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Opinion FCRM - Getting value for money....

Discussion in 'Falls Creek' started by Hully, Aug 26, 2015.

  1. FlatLander

    FlatLander Addicted

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    Hully there are site Lease fees, which actually used to be collected by the state govt, I think its only in the last 10 years that the resorts fought to receive these. The other charge is effectively rates although called service charges. These funds are used to maintain and build municipal infrastructure.

    And yes streamline the management, based solely on local stakeholder volunteer positions, Everyone has an equal say
     
  2. FlatLander

    FlatLander Addicted

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    Why is it unfair Snorkler, bottom line is that the services have to be paid for (yes I get that everything could be done cheaper), gate entry is actually one of the easiest ways to catch the most consumers, so nearly everyone shares the load.

    Local shire levying local accomm and camp sites is not saving any money, the operator will simply pass on the costs to the consumer, and because the levy would only be catching a certain percentage of users then the costs would be much higher. And would not change the overall cost of the ski holiday.

    Is it right to "punish" the few so that most share the costs - absolutely yes, no different to shire rates and taxes
     
    Pademelon and Hully like this.
  3. Hully

    Hully One of Us

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    Can't for the past year because they haven't yet posted their annual report over 10 months since FY end! Under the current structure I would guess that Senior Exec remuneration would be in the range of 5-10% of total revenue, which I would think would be at the High end of Local Government.
     
  4. Snorkler

    Snorkler Part of the Furniture

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    Fair is usually described as equitable, to have some people paying more than others isn't equitable. So in the basic sense, it's not fair. Then as pointed out, other systems aren't fair either. The thing here is that the single person is paying 200% more than the average.
     
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  5. Snorkler

    Snorkler Part of the Furniture

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    The problem with a RMB is that they can't levy a bed tax on providers who are off mountain, a local council can. In order to collect services revenue from those off-mountain, it necessites a gate entry.
     
  6. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    not everyone staying in a sub-alpine town is going to the ski resort, so how is that fair? people visit for other reasons in winter too, incl family events, mountain bikes, general touring
    and it would give local residents (including Albury/Wodonga, Wangaratta etc) free daytrips all season
     
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  7. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    and those regional towns with a 2 hour drive of Falls Creek are seen as a very important market by FCRM and FCSL, not a small group to give free entry to
     
  8. Hully

    Hully One of Us

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    Is the current Resort Entry the correct cost and a fair and appropriate revenue collection method? Maybe (based on current FCRMB operating cost structures) and probably. Go to a bayside beach carpark in Melb and it will cost about $4 per hour to park.
    My OP was how do we cut cost from FCRMB and hopefully pass on cost savings to winter visitors in the maybe cheaper accommodation costs (reduced bed taxes)?
     
  9. Hully

    Hully One of Us

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    If you live in a Melb bayside council you get free beach parking (beach resort entry) within that council and the outsiders pay.
     
  10. Charlie

    Charlie Still the most depraved poster here Ski Pass: Gold

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    Winston Churchill said "Democracy is the worst form of Government, except for all the others"
    This also applies to ARMBs unfortunately, also no Government is going to allow stakeholders any say in running their assets!

     
  11. Hully

    Hully One of Us

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    Want to debate fair....if you work at Falls for somebody other than FCRM you have to pay standard Resort Entry to drive up there each day for work.
     
  12. Snorkler

    Snorkler Part of the Furniture

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    Thing is other councils around the world grapple with the same issue, yet they make it work.
     
  13. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Apologies for my negligence, I assume there's been multiple workshops btn resort, lift co., ski reps & other stakeholders to thrash this issue out? One where data/evidence from OS & Interstate is debated and accepted / rejected as a group?

    Or has this been done to death?
     
  14. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Two other points for summer:
    - All resorts need to maintain and possibly increase/improve their advertising/marketing - I've noticed alpine resorts are mote visible in the media over summer but more could be done to convert the 95% who wouldn't normally plan a mountain stay.

    And access? A lot of city slickers are easily put off by distance/ time & winding steep & narrow roads. Resorts/ shires/tourisism need to do their best to improve road quality to resorts and the customer perception thereof.
    Otherwise you lose this 90% without a fight!
     
