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Backcountry Skis?

Discussion in 'Backcountry' started by Spence, Mar 4, 2020.

  1. rowdyflat

    rowdyflat One of Us Ski Pass: Gold Ski Pass: Silver

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    Man up and slap on a pair of AT boots then come and see me. Fckn dinosaurs. We need a dinosaur emoji.:):D:cry:
    Whenever I hear that my eyes roll , my ears start to buzz and I switch off and think this person doesn't get it.
     
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  2. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Cool RF - is there a Vic store doing AT rentals in larger boot sizes? Can ask Bumps. JIC I get a season. Er day in this winter/Spring? Ta
     
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  3. DPS Driver

    DPS Driver A Local

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    It's Ok. I was joking.

    Much respect for my bent knee brethren. If you'd read many, many posts explaining the fact that nobody can afford to set up a pair of demo tele's. You would understand the tongue in the cheek post.
     
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  4. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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  5. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    All good - it’s the ‘impossible dream’. Can’t resist the bait every now & then. ;)
     
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  6. skifree

    skifree A disciple of the blessed avi giraffe Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    See that’s the thing, with ntn it’s easy, there’s small or large binding and everyone fits into one or the other. You don’t even have to dick around resetting the binding to suit the boot size then dick around win DIN settings like AT.
     
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  7. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Very true. Btw; I already have the Outlaw X and Tx Pros.

    based on solo trips to Stirling and up Falls Ck summit, they’re Fairish with kickers on Rustler9 on undulating but feel somewhat heavy and slow on full G3 Nylon Alpinists universal.

    Some of the issue is definitely the drag of the skin & quite a bit of the weight/fitness of the skier!!

    But the other weights add up.

    Most realistic change fo4 touring this winter if we have is already happening - I have longer thread m5 screws to mount my old HHeads back on to the QKs (slacken cable - postn 1# etc...) Then use my Excursions. Obviously if it was more of a turning BC trip this wouldn’t do.

    Next one (hope to do this winter); try the Contour hybrid skins with Rustlers. Worth a go for less friction than G3 & more grip than Kickers.

    next is probably a lighter But wide touring ski (new Backland 100s look good / so do Cammox freebird etc...or DPS tour on special?? :)-)

    one day I might go the Lynx as it fits my QK pattern. The Meidjo is more holes.

    that’s the thinking?
     
  8. skifree

    skifree A disciple of the blessed avi giraffe Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    Lynx is the same hole pattern as Outlaw, should screw straight on.
     
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  9. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    And the Lynx will be well sorted by the time I can budget for a pair. (;-)
     
  10. skifree

    skifree A disciple of the blessed avi giraffe Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    It works fine.
     
  11. scottski

    scottski A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    Interesting, what was noticeable in the US when I was looking at buying NTN boots and bindings this year, most people are sticking with 75mm and in fact that was pretty much all I could buy if I wanted Tele.
     
  12. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    But imagine if an Excursion type NTN boot arrived (sub 1.5kg per boot)?
    Then with a light say DPS? ski (1.5 kg +/-) the binding (Outlaw) becomes the heavy item in the kit - making the change to Lynx/Meidjo (500g ea.) more logical (noticeable)?

    I’d be down from ~ 5 kg per foot to 3.5 kg - quite a saving!

    Then I’d have to tour more than ave. 3-4 days a season - it’s barely enough for the outlay. Time to lure the old gang away from lifts to the real stuff? (;-)
     
  13. skifree

    skifree A disciple of the blessed avi giraffe Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    I only think about what we can get now.

    The Outlaw is a boat anchor.

    There are a lot of really light skis. Some of them are actually quite good, a very few are reasonable to good as all-rounders. Most are fairly dedicated tools. But the point is there is plenty of choice for a really light ski.

    The Lynx and Meidgo are 500grams, you have to go full tech and even then select carefully to beat this with AT. You can go lighter if you can find an ATK Newmark. I do not consider TTS (which is sub 500grams) a viable binding except for very special applications. And I'd accept the argument that the ATK Newmark falls into this (or it's own) sub-category as well.

