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Is there any point in VIC keeping an EPIC pass now? EDIT: YES! (re Epic Coverage)

Discussion in 'Snow Talk' started by Young Angus, Jul 10, 2020.

  1. Young Angus

    Young Angus One of Us

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    I have an Epic pass, very enthusiastic skier and was packing to go last night (should be at Hotham right now) then they announced last minute it was off until mid August.

    So sad, would have thought they'd at least wait the weekend out.

    Does anyone see any point at all, as a Victorian with an Epic Pass (a regional Victorian mind you), in NOT just getting a refund on my pass and having it refunded? Is there any possible way there would be any point keeping one of these now? What are people thinking?

    I can't unpack my ski bag yet, it's too sad :(
     
  2. Budgiesmuggler

    Budgiesmuggler A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    There is a chance of skiing later in the season but for me there is to much uncertainty. Lots of things need to go right to be skiing in August.

    I’d take the money and run. plan to do the odd day or weekend if things improve.
     
  3. MarkV

    MarkV One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    I took the refund. If some good conditions occur late August and they reopen, I will just pay whatever it costs. I'm hoping Buller stays open.
     
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  4. Hully

    Hully One of Us

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    No......
     
  5. DPS Driver

    DPS Driver One of Us

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    So if you purchased you're stuck with it or can you get some value out of it?????
     
  6. Snowy Joey

    Snowy Joey One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    I was brave yesterday and cancelled our six epic passes. Nearly cried. Our gear was all packed ready to go too. Skis are sitting there in the shed, ready to be prepped. Can't put them away just yet.
     
  7. Snowy Joey

    Snowy Joey One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Vail have been pretty good. Still got until the 12th to get a refund.
     
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  8. DPS Driver

    DPS Driver One of Us

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    I would suggest everyone get on to that refund.

    Vail or McSnow as I call them, make a large portion of their revenue from pre-season ticket sales. To keep the resorts open cost them a lot of money, closing means they can keep all of the pre-sold revenue which is not refunded. I would question the appetite to re-open with money in the bank and the chance to lose a considerable portion of that revenue having to staff and open the resort. They have a valid reason to close, so why not take it and run.
     
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  9. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    September is the best month to ski.

    However I do say this with a caveat that the snowpack does require snowmaking and grooming to make it through September unless it’s a completely bumper winter and I do fear that they resorts won’t spend the cash to do this.
     
  10. DPS Driver

    DPS Driver One of Us

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    You're showing a lot of faith in "the people".

    Ah! "the people". Provided "the people" do the right thing then perhaps but........

    I know this goes against my business and yours but I called this very early in the piece. I wish I had more faith in "the people" but "the people" fcked this up for everyone by being entitled fcking gits that won't let a virus get in the way of their fun. I'm still going to go out and have fun, go drinking with the boys, party with the girls. Some govts haven't helped much with total ineptitude.

    I hope for your sake and mine and the industry as a whole we get a return to the slopes. But as long as there are dumb, entitled fcks out there we're going to be pushing it uphill with a pointy stick.
     
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  11. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    This is my understanding, not an official one

    I think VR need to clarify whether the 4 days they have been open in a very restricted way count as open core season days for the purpose of epic cover. They also need to make sue you can set your epic cover preference to a single resort.

    If they are not counted and you have the ability to go skiing with very little notice then it might be worth keeping the pass. If they don't open by 12 sept, then my reading says you would still get the full refund. If they did open on 20 aug (unlikely) then the number of days of core season would be 24. So that's 24/79, about 30%. You would get a 70% refund and be able to ski the rest of the season for 30% of the cost of the pass. There is a risk if they cut the non-core season short.

    If you are not confident that you have been able to specify a single resort then refund is the only way to go.
    If they count the 4 days this week then the refund changes to 1- 28/79, about 65%.
     
  12. NW159

    NW159 First Runs

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    This was the biggest thing for me. Had 8 days booked in after the lockdown period ends and probably would've been willing to take the risk of keeping the pass if I could nominate my preferences correctly.

    As it stands, my understanding is that the default all resorts core season preference means the American resorts will also need to be closed to get a refund under the coverage, and there's virtually no chance of overseas travel.
     
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  13. Hully

    Hully One of Us

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    This 100%.

    I love September skiing, and will be doing it this year.....just not any lifted component. The reality I feel is that without snowmaking, and strategic grooming to survive rain events, we'd need to be well on our way now to a 1mt base and have a really solid August to have any hope of a lifted season. In regards to lift company revenue, the peak weeks (July school holidays) have gone, they'll be closed for the period of high numbers of lower yield regular skiers and would need to consider opening for the break even/lose money weeks. I'm cashing in our Epic passes which we strategically haven't used.
     
  14. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    I'm half expecting them to rejig the epic cover conditions before the deadline for full refunds. or maybe not
     
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  15. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    probably will, but waiting another day or so in case the conditions change
     
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  16. Snowy Joey

    Snowy Joey One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    I have suggested to a few friends that haven't used theirs to get a refund but they are luckily in Canberra and nsw so they hope they are going to get some skiing this season.
     
