DIY Siglin Pulk

teleroo

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So Teleroo and Telejoeys x 2 (11 and 13 yo) are hopefully going to spend the July school holidays and last week of ski season staying at a lodge at Perisher (Wheatley Rd) and skiing Charlotte Pass. We are all on tele bindings and we all have rucksacks, so can tour ourselves the 1km to the lodge from ski tube with a little grip wax I reckon.

Challenge will be to get food for one/two weeks plus gear from ski tube to the lodge. Never stayed overnight at Perisher in winter and not really sure what is available at the Perisher shop. But got a few dietary needs that i need to cater for so usually easier and cheaper for us to mostly byo food.

I'm thinking of building my own Siglin Pulk. Basically a folded bit of plastic. On the internet people seem to be using Ultra High Molecular Weight Polyethylene as apparently it slides a little better. But it is roughly twice the price of regular High Density Polyethylene. But I'm not 100% sure about this choice of material. Plan to go with 4.5 mm thickness in either case (yanks seem to be using 1/8th inch).

Construction doesn't look too hard to make one as a DIY project. The commercial ones out there have moulded runners in the base but I think i can get away without these.

Other alternatives I've considered are using a second hand Stokes Litter (rescue stretcher) and making some sort of sled base, again maybe with HDPE. Heavier and fully rigid but maybe overkill?

Any thoughts out there re pulk/sled construction or materials selection or working with polyethylene? Apparently you can cold bend it with a metal folder for the side walls, but might look at getting this done with heat by the company I'll get the plastic from.

A few around here seem to have dabbled in the past.

siglinpulk1 (1).jpeg
 

nezumi

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So it's just the three of you? How responsible are the Telejoeys?

One option for delivering the supplies would be the skitube shuffle - drive into Perisher carpark, unload gear, supplies, etc, leave Telejoeys to stand guard, drive from Perisher down to the skitube, catch the skitube up to Perisher and rejoin Telejoeys.

Otherwise, most lodges allow for complimentary oversnow on arrival and departure days, and failing this it's somewhere around $15-25 for a one way trip - probably cheaper than the cost of the DIY project.
 
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Dropbear

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Yeah, would be much simpler to take complementary or the paid Hans Oversnow service. If you're wanting to save money, then pack your food and gear up into a small number of big bags, and then 1 or more people in your group can travel with it. Everyone else can walk in the snow with rucksacks.

The other issue is that you say you're staying in Perisher but skiing in Charlotte Pass - these are 12km apart, and while it's an easy day trip on the Charlotte Pass oversnow, it's probably not something you'd want to do every day!
 

Jacko4650

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The supermarket in Perisher is quite small, and can be pricey, but is certainly useful for stock-ups. Best best is to bring the majority of your food with you, special food and all.
Some items have the mandatory "Hapow!" mark-up but others are incredibly reasonable. They appear to recognise that people staying on the mountain or close by will not buy from them if they are overly priced, so cooking items and staples are not too exxy. Daytripper-type items have the big mark ups - fair enough. When you compare the cost of fuel, travel time and car-park frustration buying at WW's Jindy, it can be a great store for food and alcohol if you are on the mountain. ie: don't blow a valve carting items up to Perisher when you can get them at a reasonable price on-mountain anyway.
BTW: Nice to watch your journey on discovering alternatives to Selwyn winter escapes!
 

Jacko4650

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Tip: many lodges have volunteers operating their skidoos (or bigger) to transport guests and their gear. If yours doesn't have transport options from the Perisher Tube terminal, I would imagine "a carton" might convince volunteers from other lodges to get you and the family's gear up to your lodge? There are numerous forum members here that volunteer their time for such duties.
PS: Hans Oversnow is no doubt legendary, but they sure know how to charge!!!! A friend who had a fall skiing and was declared cactus for skiing by the Doctors was determined to meet the crew for lunch at Sundeck. She sure learnt that lesson. Ouch!
 

nezumi

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PS: Hans Oversnow is no doubt legendary, but they sure know how to charge!!!! A friend who had a fall skiing and was declared cactus for skiing by the Doctors was determined to meet the crew for lunch at Sundeck. She sure learnt that lesson. Ouch!

I can confirm this - and also that "oversnow" doesn't include Smiggins.

We were staying in Smiggins in the first week of August last year. My wife caught a toe edge snowboarding at Blue Cow and went down, dislocating her elbow on the Thursday with the big snowfall - then Thursday night/Friday morning happened and we were nearly snowed in. Called for oversnow, and the driver couldn't get up Plum Pine Rd to the lodge, so we (me, 3you and wife with non-functional elbow) had to slog it through minimum knee deep snow to get down to the carpark. The only reason we made it was because one of the lodge managers assisted me with our bag.