    So it is easy to make up a much lighter ski binding combo right now. So if you spend any time hauling up hill or along approaches or touring there is no reason not to reduce weight right now.

    Sure we are all dreaming of lighter tele boots. But it is very unlikely to happen with a market fragmented into 75mm and ntn. So if you want lighter boots move to ntn and reduce the fragmentation and send message to manufacturers that you are ready for better boots.

    The Excursion is a slipper and so the performance it can deliver is and will always be limited. If you are just touring rolling country then it works. If you want any downhill performance you need a different boot. I did own some Excursions and sold them after a season of testing and determining they really were limiting. And they were not that much lighter than my 4 buckle boot of the time, Garmont Energys.

    The TXPro weigh a little less than 1700grams per boot. And I'd love a lighter boot. But I'll have to say I do like the way it feels like a lighter boot. @Telemark Phat would say that is because it is a soft cruisers boot. It certainly feels lighter than my previous Garmonts.
     
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  14. skifree

    skifree A disciple of the blessed avi giraffe Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    Any days that can be better with better gear are better days.

    I spend plenty more than 3-4 days away from the lifts.
     
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  15. Chaeron

    Chaeron Ski-Hike-Blade-Bike-Kayak

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    Going to be a big BC year.
     
  16. skifree

    skifree A disciple of the blessed avi giraffe Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    If we are allowed to.
     
  17. Chaeron

    Chaeron Ski-Hike-Blade-Bike-Kayak

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    Working on my grass and sand skiing rig for golf courses and sand dunes....
     
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  18. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    The outlaw x Makes sense for me as I do 10 ish days on lifts per season (jump may have bumped
    it up but for this CV thing) and 3-4 light touring days mostly at smaller Vic hills (Excursion type trips).

    So I have a cpl of 75 mm Voile release set ups with narrow skis (inc old Morotto grip Tele) and now 4 wider heavier set ups with QKs set to Outlaw pattern.

    but the lighter NTN stuff even @83mm waist is not that light hence the longer term goal to go wideish and light (ski wise), and eventually are lighter binder (Lynx) and boot (blue moon!)

    I’ll cope for now - hey look we may not ski until the northern winter? - and get over the CV under certainty & costs from last J trip & all the gear (thousands)

    A Re the ski: Do you think with your DPS (@100mm) you’ve found the right ski to cover tours in Oz & Japan (most days)? It would be very hard to justify two lightweight tour skis at say 90mm and then 105/110? For the two locations.

    I like the look of the Backland 100 - still to arrive - could blend firm & soft tasks well?

    Ta.
     
  19. skifree

    skifree A disciple of the blessed avi giraffe Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    Yes, it will be my primary ski across all I do.
     
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  20. skifree

    skifree A disciple of the blessed avi giraffe Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    It has good wraps, probably could not go too far wrong with it.
     
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  21. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Just to clarify that’s ‘firm snow and soft snow’ - hopefully can handle variable crud too?
    Early days. Wait until Blister, Ski Essentials, PugSki & the Euro media review.
     
  22. skifree

    skifree A disciple of the blessed avi giraffe Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    You have responded to my comment on the Backland. So no idea except to say my experience of veriable crud is the skier is more important that than the ski. So if it a issue that is hard to deal with lessons an improving the level of skiing is better money spent than a new pair of ski.
     
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  23. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    that’s fair enough - I probably don’t claim to be an expert in this area but I manage.

    more generally:
    I think anyway one xc skis in Aussie & starts in slop/mud/ grass (snow line); then careful climbing on wet/thin; confident uphill in deeper/drier snow, the up/Down on ice/sastrugi/ wave crests - toss some damp pow in a shadowy bowl and you could say they handle variable.

    trying to get a ski that’s fair-good in all those conditions is a tough ask. But yes nothing like repeated experience. Throw some weather in the mix too!
     
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  24. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Mount Stirling, Vic is my example here; frequently 3-4 snow types on anyone day inc. often inc none for the lowest 100m or so.
     
  25. DPS Driver

    DPS Driver A Local

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    Just get the DPS Wailer 100. It's ripper.

