Trip Report Faithful's hut/BHP.Pre BC XC season visit .May 20/2019

Mister Tee on XC Skis

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Hi. Your correspondent in the field went to Buckety plain and Faithful's hut on the Bogong High Plains ( BHP)and surveyed the area for a Trap yard Gap type BHP BC XC ski trip this August . .

If anyone is interested in coming with me for such a multi night snow camping and snow sports adventure then please PM me . Planning ahead is a useful activity.

Photos are coming soon.:)
 
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Mister Tee on XC Skis

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The door on the hut at Faithful's hut at Buckety Plain does not close properly from the inside. It needs a proper latch arrangement installed . All I could do was tie some rope to the door frame to a hook near the door handle so that it can be closed in some fashion from the inside.
I left a spare pen for the hut log book. What is it with these horsey types?. They all write in the hut log book "bring back the cattle!" . FFS!.
I may or may not have carried a supply drop into the vicinity and cannot confirm or deny such a task was carried out. I also collected & carried some fallen dead wood , cut it up and put it inside the hut. I think in hindsight I should have cut up a lot more wood because it only takes one fire crazed knuckle dragger to burn most of it in one drunken evening before the gates to the BHP road are sealed shut on June 11th 2019 until November.
I did note that some rock ape with an axe had cutdown some green snow gums and I reported that to the Ranger at PV in Mt. Beauty.
The weather deteriorated after lunch and driving back past Cope Hut and over the dam wall was almost akin to driving blind , such was the thickness of the fog coupled with steady drizzle. It was miserable and going for a walk after completing the above tasks was not an inviting prospect. It was still not cold enough to snow even at the highest point where the road almost hits 1700 M. ASL near Cope Hut.
Later driving down the hill past the Clover arboretum and along the Kiewa Valley I saw some fine deciduous trees in autumnal splendour.
As a BC XC skier I think this hut would make a good base for coming in from Trap yard gap. The Hut is too big and drafty to be efficient to heat but some kind of shelter with a fire in the evening plus
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the stream next door are inviting. The Pit Loo is 700 M. up the hill at Buckety Plain camping ground. It is steep enough to require skins or snow shoes. It is approximately 7 kms from the winter gate on the Mitta Mitta side of the BHP road. The descent from Cope hut, if one were to ski out towards the Rover Chalet via the Langford west aqueduct and return via the BHP road ensures a speedy return to base via the BHP road as an ungroomed XC ski route back to the hut.
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Mister Tee on XC Skis

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More kindling in the hut to remain handy and dry. I should have cut up more wood. I will definitely do more next time!. Someone had left some wood under the verandah but in a blizzard such wood would become snow bound and not very useful once wet and frozen. I put that wood indoors. The long logs on the outdoor fireplace were dry and I cut those up too and put them under cover as well.
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snowgum

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Interesting adventure MrT.

It would appear many horsey types like their water being fouled and streambeds trampled and eroded. Oh & more flies too.

They’re probably mostly locals or friends. & therefore more likely to be or know a cattle family.
 

Xplora

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What is it with these horsey types?. They all write in the hut log book "bring back the cattle!" . FFS!.
Not all horsey people think that way. The people I ride with are happy the cattle are gone. In time the rest will realise it is a lost cause and then it will just be a muttering around the fire. At the moment, most of their angst is about removing the feral horses and when that is done we will hear the whinging for a while and it will go as well.
I think in hindsight I should have cut up a lot more wood because it only takes one fire crazed knuckle dragger to burn most of it in one drunken evening before the gates to the BHP road are sealed shut on June 11th 2019 until November.
I think the walk to the hut sorts this sort of person out. Leaving more wood to burn may only encourage people to have bigger fires. Leaving enough for the next person and then they can replace it is a better option and then we won't have huts burnt down. I have never been a fan of Faithfuls hut. As you say, big and drafty. Not particularly appealing for a winter camp but there is good water.
 

snowgum

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Not all horsey people think that way. The people I ride with are happy the cattle are gone. In time the rest will realise it is a lost cause and then it will just be a muttering around the fire. At the moment, most of their angst is about removing the feral horses and when that is done we will hear the whinging for a while and it will go as well.

I think the walk to the hut sorts this sort of person out. Leaving more wood to burn may only encourage people to have bigger fires. Leaving enough for the next person and then they can replace it is a better option and then we won't have huts burnt down. I have never been a fan of Faithfuls hut. As you say, big and drafty. Not particularly appealing for a winter camp but there is good water.