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  17. nezumi

    nezumi One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

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    I've bitten the bullet and cancelled my Epic Aus Pass, Resort Entry and accommodation. :'(

    I just hope that Perisher / Vail / etc comes to the table on snowcheck vouchers, as I have $191 of vouchers that I have been unable to use. If they are adamant that they have to expire at the end of this snow season I'll offer them up for sale - discounted Perisher Money anyone?
     
  18. cold wombat

    cold wombat Twitter Contributer Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    You've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?'

    Do it in the appropriate voice if that helps.
     
  19. Young Angus

    Young Angus One of Us

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    "The people" really did a number on everybody, they dropped the ball, they were selfish and totally stupid and now people who were doing the right thing pay the price. I have no faith in "the people" right now and for the first time in my life I'm embarrassed to be Victorian.
     
  20. skiflat

    skiflat Old n' Crusty

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    Cancelled mine over a month ago. Season was always going to be risky regardless of the restrictions
     
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  21. Young Angus

    Young Angus One of Us

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    I don't understand this and haven't yet read the Epic coverage. I do plan to ski when we can, lifted we hope, and would probably get up for three weekends worth if we're lucky. That on its own doesn't warrant a season pass but Hotham is the only mountain we will ski and no chance of overseas travel at all. I was just going to refund and pay for regular tickets (at silly silly prices) for the few trips I'd be able to fit in but if there's a chance of a partial refund that would be a much better way to go. I'm going to email Hotham tickets today and see what they say about it, maybe wait a day or two till I decide to get a full refund.

    I couldn't believe it, we were leaving at 2am this morning from Ocean Grove to get up to Hotham by 8am this morning (or close enough to it), skis and gear packed was literally going to the car to take it to my mate's place so he could pack it in his car for the early start. My wife had even made us so much food so we could be self sufficient I'm talking ham cheese waffles, trail mix, lollies, noodles, so much awesome stuff it was amazing...then we get the news last minute...I mean I get it, but at least give people more than an hour's notice. Some people had already travelled up there yesterday to ski today and were in Bright. I get it, but that last minute snap decision is a bit hard to swallow.

    Just really disappointed, I'm sure all the mountain people are too, what a shame :(
     
  22. Annabuzzy

    Annabuzzy Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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    It would seem more fair to give say 7 days advance notice
     
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  23. SMSkier

    SMSkier One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    It’s not a Victorian thing mate (as much as I like the Interstate banter). It’s just us humans. Every day at Perisher (season to date) you see poor behaviour. Resort IMO is doing what it can re social distancing, keeping lifts running in very marginal conditions etc.

    Sadly, us people don’t get it. I spend half my time on the hill avoiding others. Some folks are conscious about keeping safe but the general “I don’t give a toss” belies belief. Exactly the same in town.

    NSW might get through the season. I hope we do however, we’ve not hit peak season yet nor peak crowding.....:rolleyes::confused:...And they ain’t going to change behavioural patterns now.
     
  24. Young Angus

    Young Angus One of Us

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    Of course it would, last minute is total crap it's not like they had a breakout in the resort. We get it, but last minute notice is really a rubbish move.
     
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  25. Young Angus

    Young Angus One of Us

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    I know, it's definitely everyone, people in general just need to realise there are other people besides them on this planet. Sadly some people just can't grasp that concept even if their life depended on it.
     
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  26. SMSkier

    SMSkier One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Surely that’s the point ...... In some cases it literally does :eek:
     
  27. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    what about covid is fair?

    it takes a few weeks to turn this aircraft carrier around. waiting a week to start is pretty dumb.
    it's not about what is already in the resort. it's about lots of people from areas that may have infections coming together in close proximity, especially indoors.

    decisions need to be based on what can go wrong in the next 2 weeks or more, not where we are right now.

    I've got more reason than most to be pissed off about the lifts closing, but I can see that there was really no alternative. Maybe they could have run till Sunday, not beyond that.

    Buller has some different considerations but it's hard to see even them continuing. Baw Baw probably has the best chance of staying open, if snow is good enough
     
  28. Young Angus

    Young Angus One of Us

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    I know I do get it, we all do. Can't believe Buller is staying open though, how do they reach that conclusion when Hotham and Falls close up shop? That's pretty weird, I wonder if they'll be able to stay open or if something will force their hand. Hopefully for the good of them all nothing bad happens, I'm not even sure if I want to go to Buller for a ski though it all feels like no one should be risking this right now.
     
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  29. nezumi

    nezumi One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

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    At least in part, Buller can stay open *because* Hotham and Falls have closed.
     
  30. Young Angus

    Young Angus One of Us

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    That is one point, maybe one resort can stay a bit more viable with all of regional Victoria's business rather than spreading it across three of them. That might work...so long as they don't have a COVID outbreak in the resort heaven forbid.
     
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  31. zac150

    zac150 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    I guess Buller are focusing on more than just their profits! By them staying open they are giving the small business in the communities that support them a fighting chance!
     
  32. Mister Tee on XC Skis

    Mister Tee on XC Skis A Local Ski Pass: Gold Ski Pass: Silver

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    "well do you ? , Punk" !
     
