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Discussion in 'Backcountry' started by Cam Walker, Dec 3, 2013.
So the area the bodies were recovered at Lake Mt.?
Can we combine bushfire refugees with the dunnies you love so much? Dare I say "crap"?
Another fire dugout was located from memory on the Mt Selwyn Rd(vic alps)so if u were cruising along AWT. U did have an option of hanging out around there till conditions moderated.So hearing that conditions were going pear shaped on your little transistor radio u could make decisions knowing a refuge was up/down the track.Fire warning don't stop u getting killed by radiant heat but shelters will if u manage to get to one.
Yep Rawsons pass has a fire refuge as legs says: maybe a dunny but works much the same when it shields one from radiant heat.
Good of legs to bring up the point on sanitation..so with the massive increase in nos expected from MDraft proposals are operators removing all of the crap
New dunnies necessary at Weston's and no doubt a study of ground water has been conducted at both Blairs and Horseyards to make sure existing facilities are not polluting the water. But Brett and Geoff are environmentalists so no problems there is seems???
And of course new dunnies for Tawonga Huts as existing ones most definitely would be a problem to water quality...
Rest assure all these matters addressed in Management Plans...but if not then they will be and there will be a great cost. And the cost will be passed onto who ???
And another question for mr on a day with a catastrophic forecast:did the unfortunates at Lake Mt drive up the road with out coming to a barrier(locked)and signage to indicate that area was closed till further notice because of this....my god it's a public park so to speak....if it was not closed with appropriate signage then it should have bloody been! Perhaps somebody could elaborate on these deaths and we can judge whether afire refuge would have saved them or did they knowingly disregard sound advise not to be there....maybe it was a management vehicle?who can shed some light on this tragic an unnecessary loss of life...
Hooray!! Normality has resumed!!!! DUNNIES!!!!!
Not to worry legs Brett and side kick Geoff are known for their environmental credentials according to the press they generate.. Bears are sure the commercial operators are most concerned with environmental issues and put them well ahead of profits!!!
And an impact statement is in the pipeline??
And we can trust Parks Vic to have all the info concerning environmental impacts in front of decision makers as it proceeds in its timely and robust discussions with concerned citizens and environmental groups.
Not to worry legs everything apples here!!!!
But the DUNNIES!!! There will be DUNNIES!!!
O frabjous day!! Callooh! Callay!
Yeah @Ubiquitous Steve, in that area im pretty sure. The report or transcript i read was pretty harrowing.....first the smoke, then disorientation and some desperate phone calls. Im unsure if gates were shut but from memory there were people working at the old visitor centre on the day (i recall footage) so id hazard a guess it was open. I recall a few harsh 'what the f...were they doing there on that day?' comments, but you could say same about many unfortunates in marysville in that day
My neighbours place in the tallarook ranges has a very old dugout / timber refuge in an earth bund on the north side, with the open side to the SE, probably a forestry or previoua farmers remnant
Poor bastards.....f ... that such a troubling story...some where to shelter and they may have survived to talk of the shit of a day that Marysville had...
that is why u have refuges...in the old days they had bugger all fire fighting capacity but they knew how to survive ...it's a real pity we did not learn sufficiently of the stories told of the 1939 fires???? So it was misadventure then but now it's 2017 and we have learnt lessons of the importance of having a refuge or the option is not to be in the area.
So one would hope its a refuge as back up or the area is avoided.One road in thro heavy forest and no fire refuge .....this is flawed thinking....
No I believe that they are doing a community poo bag and helicoptering it out every now and again....so maybe crap storage then airlift it out from upper Diamantina Area...the Kossy guys will be in wonderment of such a plan.A giant poo transported back to poo processing station at Hotham no doubt.
Mr T may remark"its the friggin poo copter" as he traverses the Razorback waving his walking poles in its direction.this will up the ante on KNP...of course one does not want to get into too much detail involving green house gas emissions from frequent use of helicopters as this could denigrate the most recent Management Draft .
Charlie any errors coming up so far?
No, I've already said I'm impressed
Bears down loaded a spell checker!
