Spencer's CK 2021

robbo mcs

A Local
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Sep 1, 2008
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You start diggin massive holes in the park, you give something back to the community beyond a sausage sizzle

Yep, agree 100%. They have a moral obligation to keep doing it, for many reasons. Unfortunately, they are tasked by the govt to operate as a commercial business, return a profit, and to deliver big projects on time and on budget. Bean counters are not necessarily noted for their moral fortitude or social obligation :rolleyes: (No offence to all the nice bean counters on this forum ;))
 

Chookfooter

Cranky Curmudgeon
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May 11, 2020
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I know. Thats the whole point. It would be a tragedy to lose that historical continuity. However, I also get it from Hydro's perspective. They are left with a legacy to maintain, which costs them money, potentially has WHS issues, and is of no real value to them, only to others.

Fingers crossed, we will see ongoing measurements
I disagree, the value is in that continuity of measurements, you can't just start a new system and ignore the last 68 years of data. Particularly when you are looking at the effects of climate change.
My observations over the years is that the readings are done regularly but they don't appear until the bloke who jotted it down in his notebook gets into the office and enters the data.
 
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warrie

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I know. Thats the whole point. It would be a tragedy to lose that historical continuity. However, I also get it from Hydro's perspective. They are left with a legacy to maintain, which costs them money, potentially has WHS issues, and is of no real value to them, only to others.

Fingers crossed, we will see ongoing measurements
Snowy Hydro is us - owned by Australian taxpayers. They make a motza. Quote "" Following the drop in revenue, and write-downs in the value of its hedging contracts, Snowy reported a statutory profit of $81.2 million, which was down considerably from the $332.2 million in statutory provide reported in the prior financial year. The company paid dividends of $217.8 million to the federal government, down from the $238.5 million in payments delivered in 2019. "End quote. Good PR would be to ensure that the large contingent of skiers and other interested parties have a continuation of the snow depth graphs. But I'm not holding my breath, Hudson died 43 years ago, the corporate culture has changed etc. IIRC Gerg and others had a letter writing campaign a year or so ago when Snowy muffed up the graphs. Perhaps another is needed.
 

Lady Penelope

One of some lot ...
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Sep 7, 2014
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I suspect that snow depth measuring is also a resource issue for Snowy Hydro. If it primarily benefits the snow sports community, they would be within their rights to start asking for funding from that exact same community to help fund their staffing levels. Everything is a commercial proposition these days. Now here’s a thought: Perisher and Thredbo (who obtain their reported snow level depths from the Snowy Hydro measures) put some money their way. A sort of joint initiative .... (bit like private organisations donating to hospitals, perhaps?). After all, the resorts benefit from this but don’t pay a cent for the information or staffing.
 

warrie

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I suspect that snow depth measuring is also a resource issue for Snowy Hydro. If it primarily benefits the snow sports community, they would be within their rights to start asking for funding from that exact same community to help fund their staffing levels. Everything is a commercial proposition these days. Now here’s a thought: Perisher and Thredbo (who obtain their reported snow level depths from the Snowy Hydro measures) put some money their way. A sort of joint initiative .... (bit like private organisations donating to hospitals, perhaps?). After all, the resorts benefit from this but don’t pay a cent for the information or staffing.
They put up lake levels for free, updated daily and no fishermen, boater, kayaker nor waterskier pays a cent. This is available 365 days a year. Snowy does it as per here: Quote ---Lake Levels Disclaimer Snowy Hydro supplies this information in good faith for the benefit of the public. The information was accurate at the time of recording. However, Snowy Hydro advises that the information now posted should not be relied upon, and therefore cannot incur liability for any loss or damage to third parties arising from how the information may be interpreted or used. --- End quote
How hard can it be to do the same with daily snow depths which would only need to run say May to November. For that matter if new depth measuring tech can be placed in a dozen locations that would be even more beneficial to back country skiers and shoers.
The snow stake at PB is cleared daily so is not as advantageous as what could happen as outlined above.
 
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warrie

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I've emailed them this arvo to see what's what. Will report back or send story link when I know more. I'm reporting for Weatherzone coupla days a week for those who don't know. Welcome to the forum btw @snowflake21. Would you be willing to tell me privately what you know strictly off the record if I PM you? That's assuming Snowy Hydro is not forthcoming with info. Cheers
Awaiting your email reply with interest.
 

snowflake21

First Runs
Jun 15, 2021
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Snow hydro is only concerned with snow pack more so towards the end the the season when it's about to melt and run-off into their dams, so you will see more frequent surveys past august. There is no bad PR with not doing them as often, they only do it for their operational needs.
By the way 37.2cm measured today at Spencer's Creek ;)
 
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mholling

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You can find papers about calculating snow depth using lidar. You would do a winter lidar survey and then subtract a summer surface model to get the snow depth. (With some complications due to reflectance characteristics of snow.) Not sure if the methods are production-ready, but pretty interesting nonetheless. You would certainly get a very comprehensive measurement that way.
 
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Myazma

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You can see Guthrie's ridge in the background over Spencer's, yesterday. I guess 67, knee high shrubs covered, bit of melty since Wed.