Perhaps Faithful is a good spot to pitch your tent inside if it's really foul outside??

Longterm: could this hut be added to the list for an upgrade?
 

Mister Tee on XC Skis

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Perhaps Faithful is a good spot to pitch your tent inside if it's really foul outside??

Longterm: could this hut be added to the list for an upgrade?
The hut is still structurally sound but could use some insulation of some sort .If one were to take this up with the High country huts association I am not sure much would happen. BHP Huts seem to do well if a XC ski or bushwalking club adopt them and maintain them. That would be a good.
In fact the fireplace seems to be one of those where the heat will just go up the chimney and the hut remains as cold as an ALP right wing factional hack's conscience ;-P .
Edmondson's hut is like that in snow season , I know that from having snow camped out there a few seasons back. A proper pot belly wood burner would be a good addition to Faithful's hut . I know a volunteer has installed such a unit into the Langford Gap hut and it has made a big difference.
Faithful's hut has two separate rooms. Pitching the free standing 4 seasons tent in the other room could be a good idea in snow season.
The Hut Log book showed that in 2018 only a ski troop of eight VMTC skiers went there in white season. So it is not heavily frequented in white season by even hardy nordic skiers.
 

skifree

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could use some insulation of some sort
A what point do you stop upgrading a hut?

If it is intended to be an emergency shelter only (and there should not be any need for such a thing these days) based on a heritage site should it not be only maintained within some constraints governed by heritage values.
 

Ubiquitous Steve

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Skifree talks nonsense!

Change is necessary sometimes..

Skifree needs to enlighten his ideas!
Team Bears shake their heads!
Embrace change for the good of the majority.


We can all play Tunnel tents and camp out even in the worst conditions.
But don’t subject the rest of us to your rigid ideas of enjoyment!

Skifree....maybe have a look at the Ropers and Weston’s Hut rebuilds before shooting of your mouth!They we’re done with Parks Vicco approval and they contributed in a major way throughout!

Weston’s and Ropers Hut have set a new bench mark for adhering to historic design but going with sane new concepts ....including insulation and state of the art wooden stoves in alcoves that preserve the hut appearance from the outside .

Perhaps moderators should let discussion flow in this regard and not impose their old fashioned ideals in this forum.Cheers!

Perhaps stick to providing us with maps...we like that!

Emergency shelter my asse ....are you reading from National Parks Mantra or something?
Many folk enjoy being able to sit in those huts and to eat and share meals in those huts.They don’t exist as purely emergency shelters!

Skifree you need to get out bush more often and breathe the bush air....perhaps your judgment has been clouded from too many lattes in the inner subs talking too the Green Voters!
 
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skifree

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I think I was asking a question not stating a manifesto. No need to go off on a high horse.

And my question was at what point do you stop with the upgrading of a hut? What limits are there? Any there any limits?
 

Mister Tee on XC Skis

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I think I was asking a question not stating a manifesto. No need to go off on a high horse.

And my question was at what point do you stop with the upgrading of a hut? What limits are there? Any there any limits?
Recently in my peripatetic mountain activities I went to MUMC hut. The hut 's insulation and weatherproof functions are being upgraded with assistance by a possible helicopter drop of necessary materials from PV. I also attended the Mt. Bogong Club working bee. The Club has upgraded CC Hut quite a bit. It has gravity fed wood fire heated hot water, solar electricity, a gas cook top in the kitchen , and bunk beds etc. It is in winter a club house and a warm and safe refuge for BC XC snow sports people who are club members.
Mt. No. 3 refuge Hut in the broader Mt. Stirling area is not just a survival hut. The Mansfield XC ski club use it as a base in winter. It has a very smart wood burner like the one you see at the Schlink hut in the K.N.P..
Faithful's hut may have been originally constructed by cattle drovers as a Green Season shelter. We know the BHP can turn on some very poor weather at any time of the year so a hut makes sense. However the moo cows are now banned from defiling and degrading the fragile sub alpine and alpine eco systems that are found in the Oz Alps . So the hut is now for recreational use. That is how I see it and in white season sitting in front of a fire between 5-9 pm makes the end of each XC ski day so much better all round.Even if huts such as the Razorback huts at Mt. Stirling and Edmondson's hut on the BHP are totally devoid of insulation and are colder than Peter Spud Dutton's tiny black heart, so what ? …. we BC XC people like using these huts.
Moreover last season it snowed so much at The Razorback huts that when @pegasusSki returned from his day on the planks he found that his tent had collapsed under the weight of a continuously heavy snowfall of biblical proportions, esp. for that low elevation . Thankfully the hut was there as a Plan B. With some help from me with my trusty snow shovel we managed to excavate his tent and relocate his camp to inside the Razorback Hut.
Incidentally I have voted GREEN for most of my life.They are not perfect but they are better than the Lib Labs any day. I don't drink coffee though and I don't wear black that often either ; -P .
 
