Snow Report Mt Baw Baw 2021 - Trip Reports, Pics & Conditions.

travelislife

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Well the lockdown ultimately made it a moot point so we couldn't go the weekend just gone. But I got a reply from guest services on me querying the Big Hill magic carpet. First reply was just 'check the website'. Thanks, really helpful.

When I pushed for further info on when the Big Hill magic carpet would open the response was: "Like all slopes, a certain depth of snow is required to open any run safely. Once our team here have deemed it safe enough to open, it will be updated on our website."

With the amount of snow they have had up there the last 2 weeks I can't see any reason why snow is the issue...
 
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Mister Tee on XC Skis

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BB looks very unskiable at present. It should be pumping but the weather and the lockdowns are taking their toll. I doubt they will stay open much longer.
1629247609717.png
1629247609717.png
 

chriscross

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Let's hope not. BB supports jobs and training for some Gippsland people. It's a fun little mountain for beginners and (low) intermediates, with some xc touring and bc options. Plus it's only 2 hrs from my place. But I fear some questions might be raised after such a disastrous year.
 

Oldie

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I too am rather fearful for BBs future. Like chriscross it is an easy couple of hours from home. I hope that rather than a total shutdown of all lifting, some rationalilizing of lifting might be preferable. For example, although I used to like skiing from the Painted T, I wouldn't be bothered if it was removed, and with some trail works it would be possible to ski Maltese from Hut platter. Am I daydreaming? Anything to keep being able to indulge in a few more years of downhill.
(very much an) Oldie.
 

chriscross

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Painted/Playground hasn't run for years, as far as I can recall (others may know better). Short but fun in good conditions. We could live without it, or hike to the look-out and ski it (have done so). You can ski Champagne and Maltese runs from the top of the Hut platter but getting back to the base of the lift would be a problem for most folk on alpine gear - uphill all the way. Skins or pb skis required.
But I wonder if the problem might be more about the expenses associated with staffing, running the restaurant/pub and fuel supplies. Not to mention access, with only SF road open, so all supplies must be coming via Moe. Is anyone aware of work going on to repair the tourist road?
 
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snowgum

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I too am rather fearful for BBs future. Like chriscross it is an easy couple of hours from home. I hope that rather than a total shutdown of all lifting, some rationalilizing of lifting might be preferable. For example, although I used to like skiing from the Painted T, I wouldn't be bothered if it was removed, and with some trail works it would be possible to ski Maltese from Hut platter. Am I daydreaming? Anything to keep being able to indulge in a few more years of downhill.
(very much an) Oldie.

As a non-engineer/planner, just as a skier, I think this there’s scope for rationalisation.

Fortunately, I’m not quite old enough to remember rope tows at BB. I think the scatering of TBars and Platters may reflect the old rope tow layout?

It’s like most Aussie ski resorts, we can’t go up very far so we go wide, but the duplicate, perhaps great when it’s peak/busy but wasteful and expensive.

It’s high time the Govt/Resort called in the planners to redraw the system - maybe reduce one decent chair (good for bikes!) with a couple of side Ts and 1-2 carpets. And add more ice machine capacity for top to bottom on say summit & or Maltese or similar. Skiing to just Tower 2 Hutt is ridiculous when spending what, $80 on a w/e?

I personally would like to to see T-B ‘real’ snowmaking on summit. Not sure if the resort/Govt would be prepared to spend the coin.

Defintely needs a rich benefactor to leave 10- 20 million in their will. I frankly don’t see that happening.
Trickle funding won’t change anything. And won’t equip the mountain as the climate warms up. :(
 

nezumi

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Painted/Playground hasn't run for years, as far as I can recall (others may know better). Short but fun in good conditions. We could live without it, or hike to the look-out and ski it (have done so). You can ski Champagne and Maltese runs from the top of the Hut platter but getting back to the base of the lift would be a problem for most folk on alpine gear - uphill all the way. Skins or pb skis required.
But I wonder if the problem might be more about the expenses associated with staffing, running the restaurant/pub and fuel supplies. Not to mention access, with only SF road open, so all supplies must be coming via Moe. Is anyone aware of work going on to repair the tourist road?

I definitely rode the Painted T in 2019 when Baw Baw had their Pride day event, but there weren't too many people using it.
 
