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Help with skis

Discussion in 'Equipment' started by FNM, Sep 22, 2019.

  1. FNM

    FNM Early Days

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    ** Edit: I can copy and paste it into a PM, rather than forwarding the email **

    Hi guys,

    I was hoping one of the gear heads here might be willing to read an email I received from a ski salesperson regarding a few different types of skis and give me their opinion on the options.

    If so, could you please pm me.

    The skis are not well known - more “cottage” brand I guess, so I can’t find online reviews and it takes more knowledge about ski design than I have to know how they might fare in Canada.

    Cheers
     
    #1 FNM, Sep 22, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2019
  2. cold wombat

    cold wombat Twitter Contributer Social Media Mod Ski Pass: Gold

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    Any reason you don't want to make the advice public?
     
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  3. FNM

    FNM Early Days

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    Not really. Only that I thought it might be more respectful not to publicly publish a private correspondence.
     
  4. Chowder11

    Chowder11 Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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    Post what "cottage" skis you are looking at and we can give you some advice.

    You'll have more success than asking for private convo's
     
    FNM likes this.
  5. FNM

    FNM Early Days

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    Sweet, thanks. Good idea.

    I'll list them and add the ski-specific info that was provided. We haven't settled on a mountain and will probably decide on where to stop by driving through the towns and seeing where feels right and/or where we find accomm .. All I can say, is that it will be somewhere between Apex and Banff and as far south as Red!! I imagine we'll do a balance between groomers and off-piste (a slight lean towards off-piste - I've never really skied off-piste - or powder for that matter - but I'll be getting lessons early in the season. Currently, I'm intermediate). Don't think there will be much backcountry.

    Anyway, here they are:

    ROKO Zen San 98 - Hand made in Japan. Designed to suit ‘all-mountain’ and this is reflected in the under foot width, which allows the edge to edge performance of an under 100mm ski, but also keeps enough surface area to float in the pow. It is also a real crud-buster as these skis are heavier than their North American counterparts. Good even flex and a very solid and stable ski. Subtle early tip rise and a flat tail, small camber under foot, all give this ski a more traditional feel and lots of stability.

    Sego Special 98 - The 98 Special is a true all-mountain ski that has a nice early tip rise, very subtle tail rise (pretty much flat) and good camber under foot, providing superb grip on groomers, good edge to edge performance, real crud busting capability and great surface area for floating in pow. Can handle any snow conditions you throw at it.

    Sego Clever 106 - Stiffer than the Special 98. Wider, so it provides epic float in powder, yet even at 106 under foot, it can handle groomers with ease. Great early tip rise, more subtle tail rise, camber under foot, and turns around much quicker than the stats suggest. If you lay them over, you can still carve them. Very, very fast ski though. Originally designed as their big-mountain ski for Freeride World Tour, this is a skiers ski and will provide you with miles of smiles.

    RMU Apostle 105 - The Apostle powers the skier through adverse snow when engaged and is playful when skied over centre. The fivepoint design really defines this as an all mountain charger. There are five different widths running down the length of the ski; these varying widths allow different portions of the edge to engage in varying snow conditions. This design allows the ski to have a tighter turn radius for a wider ski, which allows for more manoeuvrability while maintaining a fun surfy feel on powder. A really fun ski, very stable (great dampness to smooth out the ride) and overall a very high quality ski.

    Skevik Loken 106 - The Loken is another all-mountain winner and made from a great little company in BC. With a slightly longer turning radius than most, this ski is fast, but still nimble in the trees. The Loken features a long but subtle rocker in both tip and tail with camber underfoot. This combo offers large edge contact as you rail the ski throughout a turn, and provide the desired stability on hardpack, yet keeps you afloat when the snow piles up. They can be the one-ski quiver to charge your local resort, while the 106mm will provide some extra float for hunting those pow stashes. Not as easy to ride as the RMU or the Sego skis, so definitely for the more advanced skier who knows how to wrangle a technical ski.

    As always, any advice appreciated.

    Cheers
     
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  6. DPS Driver

    DPS Driver One of Us

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    Can I ask why you feel the need to go boutique? The reason I ask this is that generally bespoke skis are for more advanced skiers looking for specific aspects within a ski, or pretty topsheets or a desire to be seen as hard core because you're on a boutique ski. Not all boutique skis are good, some are awesome some are just cheap crap.

