Air Canada changes seat configuration on 777's

Discussion in 'Flights' started by robbo mcs, Mar 7, 2016.

  1. robbo mcs

    robbo mcs Dedicated Member
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    Hi,

    Air Canada is rolling out new seating on the long range 777's, and it is not good for economy :(

    Since they launched the 777's AC has had a 2 cabin configuration, with 1/2/1 in business class and a 9 abreast 3/3/3 in economy.

    They have now reconfigured one of the 777's into a 3 cabin configuaration, and they are rolling this out across the fleet, including for Australia. Business is essentially unchanged. There are now 3 rows of premium economy, which are pretty poor compared to competitors. I haven't flown in them, but got to sit in a seat an play around for a while.

    However, the big change is in economy which has now gone 10 abreast in a 3/4/3 configuration. For those of you who have not have the unfortunate experience of enduring a 10 abreast 777 this is not good news, especially for a 15 hour transpacific flight.

    The seats are much narrower (43cm vs 47 cm), and closer too with a pitch of 78cm vs 81cm. The aisles are very narrow. This makes for a cramped and unpleasant experience. This is particularily bad in the 2 middle seats of the middle row (seats E and F) which have the legs of the row in front smack in front, so there is very little room to move your feet, and no room to put a bag. Also this means there are more people trying to cram carry on into the overhead lockers.

    You can see the different configurations here

    http://www.aircanada.com/en/about/fleet/77L.html

    On top of this they have reduced the number of attendants per flight.

    I like AC for the convenience of the direct flights to YVR. However, if you are travelling economy, this makes it much less attractive.

    Robbo
     
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  2. Normo

    Normo Addicted Member
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    I've abandoned Air Canada....having experienced them at their "user friendly" worst. Surprisingly, my return to being a Qantas customer has been quite enjoyable. The direct flight to Vancouver was the big plus with AC, but now that QF are offering that service in January ( and possibly extending the offer) I have no desire to fly AC again.
    Returns via LAX in Feb or March can be a bit tedious (unless you've tagged a USA resort onto the end of your Canada experience) but I would still go out of my way to avoid the Air Canada offer. By your report, Robbo, I guess AC are not on the improve.
     
    #2 Normo, Mar 7, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2016
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  3. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    Most airlines worked out a long time ago that you don't have to please anyone in Economy
    As long as the price is right, they will fill
     
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  4. benchives

    benchives Part of the Furniture
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    I will tell this to my travel agent and personal assistant, thanks.
     
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  5. Born2ski

    Born2ski Part of the Furniture

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    Interesting. I was thinking of booking flights on their new Brisbane to Vancouver route for our trip next winter. Maybe LAX is a better option now.

    Problem is Air Canada fares are not cheap on their Aus to Canada route. My research is showing going via LAX offers a better price.
     
  6. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    Sure, but when was the last time you saw an empty seat on a trans Pacific flight?
    They will sell
     
  7. abucas

    abucas Active Member

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    We have just arrived home on the new reconfigured 777-200, and I can confirm that the new seating arrangement is appalling. Heaven help you if you get even a moderately large person sitting beside you.
    Also, they have removed a toilet on the right side middle, so that all the passengers on the right hand side aisle have only two toilets they can easily access. They are also noisy, you can here them flushing from several rows away, so they must have reduced insulation in an attempt to save weight.
    The flight attendant told us that they had also reduced the crew count by 3 as well.
    After 6 trips with AC, we will not be travelling economy with AC again.
     
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  8. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    Are there better economy options?
     
  9. Angus_McCrory

    Angus_McCrory Old And Crusty

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    Premium..........
     
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  10. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    So it's same old same old
    Economy is downsizing with every airline , everyone moans and bitches, but they can only fill about 21 seats of PE on a 777
    They could make you stand all the way to LAX and most people would still buy that over a more comfortable seat that they actually have to pay more for
    Makes me lel
     
  11. cold wombat

    cold wombat Twitter Contributer
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    At some point you draw the line. I discovered that on Tiger.
     