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Mister Tee on XC Skis

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Painted/Playground hasn't run for years, as far as I can recall (others may know better). Short but fun in good conditions. We could live without it, or hike to the look-out and ski it (have done so). You can ski Champagne and Maltese runs from the top of the Hut platter but getting back to the base of the lift would be a problem for most folk on alpine gear - uphill all the way. Skins or pb skis required.
But I wonder if the problem might be more about the expenses associated with staffing, running the restaurant/pub and fuel supplies. Not to mention access, with only SF road open, so all supplies must be coming via Moe. Is anyone aware of work going on to repair the tourist road?
I heard somewhere that the South Face road was going to be sealed and MacAdamized.
 

Mister Tee on XC Skis

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As a non-engineer/planner, just as a skier, I think this there’s scope for rationalisation.

Fortunately, I’m not quite old enough to remember rope tows at BB. I think the scatering of TBars and Platters may reflect the old rope tow layout?

It’s like most Aussie ski resorts, we can’t go up very far so we go wide, but the duplicate, perhaps great when it’s peak/busy but wasteful and expensive.

It’s high time the Govt/Resort called in the planners to redraw the system - maybe reduce one decent chair (good for bikes!) with a couple of side Ts and 1-2 carpets. And add more ice machine capacity for top to bottom on say summit & or Maltese or similar. Skiing to just Tower 2 Hutt is ridiculous when spending what, $80 on a w/e?

I personally would like to to see T-B ‘real’ snowmaking on summit. Not sure if the resort/Govt would be prepared to spend the coin.

Defintely needs a rich benefactor to leave 10- 20 million in their will. I frankly don’t see that happening.
Trickle funding won’t change anything. And won’t equip the mountain as the climate warms up. :(
LM has become the closest snow and toboggan play area near Melb.. It has replaced Mt. Donna Buang in that role as global warming continues unabated.
Mt. Stirling is now the most reliable XC ski place within a long day trip from Melb.
Mt.Baw Baw is very good for ski lift snow sports but is unreliable for snow.
The SW low pressure winter and spring weather systems that Baw Baw requires to have good snow have not come this year. In 2019 we had plenty of them and so XC skiing at Baw Baw and Mt. St. G. was good , even in
October and November it was very good ( esp. Nov. 2019).
I still plan on using the cheap ski lift ticket day Baw Baw offers on
Wednesdays in 2022( if we are actually allowed out to ski then .)
 
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chriscross

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Cams at bb showing some of the best conditions of the year (and we're not allowed to go). But their email report today says: 'Last snowfall - 16th August" Que? Maybe resort staff have all been sent home.
 
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Oldie

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Cams at bb showing some of the best conditions of the year (and we're not allowed to go). But their email report today says: 'Last snowfall - 16th August" Que? Maybe resort staff have all been sent home.
Yeah chris, I too have noticed that BBs daily reports seem to often be a rehash of an earlier time. It's a pitty that they don't have an enthusiastic publicity person like Dave Clark is for Buller on the mountain. I get the impression that the BB report is done by someone who is possibly not even at Baw Baw.
Getting back to my comment about using Hut to ski Champagne, I completely agree that if you go to the bottom of Champagne then it is an uphill slog to get to Hut platter, but what I was thinking was, about three quarters down, if there was a trail off to the left, crossing Slalom and joining up with Old Hut it might be doable. I have been searching, unsucessfully, for a detailed contour map of the ski runs to see if my idea is feasable or not.:)
 

chriscross

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Yeah chris, I too have noticed that BBs daily reports seem to often be a rehash of an earlier time. It's a pitty that they don't have an enthusiastic publicity person like Dave Clark is for Buller on the mountain. I get the impression that the BB report is done by someone who is possibly not even at Baw Baw.
Getting back to my comment about using Hut to ski Champagne, I completely agree that if you go to the bottom of Champagne then it is an uphill slog to get to Hut platter, but what I was thinking was, about three quarters down, if there was a trail off to the left, crossing Slalom and joining up with Old Hut it might be doable. I have been searching, unsucessfully, for a detailed contour map of the ski runs to see if my idea is feasable or not.:)
When I was up there in a late season snowfall a couple of years ago, mountain staff were complaining that it had snowed. Made their jobs harder. True. They employ people who are not committed to snow sports, unlike Buller.
As for your Champagne return option, sorry, unviable, uphill all the way and they will not be carving out a track through the snowgums to get back to Hut platter. Contour map will confirm.
Accumulation on that snowmobile in T's pic suggests that conditions would be good if we could get there. More bitter irony. Other resorts offer a refund ( FC, Thredbo). BB offer an alternative date for your booking. But I'm not allowed to travel - WTF? Strange days, indeed.
 

