Snowsports fatalities

Discussion in 'Snow Talk' started by Mr. Mook, Apr 12, 2017.

  1. Mr. Mook

    Mr. Mook Dedicated Member
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  2. teckel

    teckel Old And Crusty
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    5 of those 13 at Breckenridge. And of those 5, 3 of them involved trees :(
     
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  3. Whiteman

    Whiteman Addicted Member
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    Yep, that's a fairly significant number just for Colorado. Not sure what the count would be for Europe this year.
     
  4. CarveMan

    CarveMan aussieskier.com
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    I'd be interested to see a breakdown of the terrain type. I've a theory that people ski waaaayyyyyyy too fast on groomed runs - I would put money on the outcome that far fewer fatalities occur on ungroomed terrain.
     
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  5. DidSurfNowSki

    DidSurfNowSki Dedicated Member
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    Doesn't include avalanche or snowmobile fatalities either, quite scary.
     
  6. Zeroz

    Zeroz Dedicated Member
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  7. WaitAwhile

    WaitAwhile Dedicated Member
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    It must have been around the mid 1990s , but in one horror week over 50 perished in alpine fatalities, mostly due to avalanches across France ,Italy Switzerland and Austria .
    11 of these were in one group when a group of soldiers were caught in one during alpine training
    These were the days before personal beacons and avi lungs existed.
     
  8. Heinz

    Heinz Old And Crusty
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    #8 Heinz, Apr 12, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2017
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  9. CarveMan

    CarveMan aussieskier.com
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    Thanks for that. Confirmed my suspicions.

    I had a ski school director back when shaped skis were emerging and carving became the thing to do - he was mortified, he thought we should be teaching people to slow down, not speed up.
     
  10. sly_karma

    sly_karma Part of the Furniture
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    Ski patrol will tell you the general accident rate spikes upward on sunny days with good snow conditions. People actually do slow down in poor conditions.
     
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  11. Annabuzzy

    Annabuzzy Part of the Furniture
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    I get most scared on a sunny Saturday after a big snowfall mid week where the ski base has consolidated. Lots of excitable weekend warriors skiing right on the edge of their skill level, if not way over.

    I saw a FB post today referencing the awful death of a young kid in the last few days in Breckenridge. One of the posters waxed lyrical about the dark hidden underbelly of risk in skiing. I have to confess I thought the comment was bizarre - skiing is a risk sport and yes you could die (as statistically unlikely as that is). It wasn't the time and place though to make that point
     
  12. DbSki

    DbSki Part of the Furniture
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    It also says

    The 59 deaths — which do not include deaths from natural causes or riders in the backcountry or out of bounds —

    54 percent — occurred on blue, groomed runs, while 31 percent were on expert trails.
     
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  13. Telemark Phat

    Telemark Phat Part of the Furniture
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    Your more likely to die when crossing the road as a pedestrian than you are skiing.
     
  14. crackson

    crackson Addicted Member
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    Even at the gym.

     
  15. telecrag

    telecrag Part of the Furniture
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    Unless you ski with a telecrag. I dont have any kills yet, just casualties, but I am working my way up.
     
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  16. gaz35

    gaz35 Active Member

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    i would really doubt that
     
  17. Legs Akimbo

    Legs Akimbo Part of the Furniture
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    Why?
     
  18. telecrag

    telecrag Part of the Furniture
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    Statistically more people cross the road?

    To get to the other side!
     
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  19. person s

    person s Old And Crusty
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    I was at Perisher one weekend - two glorious bluebird days - about 8 or 9 years ago when three guys died
    all experienced skiers - as I recall one hit a tree, one crashed into his mate and one buried himself in an avalanche fallng through a cornice in the backcountry
    I think Switzerland has a fairly heavy annual death toll for winter sports, probably other European countries too
    this from 2015
     
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  20. LMB

    LMB Old And Crusty
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    Severe and life threatening injuries do concern me. Especially when my own offspring head into the park or trees (I know how fast they weave through the trees!).