  15. Hully

    Hully One of Us

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    Sorry, last sentence should read:
    "My OP was how do we cut cost from FCRMB and hopefully pass on cost savings to winter visitors in the form of reduced Resort Entry cost and maybe cheaper accommodation costs (reduced bed taxes)?"
     
  16. Charlie

    Charlie Still the most depraved poster here Ski Pass: Gold

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    'City Slickers' are also put off by warnings of "Potentially the worst fire season on record" from various fire protection bodies!
     
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  17. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    I really don't think road quality is a key factor for falls & hotham. there is a huge influx of motorcyclists once the snow has melted. car clubs love it too. apart from the BHP rd between falls and the omeo highway, there is really no need to upgrade roads other than more overtaking lanes. short of putting in gondolas from mt beauty and harrietville, it's hard to see how access could really be improved
     
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  18. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    only applies to those that council area, not a 2 hour catchment

    I'd love free entry but it would be financially disastrous if all day entry was free
     
  19. Hully

    Hully One of Us

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    Self interest, even if unrealistic....Resorts get absorbed into local Shires - Alpine Shire residents get free resort entry to Falls and Hotham. Tell me I'm dreaming....:)
    I'd be happy with everybody getting slightly reduced Resort Entry, less people being put off by a visually unappealing cost of skiing and more visitors coming to our region.
     
    currawong likes this.
  20. teckel

    teckel Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    This. Any hot day in summer and the govt spokespeople and the media are full of it - don't go to the bush or you'll burn and die., :headbang:
     
  21. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    In response to Currawong: I'm not implying all roads but certain segments are stiil ordinary & yes a few passing lanes - esp for Falls would be handy.
    The Old 'Snow Road' grom GlenRowan is attrocious in many places - narrow, broken edges, loose gravel on sides, & lumpy in spots. How would that encourage a family to turn off the Hume on the way to the hills?

    I know what many will say - theres the GAR, but new tourists may not be au fait with this option, which also misses attractions like Miliwa & Oxley.

    The Melba Hwy (surface) Imo has deteriorated over my tme driving to snow and in places its like riding a bucking bronco in the SUV. Theres a lot more large trucks than in the 80s - this wouldn't help nervous new visitors to Buller & Stirling.

    But perhaps a more important issue is the trouble / time spent in leaving Melbourne -ESP heading north towards the Hume on Friday evenings. This effort, especially for those in southern suburbs, tends to discourage people from head towards the hills and makes the much shorter drive to the coast - say roughly 1.5 - 2 hrs hours to Lorne or Phillip Island - look a less taxing summer proposition. Add some kids and triple the factor!

    I know I am laboring the point but to better understand why people do go/ don't go yo the hills (inc. Falls), we need to understand the barriers and attempt to address each one. Thanks for listening (;- )
     
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  22. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    i'll accept what you say.
    the roads you mention are soooo much better than when I drove Melb-Mt Beauty every weekend for years, but I suppose expectations must have risen. gotta have perfect surfaces for the toorak tractor
     
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  23. Charlie

    Charlie Still the most depraved poster here Ski Pass: Gold

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    Is that like, if you work for vicrail, you don't have to pay train fares, but if you don't work for them, you have to pay?
    Edit:
    Or if you work for Maccas, you get free big macs, but if you're a customer, you have to pay?
     
  24. Hully

    Hully One of Us

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    Yeah suppose so.....probably more meant that when people complain about paying Resort Entry to go up and play, it's worse when you have to pay it to enter to work.
     
  25. Moondog55

    Moondog55 One of Us

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    Heck Hully I thought workers got a seasons pass at a discount
    Even more unfair was back when they removed the residents carpark for those of us who lived on the mountain full time and wanted to charge us to park way out the back of the lower carpark
     
  26. Hully

    Hully One of Us

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    Maybe this forum is the FCRM preferred method of suggestion/observation. FCRM marketing's digital activity this 'green season' is already exponentially greater than last year....or maybe it is due to having a CEO committed to the resort/mountains whereas this time last year the incumbent CEO was most likely busy with interviews etc for his next executive position and getting the hell out of there before having to post the Annual Report for the year and be accountable. When I made suggestion directly to the previous management I was treated with contempt and eventually sacked....hopefully things have changed.
    Anyway, good work on current MTB/green season marketing....
     