snowgum

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When I was up there in a late season snowfall a couple of years ago, mountain staff were complaining that it had snowed. Made their jobs harder. True. They employ people who are not committed to snow sports, unlike Buller.
As for your Champagne return option, sorry, unviable, uphill all the way and they will not be carving out a track through the snowgums to get back to Hut platter. Contour map will confirm.
Accumulation on that snowmobile in T's pic suggests that conditions would be good if we could get there. More bitter irony. Other resorts offer a refund ( FC, Thredbo). BB offer an alternative date for your booking. But I'm not allowed to travel - WTF? Strange days, indeed.
Just curious CC, are you referring to particular environmental reasons for BBRM being unable to cut new trails (we know all resorts face these issues) or is it just unwilling to or has no money to do same?
I presume it’s all three.

I’m a bit curious about this aspect, if BB ever rationalise their lifts, they may not be able to function properly without cutting some exit paths from Maltese runs back to say ‘the Summit Chair’.
 

slotele

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... cutting some exit paths from Maltese runs back to say ‘the Summit Chair’.
don't think it would win you anything, lose at least 1/3 of Champagne doing that. Also going from Hutt to Maltese you miss the first 1/4

 

snowgum

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don't think it would win you anything, lose at least 1/3 of Champagne doing that. Also going from Hutt to Maltese you miss the first 1/4


Yes a good point - so still needs a chair & Maltese T; maybe Tank, although it gets more sun than the Summit side.

A proper planner would have a field day with new layouts - backed by cash of course. ;)
 

Onlybackscratchers

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Just curious CC, are you referring to particular environmental reasons for BBRM being unable to cut new trails (we know all resorts face these issues) or is it just unwilling to or has no money to do same?
I presume it’s all three.

I’m a bit curious about this aspect, if BB ever rationalise their lifts, they may not be able to function properly without cutting some exit paths from Maltese runs back to say ‘the Summit Chair’.
You would lose most of Champagne and end up on a long boring cat track back to Hut Run. It's also cutting across some of the steepest parts of the mountain and would require a fair bit of earthworks.

In the dream world Maltese could be a quad chair and you remove Hut Run completely, that works with the contours better. The new line opened under the chair would be nice.
20210825_233405.jpg
 
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Oldie

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Thanks slotele for the contour map link. That's excellent. I guess that linking champagne to hut is very problematic a on a number of fronts so we can bin that idea.
I'm beginning to think that this year is going to be another lost year for skiing. I hope I'm wrong but it is looking less likely. I've had both Covid jabs but that counts for nothing in terms of freedoms.
 

Serenity

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As a non-engineer/planner, just as a skier, I think this there’s scope for rationalisation.

Fortunately, I’m not quite old enough to remember rope tows at BB. I think the scatering of TBars and Platters may reflect the old rope tow layout?

It’s like most Aussie ski resorts, we can’t go up very far so we go wide, but the duplicate, perhaps great when it’s peak/busy but wasteful and expensive.

It’s high time the Govt/Resort called in the planners to redraw the system - maybe reduce one decent chair (good for bikes!) with a couple of side Ts and 1-2 carpets. And add more ice machine capacity for top to bottom on say summit & or Maltese or similar. Skiing to just Tower 2 Hutt is ridiculous when spending what, $80 on a w/e?

I personally would like to to see T-B ‘real’ snowmaking on summit. Not sure if the resort/Govt would be prepared to spend the coin.

Defintely needs a rich benefactor to leave 10- 20 million in their will. I frankly don’t see that happening.
Trickle funding won’t change anything. And won’t equip the mountain as the climate warms up. :(
How about install one quad chair up the middle to replace all 4 lifts (malt, hut, summit, painted) with appropriate landscaping/earthworks up the top to access all areas. Combine this with a restaurant at the top, chairlift extending to the resort entry point, and you have an all seasons lift that reduces costs (one lift vs 4) and makes the resort more accessible (no snow chains required)?
 

