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mission to make snow 3

Discussion in 'Snow Talk' started by steve8113, Mar 21, 2007.

  1. Mitchell Pearce

    Mitchell Pearce One of Us

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    Great stuff. Exciting time of the year when the temps start to drop. That slope looks the goods.
     
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  2. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    First real frost of the season here, with -1.4C. Humidity way too high though. But it's the start and the heat is being taken away from the ground.
     
  3. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    My new little flyer.....
     
  4. Equus

    Equus Addicted

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    How's Your project going Rollyz?
     
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  5. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Waiting for the cold weather to arrive, been too warm, but then it's only the begging of June.
     
  6. Gimp

    Gimp One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    Looking good for weekend
     
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  7. CR500

    CR500 Hard Yards

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    He might not need a snowmaker this weekend going by the forecast, Fingers crossed,
     
  8. Equus

    Equus Addicted

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    But isn't it BETTER to have More than Not enough?????
    And Yes finger and everything else crossed for LOTS of the White Stuff!!!
     
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  9. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Chances are there will be snow in the hills nearby, but I doubt right here in town. And when it really snows, it's too warm. I need the frosty clear nights with the minus temps.
     
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  10. Vermillion

    Vermillion Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    Yeah that's usually the case. Better to have clear cold nights than close to snow conditions.
     
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  11. Snowmaker7

    Snowmaker7 One of Us

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    Surprised this thread is still quiet even after the ridiculous temperatures we've had! My pressure washer is currently broken otherwise I would have made snow most nights here in Bowral with -3 or below temperatures for 5 of the last 7 days!. Anyone made any this past week?
     
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  12. Majikthise

    Majikthise Sage Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    @rollyz is probably too knackered to reply from his efforts. ;)
     
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  13. Equus

    Equus Addicted

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    Any updates rollyz?
    Thanks
     
  14. Ultra

    Ultra One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

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    would an airliess spray gun be good for such snowmaking activities? was -4 here the other day
     
  15. Vermillion

    Vermillion Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    No. The wrong kind of atomization. A conventional sprayer would stand more of a chance.
     
  16. Equus

    Equus Addicted

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    Anybody made any lately?
     
  17. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Sorry, no. I have had other issues. Was many good days -4s, -5s, -6s, -7s, -8s here.
     
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  18. Equus

    Equus Addicted

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    Sorry to Hear that Rolly.....
     
  19. Snowmaker7

    Snowmaker7 One of Us

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    For the last 2 years I have been using a pretty simple setup by using this generic engine cleaning gun which mixes the water and air together, but obviously connecting the hose instead of using the container that comes with it: https://www.supercheapauto.com.au/p...l/156475.html?cgid=SCA01050104#sz=11&start=12
    I then have the a Gernie pressure cleaner spraying over the top to increase the production as seen in my video from a few years ago:



    This year I was thinking about making a proper snowmaker using brass fitting etc. I was just wondering if anyone on here ie. rollyz has any suggestions of where to buy the bulk and nucleating nozzle from in Australia and what type to buy? I have thought about sourcing the nozzles from the US Home Snowmaking companies but including delivery, all the nozzles will end up costing around $150 including delivery.

    The following nozzles are ones which I have found and are much cheaper, but am not sure if they are suitable for snowmaking.
    https://www.prowash.com.au/product/2247/spray-nozzle-2505-18-stainless
    https://www.prowash.com.au/product/3178/nozzle-4002-14npt-ssteel

    I'm probably looking at making something similar to this:
    https://www.snowathome.com/free_plans/SAH-SG2-combo_internal_mix.php

    If anyone has any knowledge on how to go about building one of these and what nozzles to use that would be awesome!

    Cheers
     
  20. Vermillion

    Vermillion Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    The US company is where I ended up buying all mine from.
     
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  21. Snowmaker7

    Snowmaker7 One of Us

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    Snow at Home?
     
  22. Equus

    Equus Addicted

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    Anybody made anything yet?
     
  23. Vermillion

    Vermillion Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    Mate we've had hardly any rain let alone snow.
     
  24. Equus

    Equus Addicted

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    Sorry
    I Live in England So Don't Really Know what Your Weather is like right now......
    Here its Warm Then Cold Then Warm and So on With a Splat of Rain Added to the Cold Days.....

    HOPE You Get some Much Needed Rain and Then Cold for White Gold play!
     