    I witnessed a guy (I think the season before last) smash into a tree after losing control on ice in Thredbo, the sound was sickening. Met him later still in his ski boots in the Après Bar at the Denman and he had the crash on video (his mate took it). He was in a lot of pain but 'feeling no pain' IYKWIM. I was amazed he wasn't hospitalised at the very least!
     
  21. Mr. Mook

    Mr. Mook Dedicated Member
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    Tree wells are another big problem in the Northern Hemisphere.
    usually we don't have that many and the ones we do have often aren't very deep
     
  22. Mr. Mook

    Mr. Mook Dedicated Member
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    Having said that, I stupidly lost control at Smiggins a few years ago and almost hit a tree.
    I came to a stop less than 2 metres from it.
    My own fault for daydreaming instead of paying attention to what I was actually doing.
     
  23. nfip

    nfip Part of the Furniture
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    or driving to the mountains..

    Same applies with shark attacks ...more likely to die driving to the beach .
     
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  24. nfip

    nfip Part of the Furniture
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    dem Pomas can be deceiving ;)
     
  25. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    I unintentionally softly kissed a tree in Madarao in Feb. I think she liked it (no scar visible............). I was a little embarrassed, as I was on my back at the time of the kiss, but soon laughed loudly after the experience. Growing up can be so difficult.............
     
    #25 Zimboo, Apr 13, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2017
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  26. Scooter

    Scooter Dedicated Member
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    I was talking to somebody about Japan recently and made the observation that this past season that for whatever reason I had seemed to have heard about a fair few deaths in the mountains there (not sure if its been a bad season or just reported more in what I am across - seems to have been relatively unstable due to up down weather). They were surprised but I said it stands to reason - outdoor recreational activities are not without risk after-all. I compared it our beaches and indeed I think there are some parallels (like avalanches v rips etc.). Unfortunately not uncommon and when reported no doubt we give the danger the some consideration as those whose backyard is the mountains. A quick Google suggests beach drowning's are in the mid to high 200's for the last few years in Oz so could well be much higher than snow related fatalities (without knowing EU numbers which I assume are significant).

    Not good whenever there is a fatality in any recreational/fun endeavour :cry:
     
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  27. DidSurfNowSki

    DidSurfNowSki Dedicated Member
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    280 drownings in 2016 :(

    http://www.royallifesaving.com.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0004/18085/RLS_NDR2016_ReportLR.pdf
     
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  28. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    Yep, when you get very very large snowfall and variable weather (depending where you are in Japan) the risks increase greatly. The uneducated Australian skier/boarder in Japan is the same as a Australian immigrant who goes rock fishing when the surf is pumping.
     
    #28 Zimboo, Apr 13, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2017
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  29. nfip

    nfip Part of the Furniture
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    We don't know what we don't know.
     
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  30. DidSurfNowSki

    DidSurfNowSki Dedicated Member
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    There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know. Donald Rumsfeld
     
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  31. nfip

    nfip Part of the Furniture
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  32. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    I liked this thread until you mentioned Donald Rumsfeld!!!!!
    What a twat DR is!!!!! He would never know what it was like to kiss a tree softly in Madarao!!!!!
     
  33. DidSurfNowSki

    DidSurfNowSki Dedicated Member
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    lel
     
  34. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    I reckon Rumsfeld would buy his own Easter eggs!!!!!
     
  35. DidSurfNowSki

    DidSurfNowSki Dedicated Member
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    Only so he could smash them in front of children
     
  36. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    I saw a tv show last night that indicated that sales of Trump "pinatas" was off the scale in southern USA!!!!
     
  37. Legs Akimbo

    Legs Akimbo Part of the Furniture
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    If you actually think about what Rumsfeld said, it is an inarguable statement of fact.
     