Mister Tee on XC Skis

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BB looks very unskiable at present. It should be pumping but the weather and the lockdowns are taking their toll. I doubt they will stay open much longer.
1629247609717.png
1629247609717.png
1630109422909.png


Ten days or so is a long time in August and much can change at Mt. Baw Baw. We are still in lockdown but the whole Mountain looks skiable now.1630109422909.png
 
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snowgum

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How about install one quad chair up the middle to replace all 4 lifts (malt, hut, summit, painted) with appropriate landscaping/earthworks up the top to access all areas. Combine this with a restaurant at the top, chairlift extending to the resort entry point, and you have an all seasons lift that reduces costs (one lift vs 4) and makes the resort more accessible (no snow chains required)?
I like the consolidation of lifts for skiing. As for linking to the entry point (car parks?) - that would be a long, bendy and quite flat lift. I can’t see that happening - quad chairs are worth many $ millions. Maybe a used model in good working condition? But there’s a sealed road to the car park and most days is useable in winter.

I guess placing a summer access lift up the old line would provide some good mountain biking access?

Capt. Obvious hat on: this would all need a master plan. I don’t recall ever seeing a master or development plan (with maps and dates and things) for Baw Baw in my 35 years of skiing. Maybe I was asleep that day? ;)
 

Serenity

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I like the consolidation of lifts for skiing. As for linking to the entry point (car parks?) - that would be a long, bendy and quite flat lift. I can’t see that happening - quad chairs are worth many $ millions. Maybe a used model in good working condition? But there’s a sealed road to the car park and most days is useable in winter.

I guess placing a summer access lift up the old line would provide some good mountain biking access?

Capt. Obvious hat on: this would all need a master plan. I don’t recall ever seeing a master or development plan (with maps and dates and things) for Baw Baw in my 35 years of skiing. Maybe I was asleep that day? ;)
Funny you should ask about a master plan because this proposal actually was mentioned to me by a shire councillor, so it is not so pie in the sky! The initial cost of setting up one decent chairlift is offset by the savings of running 4 lifts, including staffing. All aforementioned lifts are old and probably close to their use by dates if truth be told. The suggestion of running to resort entry was my silly idea so that chains would not be needed and people could actually take the lift from there (more money generated), and use the whole setup in the summer for mountain biking, including a flow trail all the way to that point.
 

Oldie

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" quad chairs are worth many $ millions. Maybe a used model in good working condition? "
Some years ago, the +1 (who has no interest in snow) and I went to BB in summer for a day trip. While we were just wandering around looking at grass where I'm used to seeing snow. A woman and fellow wearing some kind of badge stopped us and started a conversation with us. Turns out they were resort managers (interim). The woman asked me what I thought BawBaw needed in the future. One of the items I mentioned was a chair, maybe on summit. I, half joking, said that I'd heard that a NSW resort,(Thredbo, I think) was replacing one of their lifts with a new one and I suggested that BB could offer to buy the old one. The lady, Sally I think her name was, said that would not be allowed due to strict Health and Safety specs would prevent a secondhand lift being installed.
 

snowgum

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Some years ago, the +1 (who has no interest in snow) and I went to BB in summer for a day trip. While we were just wandering around looking at grass where I'm used to seeing snow. A woman and fellow wearing some kind of badge stopped us and started a conversation with us. Turns out they were resort managers (interim). The woman asked me what I thought BawBaw needed in the future. One of the items I mentioned was a chair, maybe on summit. I, half joking, said that I'd heard that a NSW resort,(Thredbo, I think) was replacing one of their lifts with a new one and I suggested that BB could offer to buy the old one. The lady, Sally I think her name was, said that would not be allowed due to strict Health and Safety specs would prevent a secondhand lift being installed.
Amazing - happens at a lot of smaller fields elsewhere - including Selwyn.

It could also be true that the Govt. bean-counters don’t believe used chairs stack up in the long-term. Thinking used cars etc? I don’t have the data to compare new and old - it would be fascinating!
 

djam

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The regulations have changed a bit in the more recent years. Making the use of second hand lifts less viable.

