Advice needed I'm depressed

Discussion in 'Backcountry' started by Moondog55, Jul 9, 2017.

  1. ladycamper

    ladycamper Dedicated Member
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    The most killed by any drug are killed by smoking, Alcohol would be second, and is connected to more crimes of violence. Australia still allows the promotion of alcohol on sport on TV, in outdoor billboards etc all places where promotion is exposed to minors.

    Some people are harmed by nonmedical use of codeine etc but mostly by the other substances its got to be included with, eg paracetamol or ibuprofen if they use it a lot or for a long time etc. In the case of any other drug it's illicit status indirectly contributes to increased harm.
     
  2. Ziggy

    Ziggy Addicted Member
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    Yes, tobacco and alcohol are licit drugs and the state restricts their purchase and use too.
     
  3. Ubiquitous Steve

    Ubiquitous Steve Addicted Member
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    That drain coming down from Michelle's Hut sure caused Team Bears one hell of frustration and depression yesterday arvo.We went down on our asses about twenty times.And even just lay flat on our backs till we had enough energy to get back on our feet...we had Saw in one hand and fuel container in other and it is mega slippery ......:eek:
     
  4. currawong

    currawong Old And Crusty
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    In cold hard terms, I suspect the cost to the health system of requiring scripts for low codeine meds will far outweigh savings from abuse.
    I read all the people saying that the codeine dose is not enough to be effective as analgesic. All I can say is that has not been my experience. I'm on different prescription meds now, but panedeine & panedeine extra were the main things I used for pain for a long time. It certainly made a huge difference to just panadol (which did nothing for me). I'm really pleased to be on something different now, but it does require at least quarterly GP visits and PBS subsidy. It would not have been appropriate for me to be on this for much of the time that I used panedeine & panedeine extra (with GP blessing).
     
  5. BillyKidd

    BillyKidd Dedicated Member
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    F*ck 'em. Education, education, education. Chemists can advise. Can't hand hold for everything for Chrissake. And scripts or not the docs will still make mistakes and doc shopping etc will occur - regardless of any watch system. If the individual is that compromised, in terms of being able to make a rational decision, then they should likely be under some sort of guardianship or managed care anyway. Other than that let's assume we are competent adults. Nanny state indeed. What a nation of pathetic individuals we are - always leaning on government for the solution or service or responsibility, which means we really want someone else to pick up the tab and make the decision. Do we really need to institutionalize the nation in this way? All it does is give those pricks in Canberra another excuse to introduce more legislation, charge more in tax and spend it on "services". F*ck 'em.
     
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  6. Ziggy

    Ziggy Addicted Member
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    People get addicted to codeine. As with other addictions we can't then necessarily expect rational or competent self-management.
     
  7. currawong

    currawong Old And Crusty
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    Any countless people get cost effective pain relief without getting addicted
     
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  8. Ziggy

    Ziggy Addicted Member
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    Sure.
    But addictive substances used for medical purposes will normally be regulated. Hitherto chemists (sometimes) asked for ID and recorded your name. It didn't block the addicts and those harvesting codeine for refining, so we have a tighter regime.
     
  9. ladycamper

    ladycamper Dedicated Member
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    Guardianship would be the nanny state. For an opioid habit it seems like overkill.

    Now codeine's effective in most and most use it appropriately. However if you take a few of them in one go you can get different effects, or otherwise have severe pain which hopefully is temporary. Codeine's method of action is conversion into morphine by liver enzymes. If ones got no pain and takes enough of it, they'll be relaxed for hours. But if we force others who are really like dependent on it to not get it, suddenly there will be this visiting multiple doctors to get scripts, or they will swap to illicit or diverted opioids.

     
  10. BillyKidd

    BillyKidd Dedicated Member
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    Enough with the nanny state. It's over the top now. Put some checks and balances in by all means but they should be limited. Personal responsibility......now there's an idea.
     
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  11. Moondog55

    Moondog55 Dedicated Member

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    But I'm tired of being an adult.
    Well yes I am but I am more tired of the damned police state we live in telling me how to live and in many cases taking away my responsibility along with my personal freedoms
     
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  12. Ziggy

    Ziggy Addicted Member
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    I doubt you'd enjoy the personal 'freedoms' of the time prior to the welfare state to be poor, malnourished, homeless, exploited and exposed to toxins in work and at home, or untreated when ill.
     
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  13. BillyKidd

    BillyKidd Dedicated Member
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    What has that got to do with the price of eggs in China?
     
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  14. ladycamper

    ladycamper Dedicated Member
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    Other treatments for pain like physio, massages, etc cost a lot to access so for a lot of people it's cheaper, and fine, to use otc or prescribed opioids as long as not containing ibuprofen or paracetamol.

     
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  15. BillyKidd

    BillyKidd Dedicated Member
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    Yes - crazy that we don't provide through the tax funded health system reasonable access to rational non-drug interventions where they can be effective....surely long term a better cost and health outcome. (NB: Not talking chiro or any of that crap here)
     
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  16. telecrag

    telecrag Part of the Furniture
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    Not sure, but if we can figure out why the price of eggs in China is what it is, we will unlock one of the great mysteries of the universe.
     
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  17. BillyKidd

    BillyKidd Dedicated Member
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    Think a session on skis would be better.....plus too many hit your guts pretty bad.
     
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  18. ladycamper

    ladycamper Dedicated Member
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    Expecting to go soon, have been flatout with stuff I need to do here and I've got to plan my travel a well, it's before winter my bowels copped it mostly.
     
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  19. Mister Tee on snow shoes

    Mister Tee on snow shoes Dedicated Member

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    Steve, get some Kahtoola microspikes. Those Blundstone boots you wear are not up to the job. We appreciate the work you do and don't want you to slip and really hurt yourself , again.
     