Hans still charged us $50 for a drive from Smiggins carpark to the Ski Tube terminal. :O
 
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teleroo

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Hi All
Thanks for the replies. The Telejoeys are quite sensible but I wouldn't want to leave them at Perisher and drive round to the tube etc in case something happened to me car accident etc.

Somehow oversnow doesn't appeal, yet another expense blah blah. Not sure a regular toboggan would fit enough in. Some utube vids show people pulling 800 kg on HDPE sleds on the flat. We'd probably have 20+ kg of food each trip.

And re skiing at Charlotte Pass, we are refugees from Selwyn so took up the offer of CP season passes in lieu for this season. An extra bit of travel each day but a smaller, quieter resort suits us.

And a bloke needs a good DIY project to keep him off the streets...
 

art

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I would really look hard for an accom option in CP.
That daily oversnow is going to be a really big pain. It's slow and noisy. You have to pre-book times and it's inflexible. You can deal with it for a few day trips but it would not be great for a week or more.

Finding good value accom will take some looking. Pygmy possum lodge is on the cheaper end of the spectrum and worth a look.
 

teleroo

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For a self catered option that seems pretty affordable, I'd go for this: https://eloueraskiclub.asn.au/bookings/

Also, they appear to have a food store where you can buy staple/bulk ingredients at prices which are actually reasonable, especially given the normal Mountain Tax!

Thanks @nezumi for thinking of us in that way. Agreed looks like a good lodge and fair value. The daily oversnow doesn't really bother me (we used to drive in and out of Selwyn each day) and with the kiddies being at school I've actually planned our ski year out already, so all dates etc are known, oversnow us booked and am just awaiting accommodation confirmation at the club lodge of which I'm a member.

It would be interesting to see if Eloura still had school holiday slots available at this point as their first round of bookings for club members has already opened.
 
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nezumi

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I'm booked for my 5-day week with Mr 4yo-in-March, staying at the Matterhorn. I have the luxury of being able to book *outside* of school holidays. I'll probably try and squeeze in a trip or two on my own/with friends in Hotham or Falls Creek, but considering the ear-bashing I got from him last year about going to the snow without me (he made an artwork of Mt Buller at childcare while I was away!) it will be touch-and-go. :p

I figured there was a good chance that you had already booked, but if there wasn't, well - might as well throw out the option. :)
 

Telezacski

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Just some thoughts, from what I can see you need to come up with a solution for the following:

1) car to ski tube
2) on the ski tube
3) ski tube to snow
4) where you start to ski the lodge.

you may find in early July that many of the roads are still partially clear, and personally I reckon it would be a PITA to keep loading and unloading gear.

have you considered attaching skis and maybe wheels to a tub? Maybe get an old bike trailer
 
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teleroo

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Orright. So held off on dropping the $400 for the fancy sheet of UHMWPE due to covid19 hoohar. Just as well, coz got lucky the other day. Snagged this little beauty on a roadside rubbish pile.
IMG_20200527_101709.jpg


She's just the thing for conversion to gear hauling snow sled. It is currently hollow for buoyancy. I'm thinking I'll cut off the top deck from behind the foot rests, inside the side gunwales and most of the bum sitting part. With the aim of increasing storage volume, providing some side walls, yet still retaining sufficient rigidity that the curved edges provide.

At this stage I think I will mount a draw bar across the paddle rest grooves. Thinking a bit of dowel mounted laterally held in place with saddle brackets, probably bolted through to bits of wood under the gunwales to spread the pull forces.
 

Moondog55

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I think you might have a real winner there with a jigsaw and a drill.
But if it was I, cut away on the inside of the gunwale from that middle footrest to the backrest but leave the rear flat deck.
But you want the front of the sled to rise up over bumps so get the pulling point lower down.
Small stainless steel eyebolts on big plate washers worked for me on the Paris, these things are much tougher than they look.
Ditto with multiple small eyebolts along the gunwale as lashing points.
Does it have a moulded in keel or dual keels? If so a little aluminium bar pop riveted on [ countersink the heads] will address the wear issue, if no keel make one from some small angle, 20mm is deep enough
 

teleroo

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Thanks @Moondog55. Here is the base:
IMG_20200527_130558.jpg


Realistically at this point we are only talking 1km from ski tube to lodge, on snow roads. So re underside protection am thinking not too much is necessary. Also don't want to be seen to be damaging ski tube etc dragging it around. But will see what comes to mind.

Why are you suggesting retaining the back deck?

And thanks for the tip on a low mounting point. Will think about that too. I am trying to be a little cautious to spread the pull point load on the plastic some how. To my mind that might be point of failure. There is a seam running longitudinally between the top and bottom sheets, so would need to be a good 5cm below that I reckon if drilling pull points into the lower hull.
 