I'd be surprised if you could get even close to replacing those four lifts with just one. You would lose a lot of terrain at the same time, like most of that serviced by Maltese Cross, the top section of the Hut run. It would be more of a traverse then a run.

It is really hard to improve on what was built back in the day, as if it works now, it would have worked then.

If you strongly believe in your ideas, back it up with money and go for it, just like how the all the resorts came to be. That's what I'm working to do here at Buller, no way would I look to inject serious money into Alpine skiing at Baw Baw, it needs to move on to other products.
 
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snowgum

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The regulations have changed a bit in the more recent years. Making the use of second hand lifts less viable.

I'd be surprised if you could get even close to replacing those four lifts with just one. You would lose a lot of terrain at the same time, like most of that serviced by Maltese Cross, the top section of the Hut run. It would be more of a traverse then a run.

It is really hard to improve on what was built back in the day, as if it works now, it would have worked then.

If you strongly believe in your ideas, back it up with money and go for it, just like how the all the resorts came to be. That's what I'm working to do here at Buller, no way would I look to inject serious money into Alpine skiing at Baw Baw, it needs to move on to other products.
Fair call - although extending their ice-making to cover summit run T-B should be on their agenda.

Resort still think adults will pay 70-80$ + to ski to Hut Tower 2 or 3? First-timers or accompany beginner-kids maybe?
 

Onlybackscratchers

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Funny you should ask about a master plan because this proposal actually was mentioned to me by a shire councillor, so it is not so pie in the sky! The initial cost of setting up one decent chairlift is offset by the savings of running 4 lifts, including staffing. All aforementioned lifts are old and probably close to their use by dates if truth be told. The suggestion of running to resort entry was my silly idea so that chains would not be needed and people could actually take the lift from there (more money generated), and use the whole setup in the summer for mountain biking, including a flow trail all the way to that point.
It would be one mighty big lift. A lift that long would have to be a high speed detactable and need 2 x expensive detactable mid-stations plus the staffing demands that requires.
20210828_173811.jpg
 

snowgum

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It would be one mighty big lift. A lift that long would have to be a high speed detactable and need 2 x expensive detactable mid-stations plus the staffing demands that requires.
20210828_173811.jpg
Say 30 or 40 $million? Big resorts would Baulk at this level expenditure. However handy winter and summer.
 

Onlybackscratchers

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Say 30 or 40 $million? Big resorts would Baulk at this level expenditure. However handy winter and summer.
I just had to draw it on the map for fun. Dad was a director (and built) of the old access chairlift company, as you could imagine discussion about access options to Baw Baw was a favorite family topic.

Any development like that would have to invole getting multiple slushie machines to guarantee snow cover and the mains power to operate it. Also millions for MTB trails and the old Neylunes Mill carpark upgrade. As mentioned by others, getting private or government investment at that scale seems very unlikely.
 
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djam

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There would be no point to do it in one lift, most people from the Mill will not want to go to the summit, and mid loads are fails, almost all mid loads don't work.

If it was two lifts, without mids, you would be still at $40 plus million. Less if the upper lift a was not detectable.

Detachables cost about double to install and 3x in maintenance. Sadly money from MTB is very little, nowhere near enough to make a dollar.
 

Onlybackscratchers

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and mid loads are fails, almost all mid loads don't work.
They work great when they are fully detactable mids like Merritts gondola and the Perisher express mids. Being able to run the lower half only that the perisher express does in high winds is very handy. Lifts like Horse Hill and Kosi chair that have to run at normal fixed grip speed when the mid is being used are definitely heading into the fail territory IMO. As for that budget shared bottom mid-station on the fixed grip Keoghs/Orchards at Hotham, surely that wins as OZ's worse mid. See so many close calls in that tangled queue mess.
 
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snowgum

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They work great when they are fully detactable mids like Merritts gondola and the Perisher express mids. Being able to run the lower half only that the perisher express does in high winds is very handy. Lifts like Horse Hill and Kosi chair that have to run at normal fixed grip speed when the mid is being used are definitely heading into the fail territory IMO. As for that budget shared bottom mid-station on the fixed grip Keoghs/Orchards at Hotham, surely that wins as OZ's worse mid. See so many close calls in that tangled queue mess.
So Orchard-Keogh is a good upgrade opportunity (detach) when a future lift company has money to burn?
 

jgm

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Detachables ONLY decrease time for travellers - they DO NOT increase capacity. They are a lot more costly to purchase and install and are more expensive to maintain. For a low customer numbers resort like BB, they don't make sense.
 