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  25. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Yawn...… time to wake up! Time to get back into it. We had 2 nights good for snowmaking last week, but it will be too warm for the next week. I might spend time going over my guns, re-sealing joins, checking all hoses and nozzles. I will aim for 3 guns running as I think that will be a handful to run. I will rebuild my 4 jet nozzle gun back to a 2 jet as past experiments here seemed to just make the snow wetter even though it did seem to make more snow, most probably as my climate area many nights is just -2C. I think with the spare nozzles I will build another 2 jet internal mix gun, so that will give me a spare gun. I might even look at reducing the spacing between my internal mix chamber and the water jets to see if that may improve the snowmaking. Also if I can improve the height of the guns, the snow crystals may get a bit more air time. I am also working on a 'back up" warmer weather snow making method bit like with past experiments I post up here some years ago. I am doing this back up as some years it has been too warm to use the guns. Hopefully it will help make a base for firing the snow gun snow on to if it turns out to be a bad year. Making the ice is the biggest problem and I am building a freezer to make it. Next problem is the type of containers to freeze the water in. I have collected 100s of microwave containers, they freeze well and quickly, the ice gets eaten up by the chippers well, but it's a lot of fiddly work. Another method is making 1 meter ice tubes. I am yet to see the results with this, but it could mean more ice quickly with less work. Anyway hopefully I will have the freezer working sometime this week and I can try a few experiments out.
     
  26. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Well the past week has been no good for traditional snowguns, too warm and humid. So time to work the other method. Got my freezer sorted. Cut up and capped tubes. Made ice with the tubes and microwave containers. Microwave containers freeze fast but are really small blocks of ice and are a lot of work putting through a chipper with only a small result. I made my tubes 1.5meters long but finding that they are taking 24 to 36 hours to freeze solid. Some still had watery cores in the centre at 24 hours. I think it is due to the large thermal mass of the water. Still to put 9 litres/kgs through the chipper at once is a great result of snow. I tested a couple of tubes, cutting them in half and thirds and found that they froze solid within 12 hours, they are quick to handle and put through the chipper, though twice as many to handle, but much less work than the microwave containers. I think I might go cut up my 1500mm tubes into 750mm and 500mm and work with these. It could mean that I can get twice as much snow out within 24 hours.

    One big numpty mistake I made was to fill up the tubes and containers inside the freezer, with the door open and freezer still running. Running temps went from -18 to -10and eventually to 0 and later to +2.7C with alarm on. Trying to work out what was wrong I discovered that the freezer unit inside was caked in ice. I think due to the door being open and unit running, it just forced humid outside air all over it and it froze up. After a defrost, I started up again and made sue the unit was turned off when leaving the door open for a period of time, it's working fine now. I never had to make ice on a larger scale before so it's all a learning curve. I guess the saying, shut the fridge door, has more meaning than just trying to keep things cool.

    Anyway, I have more cutting of tubes ahead of me now.
     
  27. Equus

    Equus Addicted

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    Been There Done That, Well Sort of....
    Didn't shut the door ALL the way and when I came back from a Few Days Away and saw it was Open and Tried to Shut the Door and Couldn't, I Couldn't work out Why so I opened the Door ALL the Way Up and saw that it like Yours Caked in Ice and like You had to do a Full Defrost. I LOST a LOT of Food that Day as it was FULL Summer......
     
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  28. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Ice tube 1500mm x 90mm at 24 hours, frozen at ends but a watery core in the centre.
     
  29. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Ice Tubes ready for chipping.
     
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  30. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Many meals eaten to collect these trays.
     
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  31. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Checking out the snow test. Yes, good enough for snow balls.
     
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  32. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Hmmm... well, I don't seem to have the knack with this ice making. I cut down a number of 1500mm in half to be 750mm. By 12 hours they all had a solid ice top, but on inspection, some were nearly complete, but many were still watery cores. The 500mm had almost completely froze. It is starting to look like a pattern is forming 1500mm (9litres) 36 hours, 750mm (4.5 litres) 24 hours, and 500mm(3 litres) 12 hours (and a bit). There must be an art to making ice. Question what size do I do to get the quickest turn around with the least amount of man handling.
     
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  33. Snow Blowey

    Snow Blowey Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    There's a phd in this for someone. Like your work.
     
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  34. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Not happy. at 18hours 750s still have watery cores. Temp -20C. Will check at 24hours. Maybe I need some sort of catalyst. I don't want to use any chemicals. Maybe if one was to tap/bang the tubes like in those bottle freezing tricks...?
     
  35. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    750s and 500s at 12 hours. and then at 18 hours 750s still much the same.
     
  36. crackson

    crackson A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    Aluminium tubes would speed up thermal transfer. Fan assisted windchill would help too.

    Agree with polluting the water. Just not with salt or detergent.
     
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  37. crackson

    crackson A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    Hollow aluminium cores in the moulds blown with fans.
     
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  38. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    So.… I go back up to the freezer and with a big stick tap and bang the sides as well pick up and jolt the tubes. I have no idea if it would do anything, but I ended up breaking a end cap off one of the tubes, resulting in water leaking out all over the freezer floor. Taking it out, it also had a hollow core.
     