    The new Backland will be more like our Foundation ski construction, in fact it's almost identical construction wise, with a centre stringer of Carbon fibre and fibreglass laminates. Should be a nice silky smooth ski, although heavier than the Alchemist or Pagoda constructions. Won't have the same level of responsiveness and rebound though.
     
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  26. telecrag

    telecrag Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    haha, a friend of mine commented on a ski trip this summer, he was skiing deep fresh powder with a group, but only had his carve skis. They were all saying how it would be impossible, and he wouldnt keep up. He said I think ill be right (didnt tell them he is full cert alpine). No problem. He said he was probably working harder than the others, but was never going to have any trouble keeping up, and sort of enjoyed it too.

    Some conditions are impossible, no matter what though.
     
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  27. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Thats a good point about the quality of the skier, which would make up much of the difference.

    I know they stated ‘deep powder’ but this could mean mid - high shin for some or mid thigh+ for others?

    The pack could be on the heavy 2-days’ old side or lovely light dry - perhaps in the latter the certified chap would do ok with a good technique?
     
  28. telecrag

    telecrag Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Haha, a full cert skier will do OK all the time.
     
  29. Rimey

    Rimey One of Us

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    I've ended up with DPS W112 in Pure 3 and DPS Cassiar 95 also in Pure 3.
    Covers winter pow and spring. Very happy.
    Quiverkillers help with the cost.
    My Praxis Backcountry 105 are a great general purpose BC ski.
    That's about the width for a one ski BC quiver for NH BC trips.
     
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  30. Interruptedbyfireworks

    Interruptedbyfireworks One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

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    I have a question about skins - I can see the contour ones are popular, though I have a splitboard not skis so I called rhythm to see if they have any in stock.

    The person who answered the phone was really helpful and also split boards and needs short skins like me, and she said she is going to order some Black Diamond ascension skins in for her board, but could probably do a special order for contours if I really wanted.

    Does anyone have any insight into the Black Diamond ascension skins?
     
  31. Mister Tee on XC Skis

    Mister Tee on XC Skis A Local Ski Pass: Gold Ski Pass: Silver

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    I use BD kicker skins. They have
    changed my life in XC and BC XC skiing. :)
    I still have crashes on planks :-0 but that is more to do with descending badly !
     
  32. Interruptedbyfireworks

    Interruptedbyfireworks One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

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    And Mont have called me back - they can cut their skins down to my splitboard size. They do either Pomoca Free or Pomoca pro-S-glide

    So many options, please help!
     
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  33. Mister Tee on XC Skis

    Mister Tee on XC Skis A Local Ski Pass: Gold Ski Pass: Silver

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    As far as I understand this matter
    ( I am just a plonker on planks really, still crashing and burning :p on some descending bends on XC skis )
    most skins can be cut to size.
    However these things are not cheap and you get one chance to get it right .If you muck it up then you will have made an expensive mistake.
    Talk to your trusted ski shop wallahs.
    I for one would take my skins to my preferred ski shop ( EMC Ski in Melb.) if I needed to cut them to fit one particular pair of skis.
    I 'd get them to do it for me.

    Fortunately I can buy Black diamond kicker skins at two different widths. As a result I have ordered a second set for my narrower width metal edged skis.
    The metal edges on my skis must be exposed and not covered by the skins.
     
  34. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend Ski Pass: Gold

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    Kickers are irrelevant for a splitboard
     
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  35. DPS Driver

    DPS Driver A Local

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    If Rhythm don't have any spiltboard Contour skins left, give Bruce at Wilderness Sports Jindabyne a call.
     
  36. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Just buy some. If you are planning to skin steep terrain make sure you get full coverage.
     
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  37. chicski

    chicski A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    Pick the orange ones. I just relied on their expertise. They know their stuff.
     
  38. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    The only input i'll have is that i always found i had less issues with my fixed hook on tail and rubber tip attachment than others with the adjustable rubber tail attachment. But no idea how any of that works with a board.