Onlybackscratchers

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Detachables ONLY decrease time for travellers - they DO NOT increase capacity. They are a lot more costly to purchase and install and are more expensive to maintain. For a low customer numbers resort like BB, they don't make sense.
Detachables have a noticeable capacity increase due to less empty spots on seats, the slower and easier loading helps to increase real world capacity. Also doppelmeyer quads can carry a max of 2400 per hr for a fixed grip vs 2800 for a detachable*, if you check there technical specs.

However you are correct that a fixed grip increase overall run capacity due to the amount of "hang time" that customers have on a lift that has chairs spaced twice as close, that's a lot of extra punters sitting doing nothing for sure. It's actually almost surprising that any resorts have fitted detactables, I suppose customer satisfaction is more of a priority than we sometimes give resort owners credit for.

*chair frequency time can be reduced by about 17% because of the slower loading speeds.
 

snowgum

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Detachables have a noticeable capacity increase due to less empty spots on seats, the slower and easier loading helps to increase real world capacity. Also doppelmeyer quads can carry a max of 2400 per hr for a fixed grip vs 2800 for a detachable, if you check there technical specs.

However you are correct that a fixed grip increase overall run capacity due to the amount of "hang time" that customers have on a lift that has chairs spaced twice as close, that's a lot of extra punters sitting doing nothing for sure. It's actually almost surprising that any resorts have fitted detactables, I suppose customer satisfaction is more of a priority than we sometimes give resort owners credit for.
Detachable are handy where there’s lots of beginners stuffing up their entries and exits.

Try skiing with your kids on the Big D or Hotham summit running at a 1/4 speed and stopping every minute or two?

And on cold, exposed chairs, like H Summit or even Orchard, I’d rather spend half the time on the lift. More time in the warmth of the queue at the base.
 

Onlybackscratchers

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Detachable are handy where there’s lots of beginners stuffing up their entries and exits.

Try skiing with your kids on the Big D or Hotham summit running at a 1/4 speed and stopping every minute or two?

And on cold, exposed chairs, like H Summit or even Orchard, I’d rather spend half the time on the lift. More time in the warmth of the queue at the base.
No arguments from me, I love them. I dress for skiing black runs, I freeze to death if I do a few laps of a flat fixed grip. :D

Getting back to Baw Baw, the only realistic spot for detachable would be the Summit, preferably a 6-pack IMO. It could be made to work but you really need mains power for the slushy machines. But with CC if it's not done now, then the economic window will shut fast. If the gov had made this investment when they took over in 2000 it probably would have payed it's way by now, not sure if that would be the case over the next 20 seasons.
 

snowgum

A Local
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No arguments from me, I love them. I dress for skiing black runs, I freeze to death if I do a few laps of a flat fixed grip. :D

Getting back to Baw Baw, the only realistic spot for detachable would be the Summit, preferably a 6-pack IMO. It could be made to work but you really need mains power for the slushy machines. But with CC if it's not done now, then the economic window will shut fast. If the gov had made this investment when they took over in 2000 it probably would have payed it's way by now, not sure if that would be the case over the next 20 seasons.
My guess is that internally the Govt views Baw Baw as a sort of cottage industry and not a fully-fledged resort. I know they pump quite a lot of state money to fund base infrastructure, to prevent the resort from failing. But they don’t see the role of Govt is to fund major improvements- even ones that would improve liability and visitation (possibly viability?) in the future.

This is sad to me. The basic winter problem with BB is that the resort isn’t close to guaranteeing on decent length run summit/Maltese being open Top to bottom for the core 2 months of the season. Unlike say, Bourke St at Buller - which also has a slushie, or two?

I’d love someone to advise on this site or elsewhere, as to:
- how much it would cost to install a top to bottom slushie system on the summit run, including slope works.
- a CB analysis and plan of the same, including the benefits of increased visitation,
- an option to add a fixed chair on the Summit T line.
- the costs of not doing the above (loss of winter visitors).
- adding a few other options, like summer-season MTB one the same runs - where much of the growth is.
- adding improved energy-generation options to the above plan.
- adding T-B snowmaking on the above run. The < 0C type.