    #838 rollyz, Jun 17, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2019
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  39. Vermillion

    Vermillion Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    You might be better off getting the water down to near-freezing in a trough or something, before putting it into the tubes. At that point it will be close to freezing anyway, so hopefully that will turn to a complete ice block quicker. I know there's a scientific term for this, I just cant think of it right at the moment.
     
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  40. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Well the weather has turned around finally. I missed the first good night -5 (two nights ago) as I was just too tired from helping a friend move house the past 3 days, sucks when you have a trailer and everyone wants you to help them move. Last night I got up late, was -4.5 so set up the guns. Numpty me, I left the water hoses out on the ground so wasted time trying the thaw them out with hot water. Got one gun going and instant snow! Temp got down to -6.9 just before sunrise. makes me wonder what it was like down at the river -8? -9? So one gun going and a patch of snow.

    Now with the ice, I read about how ice can form a cap and trap heat in the water below and so it wont turn to ice. I read that one should break the cap to release the thermal heat and it should freeze. So I did that, with a big iron spike, at 6 hours with some tubes, but at 12 hours they were not much better, some still had water. Even at 24 hours they were just like the other tubes, so still looks like 36 hours to freeze fully. I might try a batch of smaller tubes.
     
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  41. Onlybackscratchers

    Onlybackscratchers One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

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    @rollyz I wonder if slowly rotating the tubes rotisserie style as they are freezing would work?
     
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  42. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Good idea, but they are standing up with an open end to allow the ice to expand. Another idea I had was to use something like guttering on rows and rows of shelves, you would want them to be level and be careful filling them, but the long open exposure should work well, just like the microwave dishes, but hopefully a more efficient method.
     
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  43. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Now, this is interesting. With the ice tubes, I had left a whole batch in the freezer for several days as I was helping a friend move house for about 3 days. I Took them out to make snow with the chipper, made another good patch and could slide down on the toboggan. But discovered that 33 tubes had blown their end caps. The ice had expanded in each tube so as to create bulges in the tube or blow the end cap. These were the 750mm x 90 tubes, (4.5 litres). So it looks like that even though I can freeze them in 36 hours, and the ice expands up out the top, I will have to look out for more ice expansion if kept in the freezer for days. I have not kept the 1500mm (9L) and 1200mm (7.2L) in the freezer for that long so not sure if they to will blow.
    The 500s are seeming to take 24 hours to freeze so I just made up a batch of 250s (1.5L) to see how they will go. Waiting for the glue to dry and will test tomorrow.
     
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  44. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Well, I am stumped. The 250mm x 90mm tubes at 18 hours have nice hard frozen tops, and you can see inside, frozen walls, but still a watery core. Tilting lets air bubbles move around. Then at 24 hours pretty much the same. So they all take just as long as each other to freeze fully. :(

    So off to bunnings, I found some pvc tubing at 65mm and cap ends, so tomorrow i will cut it up into three 1m tubes. I also found some colourbond fencing ends that will make good gutter type trays, so i will cut and silcone the end caps as well. I also found some aluminium tubing at home, so i will try and find some matching caps, then cut that down into 2 or three tubes. So hopefully I will find a better faster freezing method..... smaller diameter, or greater surface area exposure, or metal tubing.
     
  45. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    The 65mm tubes full froze hard around 24 hours. Much better than the 90mm (36 - 48hrs). I guess the less mass the easier to freeze. The colorbond fence ends gutter trays were amazing, fully froze within 6 hours, only 2 litres, with a large exposed surface area and metal tray. This is a good fast turn around freeze time. But I will have to build a full set of level shelves to make these are useful to fill up the freezer. I might try and get to a metal supply shop to see if I can get similar gutter tray type in bulk to save costs.

    Made snow again last night, and survived most of the day today, the sun was brutal and such a warm day, still a small patch left this arvo. We recon it was less than half a ton of ice, Freezing up One and a half ton of ice now, and expect to set it off on Sunday morning and see what we can make. Then will try 2 ton after that. It also may be possible to set off the snowguns next week also, so hopefully I will be able to build snow on top of snow.
     
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  46. Majikthise

    Majikthise Sage Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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  47. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    A smaller diameter a gave a much quicker freeze time
     
  48. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Laying the tubes down at a low angle created Ice Spears which were quite sharp. I cut myself with one on the hand when it slid out of a tube. Could be the perfect murder weapon as once the deed is done it will melt way leaving no weapon or finger prints. ;)
     
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  49. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Open metal trays could be the go. A much faster freeze time. But I will have to build a rack of level shelves, stack and fill up inside the freezer.
     
  50. rollyz

    rollyz One of Us

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    Snow test. Quality was good.