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Mister Tee on XC Skis

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Ubiquitous Steve

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Team Bears say we need to establish a school for “Common Sense”in the backcountry!

After rigorous schooling.....we have a field day..No not digging pits and looking for zonal discontinuity.....but as follows.....
We put our scholars through three hours of blizzard like condition on skis while carrying packs.......
.
Then they get to jot down points involving functional upgrades to huts that could be useful.:whistle:
We do allow for some difficulty analysing their papers as writing skills may be a little taxed.
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The object of our field exercise to to drive folk down the right end of this graphic.....then they are able to make better sense of the hut upgrade program....but sometimes we need to intervene and carry them out to hospital!
 

Xplora

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Faithfuls hut was only ever built to be a summer type hut for the cattle and horse operations. Now people think it needs upgrading to make it suitable for those who cannot BC in winter without the comforts of a hut. PV are looking to place slow combustion heating in all these huts for winter use but it depends on use and this hut does not get much winter use. Why? I would have thought that was obvious. All the cattle families who had huts were given the option of tearing them down or leaving them to stand. They stand as they are.

This hut was built in 1962 for a purpose and now we think that it is not good enough for the current day user intentions and needs insulation or a rebuild. Might as well build luxury accommodation for the Falls to Hotham walk. Those people need their expectations met as well. So many people full of contradiction in their opinion. OK to have huts as long as they are free. The rebuilt huts were as a result of fire and they were built to a more modern (and exacting) standard which included insulation but that does not mean we build more or renovate the existing to meet the needs of those who do not want to pay money for a bed. This hut can provide a refuge but in reality it is not on the path most travel. If you were stuck it would save your life.

I know the Faithful's very well and for some time. We are good friends. They understand they have no further say in what goes with this hut but is seems some here feel they have a greater ownership of this hut than those who built it. Maybe so as it is now owned by the crown but it was NEVER built for the refuge of skiers and it could have been torn down by the owners. Get over it you self righteous folk and enjoy what you have.

My apologies for what may appear to be writing in contravention of forum guidelines for trip reports. This was not really a BC trip report and the content was led directly by posts from the OP.
 
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Mister Tee on XC Skis

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Faithfuls hut was only ever built to be a summer type hut for the cattle and horse operations. Now people think it needs upgrading to make it suitable for those who cannot BC in winter without the comforts of a hut. PV are looking to place slow combustion heating in all these huts for winter use but it depends on use and this hut does not get much winter use. Why? I would have thought that was obvious. All the cattle families who had huts were given the option of tearing them down or leaving them to stand. They stand as they are.

This hut was built in 1962 for a purpose and now we think that it is not good enough for the current day user intentions and needs insulation or a rebuild. Might as well build luxury accommodation for the Falls to Hotham walk. Those people need their expectations met as well. So many people full of contradiction in their opinion. OK to have huts as long as they are free. The rebuilt huts were as a result of fire and they were built to a more modern (and exacting) standard which included insulation but that does not mean we build more or renovate the existing to meet the needs of those who do not want to pay money for a bed. This hut can provide a refuge but in reality it is not on the path most travel. If you were stuck it would save your life.

I know the Faithful's very well and for some time. We are good friends. They understand they have no further say in what goes with this hut but is seems some here feel they have a greater ownership of this hut than those who built it. Maybe so as it is now owned by the crown but it was NEVER built for the refuge of skiers and it could have been torn down by the owners. Get over it you self righteous folk and enjoy what you have.

My apologies for what may appear to be writing in contravention of forum guidelines for trip reports. This was not really a BC trip report and the content was led directly by posts from the OP.
I was merely offering possible suggestions and having a discussion , having visited Faithful's hut this week and proffered a trip report. I am always fully equipped to survive a blizzard in a tried and tested 4 seasons tent and matching equipment. I do enjoy using the High Country huts. I hardly ever sleep in them . I try to do my bit to look after them, cut wood for the next person and maintain access routes to some of them. I cannot see anything wrong with that.
 