I note, I don’t ask for much during a near-recession as Covid shuts 99% of all ski activity in Aussie. ;)
 

Onlybackscratchers

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My guess is that internally the Govt views Baw Baw as a sort of cottage industry and not a fully-fledged resort. I know they pump quite a lot of state money to fund base infrastructure, to prevent the resort from failing. But they don’t see the role of Govt is to fund major improvements- even ones that would improve liability and visitation (possibly viability?) in the future.

This is sad to me. The basic winter problem with BB is that the resort isn’t close to guaranteeing on decent length run summit/Maltese being open Top to bottom for the core 2 months of the season. Unlike say, Bourke St at Buller - which also has a slushie, or two?

I’d love someone to advise on this site or elsewhere, as to:
- how much it would cost to install a top to bottom slushie system on the summit run, including slope works.
- a CB analysis and plan of the same, including the benefits of increased visitation,
- an option to add a fixed chair on the Summit T line.
- the costs of not doing the above (loss of winter visitors).
- adding a few other options, like summer-season MTB one the same runs - where much of the growth is.
- adding improved energy-generation options to the above plan.
- adding T-B snowmaking on the above run. The < 0C type.

I note, I don’t ask for much during a near-recession as Covid shuts 99% of all ski activity in Aussie. ;)
The gov pushed the founding ski lift company out by putting onerous demands on the new lease agreements. Then announced that they were going to find some magical private operator to take over and develop the resort. Of course it never happened and here we are today. Realistically and very unfortunately snowplay is almost certainly Baw Baw's long term future and that will be a important roll to take pressure off Buller.

BTW MTB off a lift like Summit doesn't work, not enough vertical. From my experience you want a minimum of 350m vertical or ideally more like Kosi chairs 560m odd. Also they really need to be a detachable to get the bikes on and off.
 

snowgum

A Local
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The gov pushed the founding ski lift company out by putting onerous demands on the new lease agreements. Then announced that they were going to find some magical private operator to take over and develop the resort. Of course it never happened and here we are today. Realistically and very unfortunately snowplay is almost certainly Baw Baw's long term future and that will be a important roll to take pressure off Buller.

BTW MTB off a lift like Summit doesn't work, not enough vertical. From my experience you want a minimum of 350m vertical or ideally more like Kosi chairs 560m odd. Also they really need to be a detachable to get the bikes on and off.
The end of the old lessee is one greatest debacles in Victoria’s ski field story. Governments can be penny wise and pound foolish! (I best not digress and discuss the demise of Buffalo’s lift skiing then?)

So realistically, for MTB, only the chairlift run would be suitable for a big new detachable chair?

FWIW, I did the Thredbo MTB ride T-B over the summer - quite a long ride on a hardtail! I’m more a XC touring rider.
 
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Onlybackscratchers

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The end of the old lessee is one greatest debacles in Victoria’s ski field story. Governments can be penny wise and pound foolish! (I best not digress and discuss the demise of Buffalo’s lift skiing then?)

So realistically, for MTB, only the chairlift run would be suitable for a big new detachable chair?

FWIW, I did the Thredbo MTB ride T-B over the summer - quite a long ride on a hardtail! I’m more a XC touring rider.
Yes poor old Buffalo, a case of were a private operator isn't allowed to have a go at getting the lifts going again, they just hit red tape by the sounds of it. :(

For MTB the only real option at Baw Baw would be something akin to the old access chairlift, preferably from Neylunes Mill. That is nearly 600m vertical, I wonder what the tracks would be like through that lower forest section, it would be quite spooky through the tall trees, tracks might stay nice and tacky however.

You to, yes my first go at Thredbo was on a hardtail and it started snowing at the top, I had a dually next visit. I was happy they shut Kosi, the son wanted to go again.

Did any of this make sense, it's time for bed haha :zzz:
 
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Serenity

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Yes, realistically, a chair lift from resort entry will never happen, but one can dream. At least we have had a good discussion about it! There was an opportunity many years ago when Grollo was a contender for the mountain lease, but Belgravia got it instead, bad move. With covid disrupting things and money being used to help businesses out, I don't see the government wanting to spend anything on BB.
 
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