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  38. teckel

    teckel Old And Crusty
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    I had a meet and greet with a tree some years ago at Falls Creek on the home trail. A beginner was on the wrong part of it (for a beginner) and took off across it to do a snow plough turn without looking. I was headed straight at him/her, and had to swerve at the last minute. My ski must have caught something sticking through the snow and I was airborne - headed straight for a tree (this was in the days before helmets were invented). I threw my body sideways mid air to protect my head and wrapped my body around the tree. Broke a few ribs, winded, but that was all :) But in my defence, that same day an instructor broke a thumb at the same spot, and even Stephen Lee fell in that spot. About 10 days later I managed to hobble on skis to see the tree I'd hit - the bark was gone about 5m from the ground!
     
    #38 teckel, Apr 13, 2017
    Last edited: May 7, 2017
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  39. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    Don't wish to argue what he said.....................what people say and what they do are two different things. Twat in my eyes........anyway miles away from this subject. End
     
    #39 Zimboo, Apr 13, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2017
  40. Billy_Buttons

    Billy_Buttons Dedicated Member
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    imho, I think that the advancement in ski technology, where today people really do learn to ski in a matter of hours compared to days prior to the modern ski design. Alongwith helmets (i'm bullet-proof attitude), skiing with cams, smart phones and all manner of distractions has increased the nutjobs all over the world.
     
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  41. person s

    person s Old And Crusty
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    yep
    at a previous workplace in the late 90s ie pre Rumsfeld, we engaged a consultant for some research work on assessing need
    he gave us a spiel at one point, talking about some survey results in terms of 'met need', 'unmet need', 'met unneed' and 'unmet unneed'
    like Rumsfeld, he was talking about something real, but the delivery cracked us up
    it helped that he had a bad combover, a suit that he had slept in - like one of the 3 Stooges but very bright
     
    #41 person s, Apr 14, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2017
  42. Telemark Phat

    Telemark Phat Part of the Furniture
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    People suck at assessing risk, especially when it's a risk they are regularly exposed to. There is a reason why roads and roadsides are classified as high risk workplaces and ski resorts aren't (as a whole).
     
    #42 Telemark Phat, Apr 14, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2017
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  43. benchives

    benchives Part of the Furniture
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    Meh! Youse don't know risk!
     
  44. nfip

    nfip Part of the Furniture
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    Risk is having an opinion.
     
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  45. gareth_oau

    gareth_oau Old And Crusty
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    I was travelling fast on my board at SP and made a slight error and missed a tree by millimetres.

    It was just pure luck that I didnt smack it hard.

    The outcome would have been more luck based on what part of the tree I hit and what part of me hit it.
     
  46. DbSki

    DbSki Part of the Furniture
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    How much risk individuals take is a conscious decision for any number of reasons, and the risk averse are the poorest at assessing risk which is part of why they avoid taking risks.
    Those most at danger are those who have generally been risk averse attempting to take risks they may not have taken in the past.

    A lot of older men spend their lives avoiding risk and then late in life decide they have missed out on so much due to their aversion to risk, and start taking risks, but are poorly equipped to asses risk well compared to a person who has taken risks all their life and have had some experience of how fast things can go to shit if you push it too far.
     
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  47. Mr. Mook

    Mr. Mook Dedicated Member
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    close.
    It was actually the tree just above the bottom of the Hume T.
    I was thinking about where I was going to go next instead of where I actually was at the time, crossed the t line an lost control on the track headed straight for that tree.
    I pitched forward, hit my shoulder, somersaulted and ended up sliding along board first. It worked like a brake.
     
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  48. piolet

    piolet Old And Crusty
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    Risk aversion is a risk in itself
     
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  49. Scooter

    Scooter Dedicated Member
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  50. person s

    person s Old And Crusty
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    in 2000 spouse tore her ACL, spent the arvo in the clinic at Perisher and never skied again
    the clinicians were researching injury patterns to see whether there was a trend associated with shaped skis
    does anyone know of results from that?