No full stop @Charlie.
Also, surely you would say:
No, I've already said 'I'm impressed'.
No, I've already said that I'm impressed.
Errors everywhere. It's a disgrace.
What can I say?
I feel like I've let you all down!
I can no longer regard myself as a paragon of English usage!
I was up at Howitt hut having a look around in Dec.'16.It was falling down.
Good post CPT.C.
Which McNammaras are we talking about there are two...Dinner Plain?
I think u are referring to the one Team Bears accesses via McCoys Track from the Bundarra Valley..it's the one with the little annex.
It was in great disrepair when I was last there several years ago..
That is very good work conducted by Parks and vols etc.
One winter I came from Youngs to McNamarras and back in a day trip ...quite a long trip..one can also come at McNamarras from Hotham Airport and jeep track into river then across on little horse track to come into Mc,s Hut...it's a welcome site when there is snow all over the place...it's an important Hut but could get more use if walkers new of the track from back of Airport and then over to other side of the ridge...
And I am sure many more things could be done and possible should Parks Vic realise the foley of its Iconic Walk Draft Plan....and immediately cease wasting its funds and our taxes....
I am very pleased with your post CPT.C but that does not excuse the stupidity of Parks Vic being party in supporting a real crock of an idea...
So we are glad some folk in Parks Vic are still able to participate in worthwhile activities....
But I say Parks Vic Media Unit are gonna have more than an uphill battle trying to justify the wasted dollars on this Falls to Hotham Iconic Walk...
Already the VNPA are outraged by this direction of management heads.....
No environmental Impact Studies conducted either..
Bears are supportive of Parks Vic District staff but feel they are being sold short by p.poor management sitting in head office...
The orders for this crap idea( DMP FHAC) come from higher up the food chain than from the big wigs at PV, it comes from a Steve Bracks era State Govt. YES MINISTER style decision that has taken this long to surface in its half baked load of old betty swollocks form.I agree, fix what is already there while it is possible to be fixed.
I went to the Vic High Country Assn face book page and the picture looks like the McNamaras Dinner Plain hut. It also says it's the centenary of the hut, Spring 2017.
correction, VHCHA was sharing Parks Vic facebook page.
I've also skied from Youngs to McNamaras in a day. Quite a long day in winter and often the snow runs out before McNamaras.
I think the Falls Hotham alpine crossing proposal may have originated with Tourism Victoria.
Most probable....but we expect the environmental professionals to due the job of delivering on the environment first....not being blinded by the possibility of funds from their concessions to big business..it's nothing short of a sell out...a sham ...I am very pleased by the hard work and dedication necessary to follow thro with the worthwhile projects displayed in your post though..
I passed a professional horse trail ride on Longspur recently that had originated from Tawonga Township some days earlier...
They were doing what a good commercial body does...using existing trails and not demanding any special concessions from Parks Vic...so a commercial group pulling in dollars for the local economy but not diverting taxpayer funds .These existing enterprises Parks should be giving priority too....it's like they have become so besotted with the Iconic Walk that every other group has little or no importance....funds should being spent all over the Alpine environment not pouring it into this crazy corridor between Hotham and Falls... again CPT.C we appreciate your pics and I am sure though Hut rebuilding is only one aspect of what Parks Vic do it is a brilliant way to bring the "people" along cos with out public support u are not going to progress and be able to engage in other areas that a Park Service is responsible for...
And we cannot get heads around the money squandered on the drafts proposals and the money paid out to private companies to produce glossy photos and diagrams in a marketing exercise ....while we note that Longspur is so overgrown that the scrub sits well above my head in many places....yet it requires a pittance to be spent on personnel to recut it...
Just want to clarify a few points. There were no deaths at Lake Mountain on Black Saturday, however unfortunately six tourists died on nearby roads. A couple camping near Taggerty River died in their car on Lady Talbot Drive 2 km from Marysville. A second couple died on Ghost Point Track (27 km from Marysville)it appears they became lost after driving up Lady Talbot Drive a tree over the road trapped them and they died near their car, they were staying in Marysville for the weekend. Two more tourist died in their car on Paradise Plains Road.