Ubiquitous Steve

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Faithfuls hut was only ever built to be a summer type hut for the cattle and horse operations. Now people think it needs upgrading to make it suitable for those who cannot BC in winter without the comforts of a hut. PV are looking to place slow combustion heating in all these huts for winter use but it depends on use and this hut does not get much winter use. Why? I would have thought that was obvious. All the cattle families who had huts were given the option of tearing them down or leaving them to stand. They stand as they are.

This hut was built in 1962 for a purpose and now we think that it is not good enough for the current day user intentions and needs insulation or a rebuild. Might as well build luxury accommodation for the Falls to Hotham walk. Those people need their expectations met as well. So many people full of contradiction in their opinion. OK to have huts as long as they are free. The rebuilt huts were as a result of fire and they were built to a more modern (and exacting) standard which included insulation but that does not mean we build more or renovate the existing to meet the needs of those who do not want to pay money for a bed. This hut can provide a refuge but in reality it is not on the path most travel. If you were stuck it would save your life.

I know the Faithful's very well and for some time. We are good friends. They understand they have no further say in what goes with this hut but is seems some here feel they have a greater ownership of this hut than those who built it. Maybe so as it is now owned by the crown but it was NEVER built for the refuge of skiers and it could have been torn down by the owners. Get over it you self righteous folk and enjoy what you have.

My apologies for what may appear to be writing in contravention of forum guidelines for trip reports. This was not really a BC trip report and the content was led directly by posts from the OP.
Usual garbarge thrown out by Xplora !
Just don’t do anything...perhaps let it fall diwn..
Oh we like that bit where proposing some minor work would be akin to the commercial development of the FHAW.You love sliding out in that direction but it bullshit!
Maccas (Dinner Plain) had extensive work done on it to keep it up...they also replaced the interior insulation at the time.It was not a total rebuild.
Note the work that’s been done at Cope Hut?
Xplora time you started to move with the times young man!

So it’s alright to put the hideous tent platforms in...as we see around Cope Hut but it’s not ok to do any minor work like fixing up the door latch or possibly replacing the open fire with a more environmentally friendly wood stove.Remember Weston’s had an open fireplace but now it has a wood stove ditto Ropers Hut???

Maybe I better point out to Parks Vicco that blocking up the holes between the logs in Maccas(Dinner Plain) is not allowable ...even using the old system of mud and slithers of wood.Perhaps they must be allowed to stay as this is in accord with xplora view of things!And they rebuilt the wood shelter too!!!
 

snowgum

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I get your giste Xplora. I agree with a lot of your commentary on this site.

But I don't think us skiers or walkers even, should feel guilty about wanting to and even doing hug improvements - should that happen, be legal and affordable and so forth. I think Europe, Tassie & NZ have shown the way. It doesn't have to be the Hilton or a palace to provide warm shelter for say half dozen skiers or walkers.

I certainly wouldn't be dancing on the ashes of our hardy mtn cattleman, just because they're not grazing on the high plains. But it it doesn't mean the hut should stay drafty and near useless in winter either.

Surely there's a sensible middle? Maybe it's time for PV input or possibly assistance?

My two cents

And yes, another softy green voter. LibNats don't give two hoots for the natural environment these days and Labor flap their gums a lot without doing much. Generally. Very sad state of affairs in the land of Oz!
 

Ubiquitous Steve

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It’s good Mr T is presenting some good ways of entering BHP from the Shannonvale side.
It is nice to enter the alpine environment from the “quiet” side of the BHP Rd.

It’s well protected from bad weather ...as Mr T points out Faithfulls could provide good first point access when planning a trip.Also one could use this as a base to push out on long day trips to other areas of the high plains.
Regardless of some posters ideas ....you are entitled to enjoy yourself ...sitting by a fire in a hut is quite an acceptable pastime in winter.
Skiers that are new to this area /less experienced skiers too can build up their skills.They have the psychological back up of two huts in the area.Maccnamarras and Faithfulls.Further along....and starting to get into the full “weather” you got Cope Hut to sit in while having a bite to eat!
So good on Mr T for providing this information .....also fir folks on a limited budget there are no Carpark fees to be concerned about.

Team Bears will let Mr T eleborate further on this access route and the quality of huts that he has assessed.
 

Mister Tee on XC Skis

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For those considering a Trap Yard Gap BHP trip , you will need a AWD/ 4WD car , with off road tyres if possible , wheel chains and a chainsaw to get up to the winter gate. A snow shovel could be handy if you need to dig the car out after a snow storm.
 
