The big Myoko/Madarao/Arai thread - 2017/18

Discussion in 'Japan' started by M_G, Jun 22, 2017.

  1. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    Well, seeing that Nozawa has fired their starting gun, Myoko thread is go for 2017/18!

    The hard cores are still wringing out what they can here.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]



    Check out the following threads for lots of great info (but post new questions here).
    Myoko/Madarao thread 2016/17
    Myoko/Madarao thread 2015/16
    Myoko & Madarao thread 2014/15
    Myoko 2013-14 thread
    Myoko 2011-13 thread

    When the mountain turns white get excited. [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Info:
    Myokokogen Wikiski
    Trail Maps

    Backcountry
    Things to do
    Bars and restaurants
    Ski lift info & coupons
    Webcams
    Myoko Snow Report
     
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  2. HoopDogg

    HoopDogg Active Member

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    Doing 2 weeks in Myoko this season, staying at Skichangers place.
    Landing Australia day with a week in Tokyo on the back end.
    Have car...will travel, and riding solo, so will be looking for riding buddies.
    Have got plenty of inspiration from Crispy's TR's, looking forward to hitting some of the smaller hills around the traps.
    Can't wait!
     
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  3. Budgiesmuggler

    Budgiesmuggler Addicted Member
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    Doing 1 week, staying with MG. have young kids sonwill need to see how adventurous we can be.
     
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  4. ojisan

    ojisan Part of the Furniture
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    I won't be heading to japan next season :cry:

    But will make up for it the following year, and will introduce my daughter to the wonders of YUKI
     
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  5. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    Be strong...thoughts with you at this time. :cry:

    Looking forward to meeting the family in 2018/19. :)
     
  6. ojisan

    ojisan Part of the Furniture
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    there is a good reason why I can't go..... I managed to slip another one past the goalie
     
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  7. kaegee

    kaegee Dedicated Member
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    Messi. !! Anyway well played :thumbs:
     
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  8. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    Yeah, suppose that's legit. ;) Well done mate! Very happy for you. :thumbs:
     
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  9. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    Couple of updates.

    Went for a look in at Arai yesterday. Looking really good. Unfortunately phone was not allowing the camera to work, so no pics to share. Grrr. Myoko Snowsports is the official ski school there. Not sure when the resort is going to start taking accomm bookings though. Their official website is not even working yet.

    New unique offering at Madarao. Shuji from Family Ski Japan is offering dedicated 'per family' lessons. So will suit relative newbies who would like to ski together as families.
     
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  10. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    I can see Madarao changing fast now. :(
     
  11. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    Very fast. At least 6 new foreign owned lodges alone next season, maybe more. There will be some definite upside with new restaurants, etc. But when they are all basically competing for the same small sliver of foreign market on a relatively small hill I fear it will not end well for some.
     
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  12. Ramenman

    Ramenman Well-Known Member

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    6 mores?. I read an article last December about 23 lodges around Akakura are owned by foreigners. It seems the number still keeps growing. If it will end well or not is up to how much Asian first timers they can get, especially Korean and Chinese.

    Speaking of Korean, the number of Korean visiting Japan in 2014 was 2.7 millions, but it rose up to 4.0 millions in 2015 and 5.1 million in 2016. It was reported nearly 4 millions Korean visited Japan from this January to June, so the number of 2017 is likely to be around 7 or 8 millions. As you know, a major Korean company Lotte will open Arai this winter and Winter Olympics 2018 is held in South Korea, so more Korean people will be interested in winter sports. And Chinese, the number of Chinese visiting Japan has been growing rapidly and Winter Olympics 2022 is held in China, so they also will be interested in winter sports.

    Korean and Chinese speaking foreigners account for more than 60% of foreigners visiting Japan (China, Hong Kong, Singapore, Taiwan and Korea), so if it will end well or not is how much the lodges can get Korean & Chinese speaking first timers, I think.
     
    #12 Ramenman, Jul 20, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2017
  13. Budgiesmuggler

    Budgiesmuggler Addicted Member
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    Chinese?
     
  14. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    Attached Files:

  15. ojisan

    ojisan Part of the Furniture
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    Looks very impressive.... I spose the areas closed funnel into the waterfall they mention on the page.

    Also, it's good to see that they will be relaxed on some off piste & hiking..
     