IMG_20210615_101037.jpg
 

Sno Sno SNO

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I'm sure that as they transition away from the old manual measuring system they will have a good number of years of running both side by side so that they can normalise the new data against the old. They aren't going to throw the history away either - it still has value. Understanding how they relate to each other is important. If the manual measuring does cease there will be a good understanding of how they relate and the new data will be published for all in any event.
 

warrie

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3 Mile dam has a reading of zero cm from 1/6 to 15/6. Malas had pix of Kiandra after the dump so it must have melted fast and was back to zero on Tues 15th. Now Deep Ck in on 18th at 14.5 cm. This is the spot with the new automatic depth and weight recorders as per article above.
 
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snowgum

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Snow hydro is only concerned with snow pack more so towards the end the the season when it's about to melt and run-off into their dams, so you will see more frequent surveys past august. There is no bad PR with not doing them as often, they only do it for their operational needs.
By the way 37.2cm measured today at Spencer's Creek ;)

37cm sounds pretty shallow after all those NSW dumps and top ups? So is it that what Perisher is ‘showing’ outside of the snowmaking areas? Or upper Thredbo?

Maybe from bare old Vic, I’ve assumed too much by looking at the resort cams and reports as opposed to the BC? Perhaps NSW skiers will be similarly concerned about these slow starts?
 

lewis

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37cm sounds pretty shallow after all those NSW dumps and top ups? So is it that what Perisher is ‘showing’ outside of the snowmaking areas? Or upper Thredbo?

Maybe from bare old Vic, I’ve assumed too much by looking at the resort cams and reports as opposed to the BC? Perhaps NSW skiers will be similarly concerned about these slow starts?
It's the 21st of June... I'm not sure you can make any assumptions about the season yet, especially since we have natural snow on the ground.
 

Miffy

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IMO it looks more than 37cm, but that may be because it fell from the SE. Also I’m looking at it through a screen and not actually there in the flesh
 

snowgum

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It's the 21st of June... I'm not sure you can make any assumptions about the season yet, especially since we have natural snow on the ground.

True, it is only early. Then again, I assume you ski NSW hills, which generally had snow throughout the disastrous 2020 year. Covid aside, That ‘snow-free’ winter is pretty etched in the minds of Victorian skiers, even the older ones.

So perhaps cut some slack to the Southern Pessimism. It’s been nearly two years since many down here saw snow, never mind, ski! :oops::eek:
 
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warrie

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37cm sounds pretty shallow after all those NSW dumps and top ups? So is it that what Perisher is ‘showing’ outside of the snowmaking areas? Or upper Thredbo?

Maybe from bare old Vic, I’ve assumed too much by looking at the resort cams and reports as opposed to the BC? Perhaps NSW skiers will be similarly concerned about these slow starts?
Pb and Thredders have used the Spencers Ck readings as the default snow depth on their report sites for many years. Smart skiers just use it as a reference untainted by any resort marketing hype. Trouble is, the readings are not as frequent as many would like and if they do appear weekly the day before a dump then they are quite invalid for that week. Snowy do lake levels daily and have so for decades. New tech as above may mean that snow depths will come in daily. Wouldn't that be noice if they were published.
 

murrumbidgee63

Hard Yards
Sep 4, 2017
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Roughly 20cm gain for the week at 1830m above sea level with a lot of precip last week falling as wet snow & sleet at resort level I would expect the main range up high would have gained at least double that for the week!
 

Infinity Dawn

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Maybe because reading is deemed by the snowy hyrdo as "Non Essential" kinda gives the impression they dont care about it this season.
 

JG

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I looked straight past Deep Creek…but yes, it is definitely a two week cycle on measurement this season
 

Snow Blowey

Old n' Crusty
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No need toeasure snow when it's already flowing as wet stuff I to the dams. Lots of water all over the state at present. Ready for some major flooding.
 

Infinity Dawn

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Deep Creek from 8.9 to 63.7, so im guessing spencers going from 63.7 to around 130

Edit, Depending if they measure it this week :p
 

lewis

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Deep Creek from 8.9 to 63.7, so im guessing spencers going from 63.7 to around 130

Edit, Depending if they measure it this week :p
Fairly sure that's an error. Measured the same day as Spencers and is exactly the same depth. I think it was discussed somewhere previously. I might be mistaken but I don't really see how it's possible.
 

Cadir

Early Days
Jul 22, 2021
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Hi all, finally signed up after checking the forums regularly for 5 years.
If next weeks measurement exceeds 2m that will actually be the highest July depth since 1981 (unless I've missed a year). Although some years did get pretty close.
Decent chance of happening. 63.7 on the 14th, from that point on at 1830m from memory there was about 10cm of wet snow then maybe some more wet snow/rain (assuming it cancels out the 10) then about 60cm of proper snow in total. Then the backend gave about 10-15 ish on the snow stake (reports of 20 at Charlottes). So I reckon 70cm is a somewhat conservative total which should mean we're at 130 now (not really much opportunity for melt IMO). That means we only need 70 to get to 2M, which I feel will be easy if they measure on Thursday. Of course there's always a chance wind won't be favourable, not as much as expected falls, they measure it before Wednesday, so not a guarantee.

My prediction is 210.
 
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Infinity Dawn

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Fairly sure that's an error. Measured the same day as Spencers and is exactly the same depth. I think it was discussed somewhere previously. I might be mistaken but I don't really see how it's possible.
Measurements have been all over the place atm so whatever the site says is the best guess :p
 
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