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Xplora

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Skifree....maybe have a look at the Ropers and Weston’s Hut rebuilds before shooting of your mouth!They we’re done with Parks Vicco approval and they contributed in a major way throughout!
And how is any of this related to an existing hut? Its doesn't.
And my question was at what point do you stop with the upgrading of a hut? What limits are there? Any there any limits?
To answer this and your initial question, yes there are limits and all work has to be approved by PV. I see nothing wrong with people wanting to be involved in protecting these assets but that should be done within constraints already established. There are some who feel they can take it upon themselves to decide what needs to be done and forget about involving the land manager. If Faithfuls hut had a significance in winter then it may get on the list for a new wood heater to make it more efficient and less likely to be burnt down. Fitzgeralds hut was going to get a heater but there was significant objection from those who built it.
I was merely offering possible suggestions and having a discussion , having visited Faithful's hut this week and proffered a trip report.
I was merely saying that if you have suggestions for work to be done then send it to the proper place instead of trying to arrange for a random to do it and I don't consider a driving tour to be a BC trip report. Perhaps it should be moved as discussion on these matters do not conform with the forum guidelines for trip reports.
Emergency shelter my asse ....are you reading from National Parks Mantra or something?
Many folk enjoy being able to sit in those huts and to eat and share meals in those huts.They don’t exist as purely emergency shelters!
PV do not attest to the building and maintaining of huts for the purpose of emergency shelters but the fact is many of these huts do provide that function. Faithfuls hut will provide more than adequate shelter from the elements and the fireplace will provide warmth. Nothing stopping the sharing of meals and conversation. The suggestion is that is not good enough and it has to be upgraded to meet the standard of the new user when in fact is it only by the grace of the Faithful family it is still standing. Put your case forward in writing and send it to PV. You can post it here and I will forward it on your behalf. Your previous suggestions have been to knock down and rebuild Blairs hut because it does not meet the Team Bears standard. Maybe you can start with that?
@snowgum I think I have answered most of your post in the above. While I am not trying in any way to rebuke what you have said, I see a great hypocrisy among some who have vehemently opposed the building of up market accommodation for BC travellers and then propose upgrading huts and building new huts to suit the traveller who does not want to pay for the convenience. The re-building of Maddisons hut near T spur was one suggestion so it could take the pressure of Cleve Cole hut. The question from @skifree is spot on. There are limits. I see this hut providing a function in all seasons as it is.
 

Moondog55

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Keep in mind that parks are very much under-funded; also keep in mind that parks have a Top-Down dislike of huts and seem to be resistant to providing any facilities at all sometimes; perhaps a reflection of how various governments don't really value our outdoors areas.
 

Bogong

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I've been metaphorically standing to one side and observing the debate.

To me it seems that huts are "good things" for at least three reasons:
  • They are an important and life saving safety refuge.
  • They provide a physical reminder of the historical past of the mountains. That our forebears in a place worked there in mining, grazing, hydro electricity, ski tourism, etc.
  • They improve amenity and make backcountry adventures seem less hard core, thus making our wonderful mountains more appealing to more people.
Personally I have no trouble with a few more huts in the mountains, say to rebuild Maddisons Hut or even revive the idea of Hull Hut on Quartz Ridge to "take the pressure off Cleve Cole Hut" as Xplora puts it, so long as they are discreet and not in your face.* I think the aggressive anti huts stance of 40 to 50 years ago has gone. Those who like huts can use them, but there should also be lots of hut-free, nice campsites with water and shelter for people who prefer that option.

* The only exception is the Feathertop Bungalow which I have a personal obsession with. Under a Bogong Regime this would be rebuilt to be a nice 28 bed hotel again and if it sticks out, I don't really care what others think.
 

Boodwah

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I've been metaphorically standing to one side and observing the debate.

To me it seems that huts are "good things" for at least three reasons:
  • They are an important and life saving safety refuge.
  • They provide a physical reminder of the historical past of the mountains. That our forebears in a place worked there in mining, grazing, hydro electricity, ski tourism, etc.
  • They improve amenity and make backcountry adventures seem less hard core, thus making our wonderful mountain more appealing to more people.
Personally I have no trouble with a few more huts in the mountains, say to rebuild Maddisons Hut or even revive the idea of Hull Hut on Quartz Ridge to "take the pressure off Cleve Cole Hut" as Xplora puts it, so long as they are discreet and not in your face.* I think the aggressive anti huts stance of 40 to 50 years ago has gone. Those who like huts can use them, but there should also be lots of hut-free, nice campsites with water and shelter for people who prefer that option.