Moondog55

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Rear deck is flat, so make a great place to put boxes or old fashioned suitcases but I was thinking more about multiple slabs of beer or a big plastic crate for loose stuff/ski boots etc but it would act as a stiffener IMO, still room underneath to stash small bits in a stuff sack
Yes you need to spread the load but on my own Paris based sled I just used a 25 * 4mm aluminium stave and some small bolts and so far so good with some really rough treatment, I cut the stave about 150mm long so a large load area.
The Paris sled is low to the ground so I put the haul point on the top of the gunwale, that sit-on looks to be a lot higher which is why I mention it.
 

Moondog55

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Pix of my build showing the stave reinforcing and rear haul points
I bought some UHMWPE at Rays a couple of years ago, they were selling "Magik" sleds which were illegal at all resorts and selling the sheets for $2- each, about 900 * 400mm thinking I'd make a Siglin type sled from them but the Paris works so well I never bothered
 

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Moondog55

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Interesting hull shape now
I am wondering how it will track.
Should work for short hauls as you say.
 

teleroo

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Interesting hull shape now
I am wondering how it will track.
Should work for short hauls as you say.
I see lots if stuff on the internet about adding aluminium fins to aid side slope tracking. Not needed for current plans.

Longer term am thinking of this as a ski lodge buster - a way to haul gear for longer duration snow camping trips close to ski resorts, for when the Telejoeys are older.
 

teleroo

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@Moondog55 please give me your thoughts on this idea. I'm thinking of installing luggage or roller blade type wheels at the back, so can be rolled along non snow sections (eg car to ski tube, ski tube to snow).

Would involve extra protrusions and drilling into the hull fins.
IMG_20200611_131738.jpg

IMG_20200611_131803.jpg
 

teleroo

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On the flat this how the back contacts the ground, so a rearwards mounting should mostly clear the snow.
IMG_20200611_132730.jpg
 

Moondog55

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Do you already have an axle and wheels of some sort?
If you weren't so far away I have an axle and wheels from a cheap shopping trolley I would send.
Small bike wheels on an appropriate axle would work well and as it's a freebie donor shell I doubt it would be worthwhile reinforcing the already strong plastic of the hull. Can you source small bike wheels at a reasonable cost? Like from the road side.
Get a short section of square tube and cut matching holes, glue the stub axle into the tube, use pins to set and hold the wheels in place
Easy cheesy
EDIT
It is a very good idea.
 

teleroo

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Do you already have an axle and wheels of some sort?
If you weren't so far away I have an axle and wheels from a cheap shopping trolley I would send.
Small bike wheels on an appropriate axle would work well and as it's a freebie donor shell I doubt it would be worthwhile reinforcing the already strong plastic of the hull. Can you source small bike wheels at a reasonable cost? Like from the road side.
Get a short section of square tube and cut matching holes, glue the stub axle into the tube, use pins to set and hold the wheels in place
Easy cheesy
EDIT
It is a very good idea.
I'm leaning towards roller blade/scooter wheels permanently mounted coz small and light. And there is a shop nearby I can source the bits. Only issue is I'd probably mount a wheel individually on each of the inner sides of the fins. The inner side is vertical whilst the outer face is angled. Might need to add some reinforcement but have plenty of plastic and aluminium offcuts.
 

DPS Driver

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They might be more of a hindrance than a help. Particularly when you hit the snow.

Looking at it side on the fins actually make it less stable. I'd give it a trial first without. You may even want to get rid of the fins as well and flatten the tail section.

Do what we do with our racing skis and clip the wheels on to drag it across to the creek. Plenty of options for that and it doesn't interfere with the intended operation.
 
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teleroo

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With a little time for thought and some web research, I think I'm gonna mount scooter wheels inside the rear fins, centred on the contact point when the front of the sled is lifted. Should be pretty much entirely out of the way when sled is flat.
Only major draw back is I'll need to cut two wheel size holes in the bottom surface of the fins. Which could allow water/snow into the sled. But maybe they'll let the water out if it happens to be raining as well??

IMG_20200611_132730~2.jpg


The possibility of doing this has turned out to be a bit of an unexpected bonus for me and will make the sled a lot more manageable on pavement. Big wheely bag basically. Off to scooter shop on the weekend it is then.
 

DPS Driver

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With a little time for thought and some web research, I think I'm gonna mount scooter wheels inside the rear fins, centred on the contact point when the front of the sled is lifted. Should be pretty much entirely out of the way when sled is flat.
Only major draw back is I'll need to cut two wheel size holes in the bottom surface of the fins. Which could allow water/snow into the sled. But maybe they'll let the water out if it happens to be raining as well??

IMG_20200611_132730~2.jpg


The possibility of doing this has turned out to be a bit of an unexpected bonus for me and will make the sled a lot more manageable on pavement. Big wheely bag basically. Off to scooter shop on the weekend it is then.
Some of those skis actually do have a plastic wheel in between the fins for that purpose. Good score.
 