  12. Born2ski

    Born2ski Part of the Furniture

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    So if you had a choice.

    a. shorter flight (straight to Vancouver), narrow seats, less legroom AND costs your family $8000
    or
    b. longer flight (via LAX to Canada), slightly wider seats with more leg room AND only costs your family $5000

    Which one do you choose ?
     
  13. cruisin along

    cruisin along Addicted Member
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    Cathay Pacific and a longer flight ......difference in costs was quite substantial. Flying in June and yes cattle class but cost was $1600 each return......compared to Air Canada of $2400 each return ....mmmm
    Both cattle class
    I would have chosen Qantas with an upgrade on points however my friend does not operate on FF points at all.......now she is separated from the control freak it may change.

    Would NEVER EVER fly British Airways .....
     
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  14. Harper11

    Harper11 Part of the Furniture
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    The higher price of the Brisbane Vancouver flights is enough to have me looking for alternative options but this new seating lay out would rule AC out all together.

    Premium economy isn't worth double the price if you are paying for yourself
     
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  15. Apresski

    Apresski Pool Room
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    My daughter came back from Canada last week, went on Qantas via LAX on a Thursday, had 3 seats to herself, returned with her boyfriend on a Tuesday, same story, plenty of spare seats.
     
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  16. piolet

    piolet Old And Crusty
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    Im usually a supporter of direct being best but i am lazy and $3000 is a lot of biscuits! That and the comfort factor make for a tough decision.
    Kids' ages would be the decider for me regarding convenience
     
  17. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    Well there you go
    Maybe it's a long time since I flew outside school holidays midweek!
     
  18. Harper11

    Harper11 Part of the Furniture
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    For 3 k extra you could throw in a free trip to Disneyland
     
  19. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    Which is why people will bitch and moan about narrow seats and pitch but still buy the cheapest return fare they can.
    Believe me, the airlines wouldn't do it if they thought it would in any way undermine their bottom line
    For me , the journey is a major part of the trip, so I like to do it in some degree of comfort.
    Not withstanding my 6'5" Mr Legs 1988
     
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  20. Harper11

    Harper11 Part of the Furniture
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    I'm slightly taller than that and used to travel exit row or get a points upgrade. But now with kids I'm buying four tickets and kids can't sit exit row. So 500-600 extra per ticket adds up especially if AC are more expensive and more cramped
     
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  21. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    We enjoyed Cathay Pacific.
    Stop over in Hong Kong broke up the trip and added an extra flavour to the holiday.
     
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  22. DidSurfNowSki

    DidSurfNowSki Dedicated Member
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    Well, I have a mortgage, pay child support and I'm on a fixed wage. The cost of getting from point A to point B is very important to me. Any money I can 'save' on an airline flight can go against the mortgage. So long as I can squeeze my butt into a seat on a widebody jet I'll go. It's still way better than those old Southern/Northern Service flights I did as a youngster.
     
  23. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    Cruisin along, can you recall if Cathay Pacific still include the free stop over option in Hong Kong? (ie no extra cost to flight price if you decided you wanted to stop over). Our prices where very similar to yours as well compared to Air Canada (some years ago now).
     
  24. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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  25. Donza

    Donza Pool Room

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    JAL 777 have skywider in Economy class. 3 3 3
    [​IMG]
     
  26. Born2ski

    Born2ski Part of the Furniture

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    Flew on that bird in Jan. Good space for economy, but JAL like to run their cabins warm, so you'll only need a t-shirt.
     
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  27. Donza

    Donza Pool Room

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    *Japan.
     
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  28. piolet

    piolet Old And Crusty
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    yep
    we even have a direction for warmer cabins on japan flights
     
  29. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    Same situation Harper
    I try to book 2 exit row seats + the row of 3 behind
    Or else I wait for the PE specials!
    @Donza have noted the ANA pitch and legroom also at 34 and 18.5
    J* at 30 and 17...that'a @ biiiiiiiiigggg difference on a 9hr flight
    Can get a flight to Tokyo around New Year about the same price as Jetstar on ANA
    No Brainer really....and correct me but they also offer 2x23kg to economy passenger luggage and no xs baggage if your bag is within weight and less than 203cm
     
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  30. Donza

    Donza Pool Room

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    Yeah 2 x 23
     
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  31. azzski

    azzski Old And Crusty
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    My usual routine is to be first in the queue to check in whenever I can manage it, and ask for an exit row. Almost always get it, which makes Jetstar tolerable. Still rather be flying ANA to Japan though.
     