* The only exception is the Feathertop Bungalow which I have a personal obsession with. Under a Bogong Regime this would be rebuilt as a nice 28 bed hotel and if it sticks out, I don't really care what others think.
Tasteful well placed hut on north Razorback has my vote - and I also dont understand why some of the newly renovated huts, like westons (or even federation) for example are given a new stove but made completely open and uninsulated so impossible to warm.
 

Bogong

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Tasteful well placed hut on north Razorback has my vote - and I also dont understand why some of the newly renovated huts, like westons (or even federation) for example are given a new stove but made completely open and uninsulated so impossible to warm.
Yep, we could start a list of our top five areas we would like to see "tasteful and well placed huts" and give poor Xplora conniptions. Mine would be:

North Razorback, Quartz Ridge, Camp Creek on Mt Speculation, top of Stanley Name Spur, Hellfire Creek between Magdala and Howitt, The Knobs - Mt Clear area of course rebuilding the Feathertop Bungalow.
 

Xplora

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give poor Xplora conniptions
Gee thanks. And I thought you were a nice bloke. You can talk all you like about building more huts but that is all it will be. I also have no objection if people feel there should be more huts. It is an opinion you are entitled to have and one I don't share. I just object if those same people are hypocritical. From what I recall, you were in favour of building a hut on High Knob if it was open to all. You at least have been consistent.
Xplora's obsession with things being very ORDERLY and rules and regulations it not always something I always agree with. He should have taken more LSD in his 20's and lived in the Indian Sub continent for while.
;-P
So your answer is take drugs? At least you don't have children. The rules, as you say, have been put in place to stop numb nuts who think they know what is best from stuffing things up. It is not up to you to muck around with the heritage of the area. Your concepts also do not align well with the organisation you are so fondly are part of. An organisation which has achieved many things working within the system. Some may say not all things were good but at least they were consistent with their values. Perhaps you should reconsider your affiliation.
 
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Bogong

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More woke than thou.
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Xplora I was just joking as it's highly unlikely that huts will ever be built at those locations. I genuinely try to be "a nice bloke" so I'm sorry if my light hearted comment actually did give you 'conniptions'.

Actually it's my understanding that a nicely fitted out hut was built in one of the places I mentioned. When I was writing those 3 paragraph quick and dirty hut histories for the KHA website at the turn of the century and providing 'historical advice' for Klaus Hueneke's Vic huts book. I got a few messages from non connected people about a secret hut in a discreet and remote but useful location. I won't say exactly where it was, but I understand it was consumed in the '03, '06 or '09 fires. But I never saw it in person or even a photo of it, so I can't be sure it was where people told me it was. If anyone can shed light on it, please PM me.
 
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slotele

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I have found Faithfulls to be pretty marginal in terms of snow cover in early August. Even in the best year 2016? I think, heading down there it was not skiable and a sloshy bootpack down from the road. It's also right in the corner of the map, day trips from there you spend a lot of time and energy just getting to where you can start your tour. If you are using it as an entry gate then go for it, presumably the ability to drive your food and gear in and leave your car there at the end of a infrequently traveled road appeals to some. I'm pretty happy leaving the car in Mt Beauty and taking the bus up to Windy Corner to get on to the BHP.
 

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Xplora

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Xplora I was just joking as it's highly unlikely that huts will ever be built at those locations. I genuinely try to be "a nice bloke" so I'm sorry if my light hearted comment actually did give you 'conniptions'.
I took it the way you meant and was just kidding back. I don't use emoticons (because I think they are stupid) so sometimes people read it the wrong way. You and I do not always share the same view but we do share the same love of the high country and its history. I have never taken offence to anything you have written which is in disagreement to me. Contrary to what some may think, I like a good debate and varied opinion. Prefer to have those discussions with the adults on the forum.
 

Ubiquitous Steve

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Blairs Hut will probably fall down before Parks do anything to restore it!

Team Bears temporary fix on the window is still no doubt there some seven years after we took action on the busted window!:p

Parks are well aware of its condition ....we are still waiting patiently to see them organising themselves to rebuilt Blair’s??:(

Xplora ...do you reckon the “adults”in Parks Vicco are competent or are they just complacent.:thumbs:
The so called iconic walk from Falls to Hotham goes via Blair’s ?
Would it not be somewhat important to perform some work down here with all that money they have for
Glossy Photos and graphics that have been churned out so far?:eek:

Again I don’t need to contact Parks Vicco ....they are well aware of the situation but fail to get off their asses!