No Training Heels

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I've been following this thread with interest.

I've used a Paris brand (I think?) plastic toboggan, that I've modified over the years (using lots of info from this forum).

Initial use was with a simple rope for towing a child and lunch when XC skiing. Having the pulk slide into the back of legs was annoying.

Next mod was to run ropes through electrical conduit. Stiff enough, with some flexibility for turns or falls.

I attach to a pack - a simple belt will ride down quickly - shoulder straps help a lot.

I'll get some photos to illustrate.
 

teleroo

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I've been following this thread with interest.

I've used a Paris brand (I think?) plastic toboggan, that I've modified over the years (using lots of info from this forum).

Initial use was with a simple rope for towing a child and lunch when XC skiing. Having the pulk slide into the back of legs was annoying.

Next mod was to run ropes through electrical conduit. Stiff enough, with some flexibility for turns or falls.

I attach to a pack - a simple belt will ride down quickly - shoulder straps help a lot.

I'll get some photos to illustrate.
I've got the conduit for the poles. Heavy duty 25mm stuff. I also have a set of salvaged DAC aluminium tent poles that I am considering running through the middle as well, just to add some extra resilience. They don't add too much extra stiffness but I'm thinking will give a bit more flex control. Perhaps overkill?

But am thinking of attaching somehow to back pack belt. I'll be carrying a back pack anyways. Just need to make sure the pull load is transmitted to solid points on the belt and harness.
15921076314156945367357160007094.jpg


I'll run some 6mm static prussick cord in a big U through the pull rods, with the loop end inserted into the drilled holes in the sled sides. Within the sled, I'll use 25mm webbing and a buckle to pull the cord tight. At the belt end, I'll attach the two free ends of the cord to a carabiner to clip onto belt.

Basically following these directions
https://www.rei.com/blog/snowsports/diy-make-your-own-pulk-sled
 

No Training Heels

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Lots of good info on the rei.com website.

I've found it helps to minimise 'slop' in the system - more control and less energy 'fighting' against the weight of pulk.

Photos of my attachment system (I can't find my poles at the moment)

Hex heads to be cut off the M12 bolts, then expoxy glued into conduit tubes.

IMG_20200614_123024146.jpg
 
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Moondog55

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Wheels.... installed
IMG_20200613_084426.jpg


Next job is to sort pull poles and belt attachment.
Nice and a good use of what you have.
I now use crossed pulling poles but have used straight ones in the past, trunnions make the best connectors although the 12mm is a bit OT, 8mm is plenty strong enough. Look at fibreglass electric fence poles too, they epoxy well to the steel of the trunnions when sleeved with a section of tubing
Fibreglass tent poles work well too if you buy the after market type sold at BCF and epoxy them together but electrical conduit is the best cheap solution and strong enough when rope is threaded down the middle
 
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No Training Heels

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Agree - rope down the centre of conduit works well!

Earlier mods - I ended up doing eye splices in layed (3 strand) 12mm poly anchor rope - eyes worked well!
 
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No Training Heels

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Rope down centre of conduit:

The fatter the rope - the better.

Fill the conduit void - reduces chance of kink / bend in conduit if it is 'filled' properly?
 

No Training Heels

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I'm unsure if those "hip pins" are a good idea?

I"ve seen better ideas with tape loops and carabiner locks?

Less 'slop'

I'll try to find photo examples for you tomorrow?
 

teleroo

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I'm unsure if those "hip pins" are a good idea?

I"ve seen better ideas with tape loops and carabiner locks?

Less 'slop'

I'll try to find photo examples for you tomorrow?
Agreed re pins. Too much force going through those eyelets. Am planning more on webbing loops as biner attachment points. Have to wait a few days to get prussick cord though.
 

teleroo

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Poles and tensioning system good to go. As I mentioned above, I've got a set of DAC aluminium tent poles inside the PVC conduit for extra beef.
IMG_20200620_144147.jpg
 
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teleroo

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This is how I've chosen to attach the pull carabiners. Important here to avoid slop in the system, so I've gone with stopper knots around the carabiner shanks. Not entirely sure how this will go in real life. Has to sync with the harness attachment as well, which I'm still working on. I do have some wider, locking biners, not sure if they'd be better?
15926289587979060321014861148878.jpg
 

teleroo

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Out doing some greenfield sled testing. 20kg on board. Wheels worked a treat on pavement.
IMG_20200624_114933.jpg


Fiddled around with the attachment to the pack harness. This is probably something I'd reconfigure for a trans-Antarctic trek but got a working arrangement happening that will do ski tube to Perisher lodge.
IMG_20200624_121040.jpg


At this point, happy to award Initial Operating Certificate. Probably can't see myself skiing with it due to downhill skis, but I reckon I can manage a 1km trudge along the oversnow route.
 
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