    Re the above, forget anything wider than 100. Don't even bother. These skis are for you, a lower intermediate that has not skied off piste nor powder but looking to progress predominantly in Canada. You need something forgiving which will enhance your off piste experience and allow you to progress. The two skis under 100 will be better options from a width perspective however the Zen Special 98 will be too much ski for you which leaves the Sego.

    If you're getting them as ex demos then reasonable value, depending on how many days are on them. The special is a 2016/17 ski so it's a few years old. I would be wary of this.

    I would suggest you may find a more suitable ski by presenting at a shop with a strong range and telling them what you're after.
     
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  7. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    +1
     
  8. Chowder11

    Chowder11 Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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    Sweet thanks.

    I have the exact same questions as @DPS Driver why the more boutique choices?

    Are you looking for something more unique?
    If not there is plenty of great options for you from the more mainstream brands.
    In fact for your current ski level one of the more mainstream brands will probably suit, the boutique brands tend to make more high end skis
     
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  9. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Picking up ex-rental skis or even demoing/ renting on mountain and then buying what you have proven for yourself as a good ski is going to maximise the chances of getting something that suits your skiing and your pocket.

    The whole bespoke/ custom thing may be a characteristic of a desire to get away from the perceived evils of the established marketplace, but it’s not always justified and the higher margins associated with smaller volumes mean you pay a significant premium.

    It’s hard to walk past the excellent value for money the mainstream ski brands represent, and it’s not always fair to assume they’re not doing the right thing by their employees and the environment etc.

    There is admittedly the cachet of a bespoke brand, which also carries the promise of leading edge technology- but the large manufacturers are on top of the innovation game in most cases.

    The advantage of rocking up in person at a mainstream retailer or rental outlet is that you can try and view a diverse range of options, rather than the limited offering of a bespoke online outlet- which has a different role to play, and is filling a niche’ gap in the market.

    The coin one saves from buying mainstream skis on-mountain after demoing or renting can go towards a lesson or two - upgrading one’s skiing is frequently going to have the larger impact rather than just upgrading one’s equipment.
     
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  10. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    The other thing I’ll add is at the moment you’ll find some pretty good deals on the mainstream brands, and although I haven’t seen much pricing yet, due to the recent fall in the Australian dollar the prices next winter are likely to be higher, I’d imagine many/most skis will be up $50-100 on this year’s pricing.

    So it’s a pretty good time to grab some skis from one of the mainstream brands, who as mentioned predominantly make excellent skis, the trick is finding the best ones for you.
     
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  11. FNM

    FNM Early Days

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    Thanks for the responses so far guys. The main reason I was looking at them was financial. All of the above are either 600 or 700 with bindings and, I was told, with very little use - like just a few days.

    I guess going boutique was just a little bonus, but not important.

    Sounds like maybe they’re not for me!

    Have been trying to find something good in that 600-800 range.

    Have also looked at Black Crows Camox and 4FRNT MSP 107 (also a boutique brand? I know someone who skied then and absolutely loved them) ... but it then ends up in the $1100-1300 mark .. perhaps I’m best waiting for Kijiji (Canada’s Gumtree).
     
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  12. Roymond

    Roymond One of Us

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    I’m relatively new to skiing but I can give a probable bicycle analogy given to me by Ryan Bailey ( Australian Olympian and world champ) when he sold me my most recent bike- we had a similar conversation- boutique vs mainstream.
    He said there was a time when a little Italian with a good sense of engineering and a great touch with the welding iron gave you the best bike.
    Now, with modern engineering, computer stress analysis and modern composites, it’s the dudes with the best engineers.
    Sometimes that will be boutique but normally it will be the big boys.
    I’m guessing the same thing applies to skis.
     
    #12 Roymond, Sep 23, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2019
  13. Marty_McSly

    Marty_McSly What a plonker. Ski Pass: Gold

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    Pity it's a bit late in the Oz season for the OP to try demoing some of the mainstream skis here.

    There are some great skis out there that would be spot-on for on and off piste, and the small but frequent powder Falls typical of the interior BC mountains.

    The Salomon QST and Nordica Enforcer ranges come to mind. A search of these forums will turn up some opinions on these. Speaking to people at Perisher the other week, everyone I talked to who were on QST 92's had a lot of love for their versatility. I had a few days on Enforcer 93's and found that they have a massive sweet spot. They were able to be skied with a neutral, centred stance or, when conditions demanded, responded well to a more forward, tip-driving stance.

    Either of these have enough edge hold for early morning Oz groomers, and are shaped to be versatile away from the pistes.

    There should be some good deals going on these and similar skis at the moment.

    Edit: BTW I'm intermediate too.
     
