Resort Congestion discussion

skichanger

A Local
Jan 1, 2012
8,826
6,001
563
chaletmyoko.com
Convenience, regularity, travel time and cost are what influence public transport over private travel.

If the car remains generally more convenient than PT, or is perceived to be, people drive. Or a massive price signal.
This applies to all PT and is why we have a daily traffic nightmare in our major cities. The car is often not more convenient than PT but convincing people of this .......Add in the environmental benefits..... but I am sure you know all of this.
 
  • Like
Reactions: LMB

Donza

Dogs body...
Ski Pass
Platinum
Apr 21, 2004
125,600
80,174
3,563
woonona
PT to the resorts will only change if NPWS changes their entry prices from a per person charge model for a Bus. (above 13 pax)

Which will never happen.

IMO.
 
  • Like
Reactions: crackson and Ozgirl

ASkier

First Runs
Jun 15, 2021
2
5
3
We MUST HAVE buses from Jindy. Perisher won't do it as they make too much from the Skitube. Thredbo just want more car parks. It works well from Queenstown NZ; pick up from various spots. You could have buses leave from say The Station, Banjo park, East Jindy and one that picks up at say 4 spots along Gippsland St. This means many won't have to drive to the bus. SAP are wanting to spend millions. This could pay for more overtaking bays. I reckon the resorts should pay for the buses, Parks offer free access and passengers pay say $5 each
 

MisterMxyzptlk

Old n' Crusty
Ski Pass
Mar 12, 2002
27,822
13,518
1,063
I live in Currumbin. I would argue the "keep it flowing bit" :D
Ha ha yes
Thank God the boys' mother drives them to school and sport every day
Not sure I could cope with the KP McGrath merge at 8am, but it's interesting seeing how they'll divert the traffic at Bermuda Street so they can finish the bridges and pushing that huge hill over Oyster Creek down to in-fill
 

Donza

Dogs body...
Ski Pass
Platinum
Apr 21, 2004
125,600
80,174
3,563
woonona
We MUST HAVE buses from Jindy. Perisher won't do it as they make too much from the Skitube. Thredbo just want more car parks. It works well from Queenstown NZ; pick up from various spots. You could have buses leave from say The Station, Banjo park, East Jindy and one that picks up at say 4 spots along Gippsland St. This means many won't have to drive to the bus. SAP are wanting to spend millions. This could pay for more overtaking bays. I reckon the resorts should pay for the buses, Parks offer free access and passengers pay say $5 each
An average 40 seat bus earns NPWS $500 in entry fees alone.
They ain't ever giving that up.
 
  • Like
Reactions: crackson

Snow Blowey

Old n' Crusty
Ski Pass
Jan 7, 2004
26,228
24,356
1,063
Dubbo NSW
If people can't get organised to get up the hill before car parking is full I am not sure where they will find the extra 30 mins to accommodate the public transport journey.

#myrighttodrive
#busesforothers
 

MisterMxyzptlk

Old n' Crusty
Ski Pass
Mar 12, 2002
27,822
13,518
1,063
If people can't get organised to get up the hill before car parking is full I am not sure where they will find the extra 30 mins to accommodate the public transport journey.

#myrighttodrive
#busesforothers
I'm not sure you've thought this through, because if everyone organises themselves to get up the hill before 7.30......
 

Chookfooter

Cranky Curmudgeon
Ski Pass
May 11, 2020
1,077
2,175
363
Buses for staff would be a start...
When I was working up there in the mid noughties a local tour operator, forget his name but he had a black Oka, offered staff trips to Bullocks from the Station and Old Town Centre for a Gold coin. Could not get anyone interested, it seems they preferred to hitch.
 

Donza

Dogs body...
Ski Pass
Platinum
Apr 21, 2004
125,600
80,174
3,563
woonona
When I was working up there in the mid noughties a local tour operator, forget his name but he had a black Oka, offered staff trips to Bullocks from the Station and Old Town Centre for a Gold coin. Could not get anyone interested, it seems they preferred to hitch.
Ahhh the good old days of hitching..
 

Snow Blowey

Old n' Crusty
Ski Pass
Jan 7, 2004
26,228
24,356
1,063
Dubbo NSW
We MUST HAVE buses from Jindy. Perisher won't do it as they make too much from the Skitube. Thredbo just want more car parks. It works well from Queenstown NZ; pick up from various spots. You could have buses leave from say The Station, Banjo park, East Jindy and one that picks up at say 4 spots along Gippsland St. This means many won't have to drive to the bus. SAP are wanting to spend millions. This could pay for more overtaking bays. I reckon the resorts should pay for the buses, Parks offer free access and passengers pay say $5 each

what percentage of people in Queenstown have a vehicle available to them to drive up the hill? If you flew in on a plane and don't have your car with you. you are much more likley to catch public transport. If you have your car pre-packed with all your gear in the driveway you are much more likley to leave the bus for the congestion to catch, whilst you drive your car up the hill.
 

fenrir

One of Us
Ski Pass
Jul 23, 2010
2,637
4,483
363
what percentage of people in Queenstown have a vehicle available to them to drive up the hill? If you flew in on a plane and don't have your car with you. you are much more likley to catch public transport. If you have your car pre-packed with all your gear in the driveway you are much more likley to leave the bus for the congestion to catch, whilst you drive your car up the hill.
Barilaro was talking about revamping Jindy airport as part of his "Aspen of the Southern Hemisphere" plan. No mention of transport from the airport.
 

