians will be fairly readily be able to go there
- taking advantage of pent up demand for overseas ski travel and Canada's a better placed candidate for 21-22 NH winter than other places
- taking advantage of pent up demand for overseas travel generally (see the first item in the list)
- there's freight opportunities
- the 787 is way more cost effective to operate than the 747s which used to ply this route for QF
- many other former QF routes won't return in any hurry or will be severely cut back (eg, some North American and South American routes; China routes (including Hong Kong - Qantas has closed its lounge there)

It will be interesting to see whether SYD-YVR survives any length of time as a regular service. I've booked my Mum on a QF Syd-Yvr flight in April 2022 so she can come and visit. I have my fingers and toes crossed it happens and survives at least until then.
If I remember correctly (and I'm getting old and the memory's not the best these days) the Qantas flights to Vancouver via HNL back then - 1990s - were code shares with Canadian. The Qantas planes didn't actually continue on to YVR.
 
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Telezacski

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They are just flying places they think have a good chance of actually happening, UK, USA, Canada, Japan, NZ etc They have flown to YVR seasonally the last few years. They did it in the old 747’s, now retired
Add to that demand they know people will want to ski or have a white xmas
 

Chalkie

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If I remember correctly (and I'm getting old and the memory's not the best these days) the Qantas flights to Vancouver via HNL back then - 1990s - were code shares with Canadian. The Qantas planes didn't actually continue on to YVR.

Nope - QF operated its own metal all the way to YVR via HNL.
 

Crystal

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I'm happy to book if there is home Q. But I guess the issue for me is the shotgun changes they make. If I know I can get home with XX hoops I have to jump through, fine. It's the unexpected changes they make that shits me. I don't want to spend a whole holiday checking the freaking Gov websites that are always a couple of days behind anyway.
 

Roymond

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I'm happy to book if there is home Q. But I guess the issue for me is the shotgun changes they make. If I know I can get home with XX hoops I have to jump through, fine. It's the unexpected changes they make that shits me. I don't want to spend a whole holiday checking the freaking Gov websites that are always a couple of days behind anyway.
Agree completely @Crystal

As I've said a couple of times- we were in Snowmass at the time of the international border closure last year in March.
The stress and expense in changing flights and getting away quickly makes me very wary of any holidays without govt guarantees about border closures.

Life is too short to choose to be stressed.
 

Telezacski

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Agree completely @Crystal

As I've said a couple of times- we were in Snowmass at the time of the international border closure last year in March.
The stress and expense in changing flights and getting away quickly makes me very wary of any holidays without govt guarantees about border closures.

Life is too short to choose to be stressed.
This^^^^

whilst not o/s I was in QLD at xmas and was caught up in the QLD 3 day lockdown then the ACT closed borders and a cyclone.

luckily the 3 days I spent re jigging things I was in lockdown on the farm so their wasn’t much to do anyway.

either way it wasn’t fun
 
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gareth_oau

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I'm very confident that, when they do open international travel (Nov, Dec?), the fully vaxxed will be traveling, skiing, and returning to, at worst, home quarantine (until you return a negative test or two). I'd put my house on their being no requirement for hotel quarantine.
the problem will occur if your home is also resident to others that havent travelled and will therefore need to quarantine with you.

And of course there's always a proportion of people who cant be trusted to quarantine when at home
 

sly_karma

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As the delta variant becomes ubiquitous and with most of Canada past or approaching 80% vaxed, I'm starting to think we're not finished with the pandemic until more or less all of us have contracted covid. We are seeing lots of new cases and the authorities are terming this the fourth wave, but over 90% of those in hospital and ICU are unvaxed. Viral load is far higher in delta so plenty of vaxed people are being infected but not getting very sick.

I think now it is a game of let everyone catch the virus over time but keep the brakes on so the hospital system can stay within capacity. No lockdown, just masking order for indoors seems to be enough to prevent exponential growth. Vax passport being introduced to facilitate gatherings as weather cools and people move indoors and closer together - and to incent the reluctant to get their shots.
 

Wardy

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the problem will occur if your home is also resident to others that havent travelled and will therefore need to quarantine with you.

And of course there's always a proportion of people who cant be trusted to quarantine when at home
I don't think it will matter. In a 'living with Covid' world, traveling OS - where you might be exposed to and catch the virus - is the same as traveling down to the shops - where you might be exposed to and catch the virus. You won't have to quarantine when you get back from the shops, so why from OS? I concede that for OS travel they may not apply that simple logic, but it does apply.
 
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gareth_oau

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I don't think it will matter. In a 'living with Covid' world, traveling OS - where you might be exposed to and catch the virus - is the same as traveling down to the shops - where you might be exposed to and catch the virus. You won't have to quarantine when you get back from the shops, so why from OS? I concede that for OS travel they may not apply that simple logic, but it does apply.
I agree. Once international borders are open there shouldn’t be a need for isolation. I was merely responding to an an earler comment about onging home quarantine
 
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Telezacski

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I don't think it will matter. In a 'living with Covid' world, traveling OS - where you might be exposed to and catch the virus - is the same as traveling down to the shops - where you might be exposed to and catch the virus. You won't have to quarantine when you get back from the shops, so why from OS? I concede that for OS travel they may not apply that simple logic, but it does apply.
Again I’m also in the hope you are right category but I think in the short term this is wishful thinking.

there is so much we are yet to know about the virus so I think organisations will place contingencies to ensure they don’t expose staff or customers to the virus.

for the next 12 months at least I’d expect a negative before boarding a plane and it’s this sort of info I want to know before booking
 

Wardy

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Caveat; I'm in NSW, and Gladys has been the most bullish, along with the Federal Gov't, about opening to travel, so my observations refer specifically to NSW residents - though hoping of course that they apply to everyone who wants to travel.
 