  27. Moondog55

    Moondog55 One of Us

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    I drove the mountain road a short while back
    Boring as hell at the new hyper-slow limit, the fun police are killing us all slowly.
    I saw very little new activity or preparations,no new picnic shelters of BBQs or any of the facilities tourists expect.
     
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  28. gettingtooold

    gettingtooold One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    I think the marketing from the resort is totally missing a very important aspect. Melbourne and much of Vic can swelter around 40 degrees and in Falls it's a pleasant 20 degree day so come up and have a look around. Obviously the big money is made in winter but they do absolutely nothing to promote summer tourism to the detriment of all year stakeholders. Is it really that hard ?.
     
  29. Seth

    Seth Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    Beach is also pretty sweet when its warm as well. It's as much a cultural thing as anything.

    It's a chicken and egg thing but if there is nothing open up there it doesn't encourage people to go.
     
  30. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    they do promote summer, but obviously not well enough if you haven't heard anything. Being cooler is one of the things they promote, especially for running, cycling and other training

    a lot of stakeholders are not keen on spending money on summer promotions and some of the things they have done have not really been good value.

    That said, summer visitation does seem to be growing slowly. Our ski club had it's best (income-wise) summer ever. Over xmas & january Falls was the busiest I have seen it at that time of year, especially cyclists and lots of runners. The mountain bike trails are growing in popularity and reportedly the weekends when the shuttles run are well patronised even now that holidays are finished.

    From what I hear, more food businesses are open too.
     
  31. Stratus

    Stratus A Local

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    Falls needs a Summer attraction. Something that will actually get people excited about visiting.

    Cooler temps, nice walking trails, cycling etc. are side activities and obviously haven't been enough to entice visitors to make the 4 hour trek from Melbourne.

    The mountain bike trails are really good, but not extensive enough yet to compete with Buller. Besides, until a shuttle runs every weekend regularly then whats the point?

    Chicken and egg analogy is correct. The resort is spinning these superficial reasons to visit but there really is no substance. Substance will require an upfront financial investment.
     
  32. DbSki

    DbSki Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    One of these

     
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  33. snowgum

    snowgum One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Yes I visit Falls regularly in summer & love it.
    But its so frustrating seeing business hang back & leave it yo Thredbo to open.
    Get a public pool open on mtn & advertise. Watch them come.
    Open a chairlift regularly. And ditto.
    Until then. Its a slow gentle climb in nos.
     
  34. Moondog55

    Moondog55 One of Us

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    Whatever happened to the Falls Creek yacht club?
    The sailboard competitions?
    The free SEC barbecues and look-outs, the good to excellent fishing? etc etc
    It seems as if everything is somebody elses responsibility and NOTHING ever gets done
     
  35. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    there were a few yachts out last time I was up there. these are owned by locals and not available to the public as far as I know. I think liability issues would make people pretty cautious about public access.

    sailboards are not the popular thing they were 30 years ago - not really viable to hold a competition I would have thought. Dragon boa comp is bigger than the sailboard comp ever was IMHO

    The masterplan is a lot of pie in the sky, but there are some simple things that are likely to happen. BBQ/picnic facilities at lakeside have a reasonable chance of happening. Until a couple of years ago this land was in the National Park rather than the resort. I agree that FCRM should pull their finger out and do something here soon

    The work that has gone into mtb trails is huge. the marking of walking trails is also a big improvement

    there actually seem to be a few eating places bothering to open

    the summer vibe at falls is much better than ever before. It's still got a long way to go, but it is making progress in the right direction
     
  36. Ubiquitous Steve

    Ubiquitous Steve A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    Bears are wondering if FCRM are developing policy on driverless cars???:p

    Computer operated snowplows that could be tricky!!
     
    #136 Ubiquitous Steve, Mar 21, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2016