But you could remind us to “contact Parks Vicco”....well that’s how you usually respond.
But nothing gets done.....sounds like a tactic to me to avoid any action.:thumbs:

But while Team Bears formulate and complete new projects we will wait patiently to see if anything happens before the glaciers of the world have shrunk a further ten kilometers or so!o_O

Now Xplora are there any tracks that could require Team Bears intervention ?
How did the group of track clearer’s go up there on Mt Wills?Did the project get back on track?:whistle:
Team Bears know you just love our organized chainsaw walking tours!
We encourage you to come next time we check on Longspur...we have a special package for “Adults”and discounts for forum members!
 

Xplora

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@Ubiquitous Steve
Back to ignoring you or should I say putting you in the corner. The day you offer something valuable to any discussion that is above the level of a 6th grader then I will be the first to acknowledge it. :zzz::crap::emoji_monkey::deadhorse::puke::gives::clap::cry_ubb::headbang::doh:
I figure you can read all those to get my meaning. Like I said, I think emiticons are stupid but others love them.
 

Mister Tee on XC Skis

Not your average unconventional eccentric.
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Melbourne, Lockdown-i-stan .
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Gee thanks. And I thought you were a nice bloke. You can talk all you like about building more huts but that is all it will be. I also have no objection if people feel there should be more huts. It is an opinion you are entitled to have and one I don't share. I just object if those same people are hypocritical. From what I recall, you were in favour of building a hut on High Knob if it was open to all. You at least have been consistent.

So your answer is take drugs? At least you don't have children. The rules, as you say, have been put in place to stop numb nuts who think they know what is best from stuffing things up. It is not up to you to muck around with the heritage of the area. Your concepts also do not align well with the organisation you are so fondly are part of. An organisation which has achieved many things working within the system. Some may say not all things were good but at least they were consistent with their values. Perhaps you should reconsider your affiliation.
I was joking. Have you had a humour by pass operation?. Don't worry I was not being serious. That is your job.

Now how have I exactly mucked around with the heritage of the area?. I replaced a pen , cut some fallen timber and put it inside the hut and tied a rope around a hook so you can close the door of the hut from the inside. I am clearly a vandal and should withdraw my support of the VNPA. Bah Humbug!.
 

Ubiquitous Steve

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The other thing about new Frenchman's Cap hut is that it removed an asbestos rodent ridden eyesore. The new one came in flat-packs and all the old rubbish was removed.
I have seen this on tv.
No sane reason why we cannot do things like that ...in the right areas with strict environmental safeguards ...we don’t need to cling to this philosophy that prevents any change what so ever.

The hut out near Mt Loch on AWT is a useful one that supports Cross country skiers and those travellling longer distances.These huts are valuable assets ......

.I don’t think anybody is suggesting putting huts in all over the place....when we replace some or build new ones we should be using the best technology available!
 

Ubiquitous Steve

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Excellent response from Xplora.
Parks Field Officer is doing us a great service.
Protocol and guidelines to follow ...you must get exhausted with your work load?We can see that consultation involving more senior members is a necessity.


Suppose we will have to find out from other sources whether Mt Wills got track work carried out other than that completed earlier from Team Bears!

Not to worry....Team Bears are liaising with some six graders who say they are up for the job of replacing the bolt on Faithfulls Door.Well we don’t want to over stretch the Parks with these complex jobs....outsourcing to primary school kids seems the go!:love:

Mod edit, picture removed, not relevant.
 

currawong

Old but not so Crusty
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I took it the way you meant and was just kidding back. I don't use emoticons (because I think they are stupid) so sometimes people read it the wrong way. You and I do not always share the same view but we do share the same love of the high country and its history. I have never taken offence to anything you have written which is in disagreement to me. Contrary to what some may think, I like a good debate and varied opinion. Prefer to have those discussions with the adults on the forum.
Can i like this 100 times?
Civil and respectful discussion of diverse opinions - long may it live in these forums
 

Ubiquitous Steve

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Team Bears will nominate Xplora for best Field Officer of the decade for Parks Vicco....

We have never seen a man that can match his passion for the paperwork required and who embraces the values of our National Parks Service and above all values the contributions of his contemporaries in the field.
My we are blessed to have such a man in our midst!:whistle:
 

Ubiquitous Steve

Part of the Furniture
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Can i like this 100 times?
Civil and respectful discussion of diverse opinions - long may it live in these forums
And please no picking on those six graders....even Team Bears have respect for our younger members should they join this forum .
 