Telezacski

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Caveat; I'm in NSW, and Gladys has been the most bullish, along with the Federal Gov't, about opening to travel, so my observations refer specifically to NSW residents - though hoping of course that they apply to everyone who wants to travel.
Except on the same day she made those bullish statements on international travel she halved NSW intake of returning Australians
 
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sly_karma

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This should clear the way for events like world cup ski races at Lake Louise in November. 14 day quarantine for athletes coaches and technicians would have been too big an obstacle for just two race weekends. Last winter they just canceled the north American opening rounds of the season and reassigned the codexes to European venues.

And eventually the Americans will get the butthurt out of their system and reopen their land border. Even though the administration has changed now, the senior public servants were very pissed off when Canada closed the border in March 2021 despite the ex president saying it wasn't necessary.
 

Chalkie

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Just got an email from Vail Resorts, outlining the Covid protocols for Whistler this season:

"This season, we are focused on COVID-19 safety protocols in indoor spaces. We are fortunate that the core of our experience takes place outdoors in vast mountain settings. However, as we welcome guests from around the world to the indoor experience at our resorts, we feel it’s important to do our part to combat the spread of COVID-19.​
To this end, the key details of our 2021-22 Winter Operating Plan this season will include the following (all are subject to changing local public health guidelines and changing dynamics surrounding COVID-19):​
  • Mountain Access: We will not have a mountain reservation system this season and will load lifts and gondolas at normal capacity, optimizing guest movement around our resorts.
  • Face Coverings: Face coverings will be required in indoor settings, including in our restaurants, lodging properties, restrooms, retail and rental locations, and on gondolas, based on the order from the Provincial Health Authority. Face coverings are also required on buses, but will not be required outdoors, in lift lines or on chairlifts, unless required by local public health.
  • Dining – Reservations: Like last season, guests will be required to book a reservation to eat at many of our on-mountain restaurants. However, based on current regulations, we are expecting significantly more seating and dining capacity than last season, and we intend to open reservations one day prior, versus the day-of last season.
  • Dining – Vaccinations: Guests will be required to show their BC Vaccine Card to dine at indoor restaurants, restaurant patios and bars, based on the order from the Provincial Health Authority. Proof of vaccination will be required for guests ages 12 and over at those locations, and for guests ages 18 and over, a proof of photo ID will also be required. This applies to those in our ski and ride school programs that include lunch. Consistent with our approach across our resorts, proof of vaccination will also be required at our on-mountain quick-service restaurants. We believe the vaccine requirement is important for the protection of our guests and our employees, given the number of people using these facilities and the fact that guests will not be wearing face coverings while eating and drinking. These are currently the only parts of our experience that will require proof of vaccination, unless required by local public health.
  • Employee Safety: We will be requiring all of our employees have COVID-19 vaccinations for their safety and protection as well as the safety and protection of our guests and communities. Indoor face coverings, enhanced hygiene practices, daily employee health screenings, and other health and safety measures will also continue."
The only thing that I am surprised about is that proof of vaccination is not currently required to access gondolas. I would have thought they are unambiguously a non-essential indoor space. I hope that this gets addressed.
 

sly_karma

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Apex are saying no proof of vax other than restaurant and bars as per PHO orders. Masks when indoors. No mask outdoors. Lifts to be full capacity again. Almost normal!

Snow fell last weekend on the upper mountain. Here we go...
 

sly_karma

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From what I'm hearing in the media, you can edit someone else's Alberta card to make it show a different name - time to start calling on your contacts! Feckin eejits over there really thought they could end covid without resorting to such fancy tools, so they haven't put any thought into a how to make proof of vax cards that are non hackable.
 

Crystal

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Feeling more confident about a trip yet Crystal?
I am more than comfortable with travelling around Canada :) it's just getting back into Aus that is stressing me and the unknown. I don't have faith in our Gov not shutting me out should something happen in the world.. Shits me to tears as when something goes catastrophically wrong the first place you should be able to travel to is your homeland and be safe.
 

sli1

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I am more than comfortable with travelling around Canada :) it's just getting back into Aus that is stressing me and the unknown. I don't have faith in our Gov not shutting me out should something happen in the world.. Shits me to tears as when something goes catastrophically wrong the first place you should be able to travel to is your homeland and be safe.
What shits me is that an event like a spike in Covid cases in India was such an event considered "catastrophic" enough to lock out Australians. Seriously, you would have thought something far more extreme was required to take such action.
 
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Crystal

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What shits me is that an event like a spike in Covid cases in India was such an event considered "catastrophic" enough to lock out Australians. Seriously, you would have thought something far more extreme was required to take such action.
Totally agree, I am still a bit shitty about Aussies who have not been able to return. I know they have had time, I know they were warned but to have big international companies come in and have handshake meetings and take up space for returning Aussies is terrible. Not to mention the sport. BUT that is another thread. Bad me for contaminating a ski thread.
 
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