    And this thread reminds me i've got to dig through the garage to hopefully find a hardly used set of skins that i can trim down blowettes new tourers. Have bought so many skins for +1 skis that were only ever used for a couple of days each.
     
  39. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend Ski Pass: Gold

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    REGLUING
    SBs note about old skins got me thinking - what’s everyone’s fav approach for glue replacement? I need to do a pair for the lad.
     
  40. Team Weasel

    Team Weasel One of Us

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    I'd go with the S-Glides. Best all round skin, nice and light.

    Experiences with others:
    Black Diamond - Last forever, good grip, decent glide, lose grip in really wet conditions (eg. late spring)
    G3 - Maybe I got a year with bad glue, but they sucked. Grip on snow was bad, glide so-so
    Colltex - Great skins, but pulling them apart is seriously hard work
    Contour - (rebranded as Atomic) - super easy on and off, but the least reliable in wet conditions
    Black Crows Pellis - haven't tried them yet, but they feel quite similar to the Contours

    I'd be curious to try the latest Contours, but to be honest Pomoca has been outstanding for me and I see no reason to change.
     
  41. telecrag

    telecrag Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    This, I don't think ski skins cut down are split board skins.
     
  42. Interruptedbyfireworks

    Interruptedbyfireworks One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

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    Just spoke to Bruce, he is so good, explained the technology to me and everything, I really appreciated it!

    He said the ski skins cut down won’t fit the splitboard, and he has some contour splitboard ones in stock so I’m going to follow his advice and get some of them! Very excited and nervous haha.

    Not sure when I’ll be brave enough to drive down the Monaro and get them cut to size / pick them up, I’d like restrictions to be eased probably one more level before I could look a copper in the eye if they pulled me over asking my reason for travelling. Though we are allowed to go shopping and WS is a speciality store, so it’s not unreasonable in my mind. Anyway, this isn’t the thread to discuss restrictions so...

    thank you all!! Good advice and connections as always haha as soon as I said my name Bruce knew who I was and why I was calling, thanks forumites :love:
     
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  43. nezumi

    nezumi One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

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    This video from Jones is really good for showing how to cut and fit their universal tail fit skins. Obviously Burton recommend their G3 skins, which come in a small to fit boards 146-160cm in length. Rhythem have these in stock, so I'm not sure why they might not have been suggested to you?

     
  44. Interruptedbyfireworks

    Interruptedbyfireworks One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

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    I’ve read quite a few reviews saying that once they stretch they will be too long for my board, since I’m right at the very bottom of the range. So I excluded them almost immediately
     
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  45. Interruptedbyfireworks

    Interruptedbyfireworks One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

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    @nezumi Also G3 seem to get a bad wrap on this forum and other reviews I’ve read too. Maybe it’s the Aussie snow?
     
  46. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Really? I have a pair of G3 skins that would be 12-13 years old and are in regular use across several pairs of skis.
     
  47. zac150

    zac150 A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    I’m a fan of the g3’s as well but having said that I think your research has been pretty thorough.

    what Bruce and I think @telecrag have said makes sense, get split board skins not ski skins as I’m going to assume how they connect to the ski will be slightly different (angles) so you should get a better fit.

    FWIW for the prosperity of the discussion I like kicker skins as an option for the pocket at resorts for when Telecrag says lets climb up there.....

    I also like them touring with a pack as they make climbing better.
     
    #247 zac150, May 4, 2020
    Last edited: May 4, 2020
  48. Interruptedbyfireworks

    Interruptedbyfireworks One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

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    Yeah obviously I have no first-hand knowledge though, just seemed to be a theme of - the clips are good but the glide is too grippy. That being said, they are all too big for my board so I didn't give them too much attention to begin with and therefore I might be mixing up my memories of reviews/comments, so please take my comment with a grain of salt.
     
  49. dawooduck

    dawooduck relaxed and comfortable Ski Pass: Gold

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    I have a pair of Black Diamond purple skins that just keep keeping on. Not a lot of use but they come out of the bag each year sticking tight.
     
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  50. mr

    mr Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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    dont expect consensus here! :)