Chookfooter

Cranky Curmudgeon
Ski Pass
May 11, 2020
1,077
2,175
363
Barilaro was talking about revamping Jindy airport as part of his "Aspen of the Southern Hemisphere" plan. No mention of transport from the airport.
That was actually going to be a new airport at Avonside, it just isn't feasible to bring Jindabyne Airfield up to the standard needed. I believe that idea has been quietly shelved.
 
  • Like
Reactions: crackson

Legs Akimbo

Grumblebum
Ski Pass
Jan 17, 2014
38,809
42,015
1,063
Coastal suburban boonies.
That was actually going to be a new airport at Avonside, it just isn't feasible to bring Jindabyne Airfield up to the standard needed. I believe that idea has been quietly shelved.
Aspen airport closes if the wind exceeds 10 mph (that's not very strong). Perhaps Pork Barilaro knows what he's talking about.
 

Snow Blowey

Old n' Crusty
Ski Pass
Jan 7, 2004
26,228
24,356
1,063
Dubbo NSW
If you want to control congestion the best thing that can happen is that access is made more difficult. Opening up faster easier transport routes to get people into Jindabyne will just create more congestion, even if you get people up the hill en-masse. The location of the congestion will simply move onto your favourite ski run. The final choke point is the resorts themsleves which really only have decent ski cover for 8 weeks per year with existing skier traffic. Add more skiers to the same terrain and you can probably reduce that a fair bit.
 

DPS Driver

A Local
Jul 18, 2014
5,605
6,589
563
Ha ha yes
Thank God the boys' mother drives them to school and sport every day
Not sure I could cope with the KP McGrath merge at 8am, but it's interesting seeing how they'll divert the traffic at Bermuda Street so they can finish the bridges and pushing that huge hill over Oyster Creek down to in-fill
Bermuda st will probably be similar to Reedy Creek. I must admit the little kid in me is keen to see them push the hill into fill the swamp around Oyster Creek.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MisterMxyzptlk

Billy_Buttons

Part of the Furniture
Ski Pass
Mar 25, 2011
11,140
10,908
813
I like it but would prefer to see the buses pick up in (different spots) within Jindabyne rather than everyone still having to drive to just out of town - we want to minimise people driving to a bus location I reckon :)
Mini buses running around town just like Thredbo Village taking people to the Coaches. :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: skichanger

Myazma

One of Us
Ski Pass
May 10, 2009
3,557
6,490
363
Jindi
If you want to control congestion the best thing that can happen is that access is made more difficult. Opening up faster easier transport routes to get people into Jindabyne will just create more congestion, even if you get people up the hill en-masse. The location of the congestion will simply move onto your favourite ski run. The final choke point is the resorts themsleves which really only have decent ski cover for 8 weeks per year with existing skier traffic. Add more skiers to the same terrain and you can probably reduce that a fair bit.
Amen, 10 million to move the congestion from the roundabout to resorts, so failure to park at the resorts as quick as the roundabout can spit out cars is where the congestion starts - get quicker at parking.
 

ASkier

First Runs
Jun 15, 2021
2
5
3
That was actually going to be a new airport at Avonside, it just isn't feasible to bring Jindabyne Airfield up to the standard needed. I believe that idea has been quietly shelved.
For the same cost of a new airport you could probably pay for a mini bus to pick up every passenger from Cooma airport and take them wherever they want to go!
 

Donza

Dogs body...
Ski Pass
Platinum
Apr 21, 2004
125,600
80,174
3,563
woonona
If you want to control congestion the best thing that can happen is that access is made more difficult. Opening up faster easier transport routes to get people into Jindabyne will just create more congestion, even if you get people up the hill en-masse. The location of the congestion will simply move onto your favourite ski run. The final choke point is the resorts themsleves which really only have decent ski cover for 8 weeks per year with existing skier traffic. Add more skiers to the same terrain and you can probably reduce that a fair bit.
Skiers aren't really causing the congestion. 95% of cars after 9pm are sightseeing at Perisher.
 