You can close roads and Parks, however you can't have staff on every gate, you only have to look at parks close to Melbourne. The 1000 steps are regularly closed due to risk of fire and wind, the public don't give a @#%@ and walk right past the signs. In areas around Marysville it would be very hard to close through roads, as they are possible escape routes.
Everyone needs to shoulder responsibility Black Saturday has changed the way fire agencies approach community safety. This can also be applied to the proposed walking track from Hotham and Falls Creek. Fire risk has to be addressed by all interested parties (Parks Vic, tour operators and paying customers)
Just my 2 cents worth.
Thanks for post...
Marysville was so unfortunate to cop a firestorm heading directly at it...and being any where in that proximity would have a shocking experience.
Who ever was in the near by fire tower apparently took one look at what was appearing above the tree line in the distance and mentally decided it was going to be a shocking event unfolding as he got out of there..after it was conveyed to the District Office..most of us know that Marysville was well prepared for the fire season every year and that local DSE and CFA units were very competent....
We also understand that a firestorm is an over whelming event and nothing much can be done as this comes over....u flee or u hide ...u get your fire trucks and personal well away from such an event.
Fortunately most fire behaviour is not at this intensity....
We do hope some footage of this event is available to remind folk of the ferocity of a fire storm...cos it's something we all push to the back of our consciousness ...yes locked gates never a good idea on such a day close them put signs out but don't padlock them ...fleeing alternatives for fire trucks always a good strategy...and obviously u need to get your crews out of the immediate path of such an event well before it hits....as trees get ripped out of the ground and flung,smoke takes visibility down to zero and other traffic complicate an exodus.some of the local cops made a sound decision to get as many people out of that area as best they good...slightly risky evacuation but a very professional decision...
Thank god for those switched on police officers...fire trucks/and professional staff need to be driven out of this type of event they can do nothing...they need to save their trucks and their crews from being incinerated as the radiant heat is probably not survivable even for these crews that are trained for flash overs.
Interesting @Spew. Id always understood it was at lake mountain the guy i knew....hard to beleive it was 8 years ago.....my mouthy daughter was still in utero. anyway the ghost point track story sounds like the one. Poor buggers
It was a tragic day up there ...at the tail end of a very hot day when humidity was low fuel moisture was negligible ...a firestorm lined up Marysville like a footballer lining up for a kick at goals ....few points of the compass this way or that it may have been spared....one mean mother of a firestorm with scary flame heights going like cho cho train...nothing was ganna spare it with the conditions on that day..
and tragic deaths all over the place up there...
So stay and defend policy....
Not a good one in these extreme conditions ,so now with hindsight bought at a tragic price...we get out the way well in advance unless we can survive in our little shelter from something of this magnitude..evacuation is a sound strategy ,timely organised,to areas of impregnable shelter or those of reasonable shelter with aid from firefighters...
as for who makes the decision...Black Sat.was a day when it was on the minds of management even before sunrise..
U can defend your property from the average bushfire if you are experienced and have all the gear and have a modified property ....but firestorms are freaky.....they are ganna kill u.
Neighbourhood shelters as part of primary school ,community hall,cop shop what ever are something u must consider.
anyway enough gloom and doom...2017 fire season nearly gone things have been pretty good in Victoria weather,rain,heat wave wise up to this period and summer seems to be winding back away from extreme conditions.
I mean yeah, he couldn't have been more blunt
I mean, that would be the same as me posting about Kelly's Lodge and Licenced Restaurant at Mt Baw Baw!
It's just not on!
Never heard of them.
Never heard of them?
Check out their website on www.kellyslodge.com.au
We thought it had something to do with the top of Diamantina Spur but guessed it was a less than a relevant posting for commercial gain.
You missed perjorative.
Didn't miss it, it was right!
pejorative - Dictionary Definition : Vocabulary.com
pejorative. Call a word or phrase pejorative if it is used as a disapproving expression or a term of abuse. Tree-hugger is a pejorative term for an environmentalist.