  20. weerab

    weerab Dedicated Member
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    Can't make too much sense of that! We already have a "Like" button but we surely need a "Dislike" or even a "Hate" button.

    I need a Ladycamper filter! Ok, I'll just stop reading the posts.
     
  21. Mister Tee on snow shoes

    Mister Tee on snow shoes Dedicated Member

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    I don't think Lady camper needs any more pills or drinks. There is a lack of being compus mentis already ;-P.
     
  22. Mister Tee on snow shoes

    Mister Tee on snow shoes Dedicated Member

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    I should be back in the pool , swimming laps outdoors next week. Yaaaaaaaay !
     
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  23. Ziggy

    Ziggy Addicted Member
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    IME it's not hard to find a GP to get the script you want. It may take two or three visits.

    Get a record established at a bulk biller if money is an issue.
     
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  24. Moondog55

    Moondog55 Dedicated Member

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    Physio helps a lot but a good physio is better, the new bloke is good and I've dropped my pain meds in half again, down to a half a 5mg Endone AM/PM and just slow release paracetamol 3 t8imes a day This is to be measured against 2 full Endone + Codeine * 6 over a day It was a little rough there for a while

    Still waiting in the queue to get a CAT scan and/or an MRI done to see how bad the damage really is. If I'm lucky I may get away with arthroscopy or something less drastic than titanium implants
    Looking forward and planning for next year
     
  25. ladycamper

    ladycamper Dedicated Member
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    Never that great an issue for me, aware there's prescribers around, though dwindling in number.

    Mr Tee, I'm ok. Touché for my last visit to Melbourne haha.
     
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  26. ladycamper

    ladycamper Dedicated Member
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    Re access to proper healthcare and pain, took me over a week to get gratis emergency dental for an abscessed tooth in severe pain, was using some pamadeine forte and up to a pack of Nurofen plus a day. At its peak, I needed to go to an ED and be given something stronger one night and got a stronger script to take home, which helped. Of course if we all had unlimited financial resources we'd see dentists straight away in a emergency, have annual.checkups and work done so problems mostly prevented, have physio and massages for other pain and if working, autonomy on the job so that we don't work ant physical tasks at an excessive intensity or pace. Omitting that my personal status and being in Australia, from years back set me on the pipeline to poverty and, based on most others, an earlier mortality is expected.
     
  27. BillyKidd

    BillyKidd Dedicated Member
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    The ancient Chinese had the habit of paying their doctors whilst they were well. They would not be paid when they were ill. To your point of being proactive we have too little of that in our national medical system. Annual checks, medical and dental, with support for early interventional and rehabilitative work would go a long way to reducing health, economic and productivity losses. Insane we don't do it adequately. And at the same time if you turn up at the annual check and you smoke or abuse drugs or are a fat bastard then get your cash out. Can't keep having people not willing to make an effort on the health front subsidized for their ratshit behaviour.
     
  28. ladycamper

    ladycamper Dedicated Member
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    Important Not to ignore hidden role of trauma, poverty and social determinants of health in lifestyles of presenting patients. Given how many people have ever tried drugs, and/or use alcohol at a hazardous level without social disapproval it's a slippery slope to be providing or witholding care on such a basis and undermines the notion of human rights, the dignity of life, and equality. I cant abide by a society headed in a direction of being ruled by fear and stigma.
     
  29. BillyKidd

    BillyKidd Dedicated Member
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    Understood.
     
  30. Ziggy

    Ziggy Addicted Member
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    Yes, looking at the social determinants of health is revealing. Makes you wonder about how free choice is.
    With alcohol risky levels of consumption by social status follow a U curve interestingly.
     
  31. BillyKidd

    BillyKidd Dedicated Member
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    Also true.....but while we'd like to do it we cannot afford to cater for every accident of birth or unfortunate circumstance. We can provide more effective preventative health support though.
     
  32. Ricardo64

    Ricardo64 Active Member

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    Moondog,.....

    I feel for you, I too am in the same boat now. whilst at hotham making my way to snake gully, an out of control learner crossed my line. With no alternate path two lines collide...me underneath while the great sized brute landed on my shoulder. Hmmmm first impressions was my reconstructed shoulder, later to realize it was my good shoulder.

    End results two STUFFED shoulders....nice thanks mate.....

    Just a note to all learners....there is a safety code, adhere to it, learn to STOP, TURN, and CONTROL your movements ...
     
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  33. tele-whippet

    tele-whippet beard stroker
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    Hey Moondog,
    Feeling for you.
    I'm out for the rest of the season with a mushy mushed up ankle, no broken bones, just 3 & 1/2 ligaments.
    May not tele again but will ski!
    BUT looking forward to getting mobile and planning next year already --- anticipation is a great carrot!
    Get sewing with your DIY gear, nothing so satisfying!
    Try to stay as fit as possible and smile.
    I want to see pix of your camp on the High Plains next year!
    Stay in the loop, keep connected with like minded folk.
     
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  34. Mister Tee on snow shoes

    Mister Tee on snow shoes Dedicated Member

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    I am sorry to hear about that. No wonder I stick to snow shoes and an ice axe. At least waving the ice axe at some lunatic who is hurtling towards you may offer an incentive for said nutter on skis to slow the eff down and change direction ;-P .
     
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  35. Mister Tee on snow shoes

    Mister Tee on snow shoes Dedicated Member

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    Oh Happy days, I went swimming laps outdoors today !!!!
     
  36. Ziggy

    Ziggy Addicted Member
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    Good luck with the rehab tw.
     
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