climberman

CloudRide1000 Legend
Ski Pass
Jul 24, 2000
45,035
39,248
1,563
the sunny illawarra
If you want to control congestion the best thing that can happen is that access is made more difficult. Opening up faster easier transport routes to get people into Jindabyne will just create more congestion, even if you get people up the hill en-masse. The location of the congestion will simply move onto your favourite ski run. The final choke point is the resorts themsleves which really only have decent ski cover for 8 weeks per year with existing skier traffic. Add more skiers to the same terrain and you can probably reduce that a fair bit.
We'll make a transport planner of you yet!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Telemark Phat

Billy_Buttons

Part of the Furniture
Ski Pass
Mar 25, 2011
11,140
10,908
813
May as well get an actual bus if filled with skiers and boarders rather than a mini-bus. Gotta pay the driver the same!
Maneuvering coaches around the streets of Jindy would be a bit difficult, especially with parked cars on the narrow streets.
 
  • Like
Reactions: skichanger

fenrir

One of Us
Ski Pass
Jul 23, 2010
2,637
4,483
363
Skiers aren't really causing the congestion. 95% of cars after 9pm are sightseeing at Perisher.
As I intimated in the perisher thread with limited lifts available that wasn't such a bad thing last weekend. The lift queues were bad enough already.

In peak season though a dedicated snow play area well away form the resort carpark would be amazing.
 
  • Like
Reactions: teleroo and Donza

climberman

CloudRide1000 Legend
Ski Pass
Jul 24, 2000
45,035
39,248
1,563
the sunny illawarra
it makes me wonder how skiers would react if beach access was restricted in favour of surf club members and maybe people with booked commercial accom within a few blocks of the beach
That said, I heard lots of support from northern beaches surfers during the ‘Avalon lock-down’!

And I do live across the road from the beach so...
 
  • Like
Reactions: currawong

Fozzie Bear

A Local
Ski Pass
Jun 2, 2014
6,668
11,658
563
In the woods
Have you been to Sydney!? :)
Am sure if they can collect the garbage they could drive a bus :)

lel..... the garbos kindly folded the wing mirror of my red truck last week. So narrow at the bottom of the street (one way traffic), they reverse down as cannot drive up from closest cross street.
 

crackson

Part of the Furniture
Ski Pass
Oct 20, 2006
12,234
12,175
813
51
Snowy Mountains
O-BAHN to Thredbo.

O-BAHN to Guthega.

Germany financed and built the Adelaide one and we paid it off with fares.

Elevated tracks would have a tiny footprint in damage to the park compared to double lanes.

And a new resort at Twin Valleys. Thredbo O-BAHN could have stations at Bullocks/Crackenback, Twin Valleys and Thredbo.

Guthega O-BAHN could have stations at Guthega, Perisher and The Station.
 

crackson

Part of the Furniture
Ski Pass
Oct 20, 2006
12,234
12,175
813
51
Snowy Mountains
Bus numbers on the O-BAHNS can easily be fine tuned to cater to peak times. Buses can follow each other very closely and do 100 the whole way.
 

snowgum

A Local
Ski Pass
May 4, 1999
5,912
4,380
563
54
vic
Barilaro was talking about revamping Jindy airport as part of his "Aspen of the Southern Hemisphere" plan. No mention of transport from the airport.
Sorry slight bump here:
Barilaro should be careful quoting ‘Aspen’ for his model. Down south in Vexico, Aspen was synonymous with the early rampant onset of Covid. Quite a few (dozens?) Aussies escaped the local resort lockdown, then returning to Melbourne, only to further escape to the peninsular/coast, to host parties and the like?

More on topic: perhaps if the Baril would like Jindabyne to be more like Aspen (which I haven’t been to - I’ve visited Winter Park, Whistler and other N.A by bus), perhaps it’s time he, Gladys and the Transport Minister put their money where their mouth is and fund decent PT to the resorts - at least in peak winter, Easter, Christmas-NY, schl hol periods?

Gee we’re hopeless! Honestly! Send the key players to Queenstown and Wanaka and see how two modest-size SthHemi resort towns can manage to run PT access around town and to mountain resorts.
No Ministers, PT is not ‘Rocket Surgery’!
 

Interruptedbyfireworks

One of Us
Ski Pass
Jun 1, 2018
2,262
6,883
363
Queanbeyan, NSW
Are the Murray’s buses to the snow running again this year? I think they weren’t running last year, and I wonder if that influences road congestion. They are so good for first timers, I’ve done them to both Thredbo and Perisher a few times before I had season pass and was confident driving to the snow. Pretty good price too, and I think there’s even a first-timers limited lift ticket
 

climberman

CloudRide1000 Legend
Ski Pass
Jul 24, 2000
45,035
39,248
1,563
the sunny illawarra
lel..... the garbos kindly folded the wing mirror of my red truck last week. So narrow at the bottom of the street (one way traffic), they reverse down as cannot drive up from closest cross street.
A price worth paying for garbage collection!