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  14. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    They are 2 of my favourites. I chose the Enforcer 88 as my personal ski this winter as I have a quiver but the 93 would be great as a single choice. QST 92 is our top selling mens ski, it's as good as anything out there and a cracking price to boot.
     
  15. DPS Driver

    DPS Driver One of Us

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    Yes dollars are a great determining factor.

    If the Sego's only have a few days then maybe go them. The price is reasonable.

    From a shape perspective look for something with a similar shape to our DPS Wailers 100 & 112 in regards to what's called 5 point. You'll want tip & tail rocker, a bit of camber underfoot, what we call paddletech but the straighter section that meets the contact point tip and tail. This shape makes them very easy to ski and are perfect for lower intermediates trying to progress off piste. Plenty of brands have copied this shaping regime, so don't necessarily get locked into a brand and you'll have broader options.

    There are some good deals going now.
     
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  16. Sbooker

    Sbooker One of Us

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    I'm a ski dummy who doesn't even own their own skis but I'm in the process of researching with a view to buying very soon. I would have thought at your stated skill and experience levels (and if you're looking at wallet friendly options) a couple of good options would be Salomon QST92 and Atomic Vantage in 90 or 97 would be great.
     
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  17. FNM

    FNM Early Days

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    Either of the Sego’s in particular?
     
  18. DPS Driver

    DPS Driver One of Us

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    Aahhh! refer to my original post. Nothing over 100mm for you my friend.
     
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  19. FNM

    FNM Early Days

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    Sorry. Trying to move from Northern Rivers back to Victoria today with a trailer that I think is too heavy for my car - mind a bit all over the place. Thanks!

    *edit: also, those ones are available for about $650 (with demo bindings) and with little use. Bases and edges excellent and some light scratching on surface.
     
  20. DPS Driver

    DPS Driver One of Us

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    To be honest I would look at other options.

    They're a flat tail ski so will require more precise skiing than you can probably deliver at this stage of your progression. For that price, I would wander into any one of the many ski shops between the Northern Rivers and Melb. You'll find something just right and probably around or not far off that price.
     
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  21. FNM

    FNM Early Days

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    Ok, great! Thanks for the advice. I guess I’ll see what I find and I’ll probably be back to find the opinions of others! This forum has been very handy for me. Ta
     
  22. Nozawaman

    Nozawaman A Local

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    If you get to Red , be careful in those trees if you haven't had much experience off piste .......super tight .
     
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  23. FNM

    FNM Early Days

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    Thanks for the tip! I’m generally risk-averse so I’ll definitely be making sure I’m at a semi comfortable level before taking a risk that could ruin my season. Cheers
     
  24. DPS Driver

    DPS Driver One of Us

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    And if you try to push it, you’ll end up walking out.

    Not that it ever happened to me, it was a friend honest.
     
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  25. FNM

    FNM Early Days

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    **Edit: I had to act fairly quickly in the end, and I opted for the Enforcer 100. I leant that way (100) just bc we’re more likely to end up in the powder triangle than anywhere else and there will likely be a fair bit of off-piste. It was a late change bc I had been looking at the Camox for some time based on a recommendation from Powder7 mainly, but the reviews of the Enforcer were overwhelmingly positive. I’m about 177/178cm and that is the length ski I grabbed (and all that was available). I also got the Marker Griffon bindings. It came in a little over budget, but close enough and on a good enough deal that I pulled the trigger. My first set of skis ever and I’m pumped! Thanks for shedding light on my OP and steering me in the right direction. Always grateful for the assistance :) If there is a consensus that I’ve made the wrong call, I’m sure I have a day or two to change the order! Ta **

    Hi again, I’m wondering if anyone has any advice/recommendations out of the following:

    Black Crows Camox - $547

    Nordica Enforcer 100 - $520

    Blizzard Rustler 10 - $480

    Atomic Vantage 97 TI - $560

    Nordica Enforcer 93 - $495

    Salomon QST 99 - $400

    I can also add either:

    Marker Griffon 13 for ~ $230
    Atomic Warden MNC 13 ~ $180

    They are new and seem like decent deals (previous season). I was leaning towards one of the first 2 based on reviews but the Salomon’s price is tempting.

    I’m a moderately aggressive (at a guess), intermediate skier (by Oz standards), headed to somewhere around Apex, Sun Peaks, Red or Panorama. Also guessing, I’d say there will be a slight lean towards off-piste but probably fairly even.

    Cheers
     
    #25 FNM, Sep 30, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2019