  32. Donza

    Donza Pool Room

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    You are such a large human though.
    They must be intimidated
     
  33. azzski

    azzski Old And Crusty
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    Hah! ANA domestic were not intimidated, those little Japanese women wouldn't give me one!
     
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  34. Donza

    Donza Pool Room

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    Japanese domestic are the model of efficiency and overstaffing.
     
  35. chunky

    chunky Old And Crusty

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    Korean air do the same. Warmest cabin temps i have flown in. My only real gripe about the flight apart from the longer flight. It was uncomfortable temp wise. They were also cheaper than AC by more than 3k so that us a lot of dollars i save for the ski trip esp when i need 6 tickets. It all adds up.
     
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  36. Donza

    Donza Pool Room

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    I always wear a tee shirt on a plane ...
     
  37. chunky

    chunky Old And Crusty

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    I do too. It was still uncomfortable.
     
  38. Donza

    Donza Pool Room

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    Yuck.
    My daughter will be happy.
     
  39. Astro66

    Astro66 Still looking for a park in Thredbo
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    Been looking at flights to North America. The money you save shopping around with a family, can pay for 5 days skiing in Alaska.

    Which I'm now investigating.
     
  40. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    I counted 7 people measuring and conferring over my 185cm Dakine roller from Osaka to Sapporo one time
    I remember thinking "This cannot be the first time someone has taken a skibag to Hokkaido from Osaka"
    But it was early/mid 00's ...so maybe not as common then
     
  41. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    Just a little rough mudmap volumetric maths...but the difference in personal space between the J* and Japanese carriers 787's economy seating is about 25% given the vertical height is constant
     
  42. azzski

    azzski Old And Crusty
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    Which, well, in terms of seat height, it really isn't :) Having flown Tiger on the weekend and found the headrest topping out below shoulder height...
     
  43. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    I guess I was thinking more about the distance from the floor to the overhead luggage bins
    That pic Don-san posted of the JAL seats is pretty enticing
     
    #43 MisterMxyzptlk, Mar 8, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2016
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  44. azzski

    azzski Old And Crusty
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    Agree. You know what else would be nice? The tray table being hinged just a couple of cms higher than it always is currently.
     
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  45. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    Isn't that a joy
    I particularly like it when the air waitress starts banging the bloody thing onto your femurs as though that will somehow achieve a level feeding platform
     
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  46. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    [​IMG]

    they do like it hot
     
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  47. Donza

    Donza Pool Room

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    sometimes its nice to be Danny De Vito.
     
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  48. cruisin along

    cruisin along Addicted Member
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    I am lucky sometimes.....being only 5'4" my legs fit comfortably in cattle class and my bum has no trouble fitting on the seat .....headrest is higher than I would like but seriously ..I now have a silk and alpaca wrap that doubles as a soft pillow.....Bose noise cancelling headphones with brilliant music and a penchant for good scotch ......

    Who cares what seat I am in .......I did a horrific 20 hours back from London once with nothing but the 3 day old clothes and an inflatable pillow donated by some feral next to me......then on returning after more flight changes immediately got on a bus with 60 kids to travel from the QLD border to the snow .......

    Harden up peeps ......or do what I did and get a few of life's luxuries to help in times of need.
     
  49. MisterMxyzptlk

    MisterMxyzptlk Old And Crusty
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    It would be nice to have retractable femurs and tibias
    If 20 hrs was horrific for you at 5'4, imagine what it's like at 6'5
     
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  50. cruisin along

    cruisin along Addicted Member
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    Shit on a stick horrid I would say
     
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