Xplora

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Now how have I exactly mucked around with the heritage of the area?

https://www.bunnings.com.au/barrel-bolt-throw-delf-75x25x8mm-satin-chrome_p0013334
If anyone is heading up to Faithful's hut before the BHP road shuts in a couple of weeks then could you take one of these things and a suitable screwdriver?. The hut door does not close properly from the inside. It is a quick repair job and the parts only cost 10 or 12 clams from Bunnings.

It starts like this. You make a suggestion for a random to start doing work on a hut. You then start suggesting the hut should be upgraded and the next thing we have a bunch of randoms doing stuff on huts without any permission. Whoa!! Already happening. The public owns this hut now and you are not enough of the public to decide what happens to it. Put your ideas forward for consideration and if they are worthy then things will get done. Remember so much whinging about Langford Gap hut and the door. How was it fixed? Not by you or by the whinger. You have discovered Faithfuls hut and you think it is a great location for your BC skiing base but now you want it refurbished to suit your needs. Perhaps when you know more you will work things out but all I see is a windsock. Resign from the VNPA, it doesn't suit you.

Please don't take offense to the above, I was just joking. At least I wasn't tripping. The Bears and his blocks can go and have a look at what was done for himself on the AAWT. Who beyond the 3rd grade talks about himself in the 3rd person and plays with teddy bears anyway?
 

Ubiquitous Steve

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We asked you what was done on the Mt Wills Track....

Since you are dodging around this issue....we can only conclude that no ...zero work was carried out!
Again we see Xplora has gained his nomination for FO of decade for NP service for his outstanding contributions!
 

Mister Tee on XC Skis

Not your average unconventional eccentric.
Ski Pass
Jul 29, 2015
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Melbourne, Lockdown-i-stan .
soundcloud.com
Still joking?
Yes, I like a joke and a laugh , what about you ?. WTF do you know about me? .I have not had anything stronger than a cup of tea for nearly 15 years so who is the intoxicated and very irresponsible and cavalier National Park user on the loose?. Apparently I have transgressed according your standards!! Woeful day , pitiful hour!
I shall continue to support the VNPA and pay my yearly membership. I am also campaigning to save a number of other natural places that are soon to be trashed and spoiled by big business and fossil fuel companies as well as volunteering to assist people seeking asylum.
I shall continue to contribute to this skiing and outdoors based website but I am now 'ignoring' @Xplora and another forum member whose online name I shall not divulge. By the way The Team leader is an eccentric and the world needs more harmless eccentrics.
 

snowgum

A Local
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At least we have some debate here people.
Now if only PV reps would head out and meet stakeholders regularly, perhaps we might feel they're taking notice - even if change is glacial.
 

Ubiquitous Steve

Part of the Furniture
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Feb 29, 2008
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It starts like this. You make a suggestion for a random to start doing work on a hut. You then start suggesting the hut should be upgraded and the next thing we have a bunch of randoms doing stuff on huts without any permission. Whoa!! Already happening. The public owns this hut now and you are not enough of the public to decide what happens to it. Put your ideas forward for consideration and if they are worthy then things will get done. Remember so much whinging about Langford Gap hut and the door. How was it fixed? Not by you or by the whinger. You have discovered Faithfuls hut and you think it is a great location for your BC skiing base but now you want it refurbished to suit your needs. Perhaps when you know more you will work things out but all I see is a windsock. Resign from the VNPA, it doesn't suit you.

Please don't take offense to the above, I was just joking. At least I wasn't tripping. The Bears and his blocks can go and have a look at what was done for himself on the AAWT. Who beyond the 3rd grade talks about himself in the 3rd person and plays with teddy bears anyway?
Problem is that nothing gets done!System swallows up request and no action proceeds.
Xplora ...how are we going with the Blair’s Hut Window ....do they like my temporary fix so much that they leave it as is for five or more years?

Langford Gap door......it’s a bit embarrassing isn’t it.Only by bad publicity did anything happen,
Over six months!Man the speed that Parks Vicco attend to reasonable simple requests.

Time to fix bolt on Faithfulls Hut Door?......what you reckon our FO ....say 12months .

But let’s see...talk of primary schoolers?

The Parks Vicco Mt Beauty Office is the primary school building is it not!Perhaos that why we see reference to school kids all the time in your amazing posts!
I donot see any other contenders for FO of the decade....nobody else can measure up to your standards......the rest of us including the Team of little Bears are of insignificance!
 
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