OT but I had to take the car into get the new spare key codes to the car (after a fkn reaming in the cost of even a non-electronic key), parked the car up the road afterward to go to work and some butthead took out my rear view mirror. Back in against this week. $860!!!!!!!
 

robbo mcs

One of Us
Ski Pass
Sep 1, 2008
4,551
19,560
363
Kenthurst / Jindabyne
If you want to control congestion the best thing that can happen is that access is made more difficult. Opening up faster easier transport routes to get people into Jindabyne will just create more congestion, even if you get people up the hill en-masse. The location of the congestion will simply move onto your favourite ski run. The final choke point is the resorts themsleves which really only have decent ski cover for 8 weeks per year with existing skier traffic. Add more skiers to the same terrain and you can probably reduce that a fair bit.

This is so true.
A few years ago, everyone complained about the Barry way roundabout and single lane road, how terrible it was that traffic was banking up to East Jindy, locals couldn't drive around town etc. So they sunk millions of dollars into that, and now nobody complains about that anymore. Now the complaints are about traffic banking up down the hill from the resort etc.

If we had magical teleporters that could transport everyone in an instant from Jindy to the Perisher carpark, then everyone would complain about the terrible congestion of everyone trying to walk over the bridge to the resort :rolleyes:

The "problem" is too many people trying to enjoy themselves in ski resorts and national park of limited size. Same problem happens at Beaches in summertime.

What people don't seem to get is we are the problem, not other people. It's all of us, not just "them". You know the old saying, "you are not stuck in the traffic, you are the traffic". Paradoxically, the more money and resources you throw at this, to remove bottlenecks and streamline things, then the more people it will attract, so it becomes self perpetuating, like urban traffic jams

No magic bullet to fix this problem unfortunately, no matter how much money you throw at it.
 

Donza

Dogs body...
Ski Pass
Platinum
Apr 21, 2004
125,600
80,174
3,563
woonona
This is so true.
A few years ago, everyone complained about the Barry way roundabout and single lane road, how terrible it was that traffic was banking up to East Jindy, locals couldn't drive around town etc. So they sunk millions of dollars into that, and now nobody complains about that anymore. Now the complaints are about traffic banking up down the hill from the resort etc.

If we had magical teleporters that could transport everyone in an instant from Jindy to the Perisher carpark, then everyone would complain about the terrible congestion of everyone trying to walk over the bridge to the resort :rolleyes:

The "problem" is too many people trying to enjoy themselves in ski resorts and national park of limited size. Same problem happens at Beaches in summertime.

What people don't seem to get is we are the problem, not other people. It's all of us, not just "them". You know the old saying, "you are not stuck in the traffic, you are the traffic". Paradoxically, the more money and resources you throw at this, to remove bottlenecks and streamline things, then the more people it will attract, so it becomes self perpetuating, like urban traffic jams

No magic bullet to fix this problem unfortunately, no matter how much money you throw at it.
Though ....Skitube.
Underutilised. Massive carpark.
Expensive.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MisterMxyzptlk

Billy_Buttons

Part of the Furniture
Ski Pass
Mar 25, 2011
11,140
10,908
813
This is so true.
A few years ago, everyone complained about the Barry way roundabout and single lane road, how terrible it was that traffic was banking up to East Jindy, locals couldn't drive around town etc. So they sunk millions of dollars into that, and now nobody complains about that anymore. Now the complaints are about traffic banking up down the hill from the resort etc.

If we had magical teleporters that could transport everyone in an instant from Jindy to the Perisher carpark, then everyone would complain about the terrible congestion of everyone trying to walk over the bridge to the resort :rolleyes:

The "problem" is too many people trying to enjoy themselves in ski resorts and national park of limited size. Same problem happens at Beaches in summertime.

What people don't seem to get is we are the problem, not other people. It's all of us, not just "them". You know the old saying, "you are not stuck in the traffic, you are the traffic". Paradoxically, the more money and resources you throw at this, to remove bottlenecks and streamline things, then the more people it will attract, so it becomes self perpetuating, like urban traffic jams

No magic bullet to fix this problem unfortunately, no matter how much money you throw at it.
The only solution is ticket sales controls in peak periods from both the resorts and NPWS.
 

Donza

Dogs body...
Ski Pass
Platinum
Apr 21, 2004
125,600
80,174
3,563
woonona
Which we had last year due to Covid. That is probably why it seems so bad this year, everyone who actually made it to the snow had a pretty civilised and uncrowded time last year
With a couple of exceptions..
A Monday in August we did was similar to Sunday.
 
Remove ads with a
Ski Pass

Log in

or Log in using
Learn how membership works on these forums
Remove ads with a
Ski Pass