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  33. Mister Tee on XC Skis

    Mister Tee on XC Skis A Local Ski Pass: Gold Ski Pass: Silver

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    Mansfield needs Mt.Buller for winter jobs and winter income. The summer bushfires of early 2020 made that area a no go zone. To lose the ski season income at Mt. Buller either to shite snow cover &/ or a plague sweeping across Melbourne would be a double whammy of the most unpleasant sort for locals up there.
     
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  34. zac150

    zac150 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Jindabyne is the same, I know some business have been decimated by the uncertainty over people not being able to book tickets so they have no capacity to forward plan.
     
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  35. Mister Tee on XC Skis

    Mister Tee on XC Skis A Local Ski Pass: Gold Ski Pass: Silver

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    I hope we get some amazing snowfalls in Sept., Oct. and even in early Nov.. Something good to hope for.
     
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  36. Hully

    Hully One of Us

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    I think it could be whether your feeling 'pissed off' because VR have closed Vic operations but got a full refund on your Epic Pass (me), or feeling 'ripped off' because your stuck in lockdown in metro Melb and only have access to shoulder and low season skiing and maybe no opportunity for refund on your Buller Pass.
     
  37. Slalom

    Slalom A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    I was holding out hope and looking to go to Perisher in Sep.
    With the border now closed for at least 6 weeks and Falls/Hotham pulling the pin yesterday, it tipped me over. Went the refund.
    If we get some good snowfalls and/or the borders re-open, I’ll just try my luck with multi-day passes later in the season. I do fear however that Falls/Hotham will remain closed or on extremely limited terrain post Aug 19th.
     
  38. Mister Tee on XC Skis

    Mister Tee on XC Skis A Local Ski Pass: Gold Ski Pass: Silver

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    I live in hope of some BC ski touring on the BHP, Baw Baw Plateau and possibly the Main range in Sept./ Oct. Other than that there is surfing and hiking once I get out of the leper colony. Bring on the 2021 ski season.
     
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  39. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    being privately owned rather than publicly listed gives you more flexibility.
     
  40. dawooduck

    dawooduck relaxed and comfortable Ski Pass: Gold

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    For Victoria I cannot see a way that having a pass makes any difference to not having pass.

    For NSW it's pretty line ball.
     
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  41. Snowy Joey

    Snowy Joey One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    I think borders will definitely be closed for longer :(
     
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  42. Mister Tee on XC Skis

    Mister Tee on XC Skis A Local Ski Pass: Gold Ski Pass: Silver

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    Best Case scenario for Victorians would be skiing the Main Range in Mid October. Possible but I would not bet on it. Ultimately we cannot be kept locked up , let out and then locked up again on a repeating cycle etc. forever :-0
     
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  43. zac150

    zac150 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    I agree 100%, it’s a much easier decision, especially as Vail have significant losses from O/s already on the books that Buller don’t have.
     
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  44. Young Angus

    Young Angus One of Us

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    Is that just it? Vail announced closure due and made it sound like it was for the good of the people and the safety of local communities but Buller stays open. So either Vail are closing them purely from a business position or Buller is endangering the lives of regional Victorians and the surrounding communities.

    I am wondering if there is anything to the partial refund for the Epic Pass, if there is I'll keep it, if it'll just be too hard and Vail are best avoided this year then best to refund.
     
  45. zac150

    zac150 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    that’s an interesting question? How can it be for the health of the people? How is country Vic and safer etc than say Perisher, those accessing will have the same or similar exposure.

    the only argument on the health side is that people will be tempted so it’s now up to buller to email those in locked down locations and say sorry you are blocked.

    I cant answer the last question except to say vail will most likely look at credits and they will be enticing. I say this as the US resorts will be locking down the season pass holders at the same time Vic is coming out of a second lock down so offering incentives means that a) Vail doesn’t have to dip into reserves to pay out and b) can use Australia as an example
     
  46. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    I don't know about US but i guess is similar to here.
    The directors of a company must act in the best interest of the shareholders (while obeying the law). The interests of community, environment, customers, minority groups, staff and themselves are secondary. sometimes those other interests can be put into a perspective where they can be seen to align with the shareholders' interest. Eg doing something that is good for the environment could be marketed to shareholders as increasing sharevalue by not pissing off potential investors, or maybe future proofing the business by being less reliant on dying products/technologies. Occassionally shareholders might demand something other than the best financial outcome.

    Public companies are by definition amoral. It's illegal for them to be anything different.
     
  47. zac150

    zac150 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    agreed but it could be argued that protecting the ski community as a whole is in the best interest of the corporation in the long run.
     
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  48. CarveMan

    CarveMan Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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  49. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    It can be.
    US shareholders might not see it that way. Buller doesn't have to worry about that.
     
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  50. currawong

    currawong Old but not so Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    "took local businesses by surprise" - really?
    I can only read the 1st 3 sentences so maybe it goes on to qualify that.

    Anyone who didn't think we were on a knife edge was in cloud cuckoo land. The surprise was that it was a lockdown in Melb rather than a local outbreak that precipitated the decision. Once that was announced it was very unlikely that the lifts would keep spinning.