  16. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    On Facebook some are already talking about hitting up the closed areas. Should take a list of names and see who is still alive in April.... :emoji_astonished:
     
  17. Ramenman

    Ramenman Well-Known Member

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    The link says the top lift = 1,280m and vertical drop = 951m. The elevation of the mountain is 1,430m. I wish Lotte will make a new T-bar lift to the peak of the mountain and the vertical drop becomes 1,100m. I'm too lazy to hike up:p.
     
  18. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    Well, if they'd actually planned the resort right in the first place they could've run the gondola closer to the top!
     
  19. Ramenman

    Ramenman Well-Known Member

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    I found the old Arai map. Compared to the old one, the new Arai has a lot wider purple area = controlled off piste area, which is very impressive. The problem is no lift up to 小毛無山 = the peak on the left side. Most new off piste slopes are around 小毛無山, so we have to hike up?.

    Old Arai closed in 2006
    [​IMG]



    New Arai opening in 2017 No lift up to 小毛無山?
    [​IMG]
     
    #19 Ramenman, Aug 2, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2017
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  20. Budgiesmuggler

    Budgiesmuggler Addicted Member
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    How far is it from myoko?
     
  21. Ramenman

    Ramenman Well-Known Member

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  22. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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  23. Budgiesmuggler

    Budgiesmuggler Addicted Member
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    Err... how far is it from your place?? :)

    FYI I emailed myoko snowsports to find out that if we book in for consecutive lessons at Myoko whether it's possible to do one of the days as Arai. I'll let everyone know what I find out.
     
  24. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    We're in Akakura Onsen, so 25-35 minutes. Just wanted to point out that the term 'Myoko' is bandied about but does mean very different things in geographic terms. One of the reasons we've had to rescue people a few times from JoetsuMyoko Station. Even took in a couple who had booked a cheap business hotel in 'Myoko'. But it was in Myoko City - maybe 30 minutes away from the slopes.

    MSS is the official ski school in Arai so I'm sure they'll be setting some sort of transfer system up.

    Myoko Shuttle is also running a daily shuttle.
     
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  25. Draizuh

    Draizuh Dedicated Member

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  26. Draizuh

    Draizuh Dedicated Member

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    No, You can traverse in.
     
  27. pow77

    pow77 Active Member

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    Stats from Draizuh's post indicate 388 acres of terrain. Any idea of what this figure entails? Off piste included? Only ask as Japan stats are sometimes hard to quantify. Ie they sometimes only measure piste. Is that right? Looks like fun either way
     
  28. Draizuh

    Draizuh Dedicated Member

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    @pow77 would imagine that is just piste as 388 Acres is about 150 Hectares and The remarkables says 385 Hectares of skiable terrain which is there entire controlled area.. Id imagine this place was 5.2km long runs and 900m of vert would be a bit bigger than that including offpiste..
     
  29. pow77

    pow77 Active Member

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    Nice @Draizuh sounds like good logic. Definitely worth a visit.
     
  30. Ramenman

    Ramenman Well-Known Member

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    The bowls around the top of Arai looks like this. It seems it was taken in March 2013. I can't see a lift, so I have to hike up anyway:p. I hope New Arai will go very well and Lotte keeps investing in Arai and some other ski resorts in Myoko Area.
     
  31. Ramenman

    Ramenman Well-Known Member

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    I was reading some websites about Lotte Arai last night. It seems there will be a shuttle bus service between Toyama airport and Arai too. It's targeting mainly Korean and Taiwanese. The international flight from Seoul to Toyama lands at 4pm and the shuttle bus leaves Toyama airport at 5pm, arriving at Lotte Arai resort at 7pm. The international flight from Taiwan to Toyama lands at 11:40 and the shuttle bus leaves the airport at 12:40. It costs 5,000 Yen.

    There are flights from Sydney to Toyama via Taiwan / South Korea, for example, Sydney - Taiwan - Toyama = 14 hours 30 mins and the cheapest flight from Sydney to Toyama via Taiwan is about 45,000 Yen. So, it's 45,000 + 5,000 Yen = 50,000 Yen from Sydney to Lotte Arai resort is possible:nerd:?

    Lotte is a Korean luxury hotel chain and they are already advertising Lotte Arai resort to rich Korean using Lotte hotels in South Korea. Seoul to Toyama is within 2 hours. There is a useful shuttle bus service between Toyama Airport and Lotte Arai resort. I assume a lot of rich Korean rush to Arai and some of them will go to the other resorts in Myoko area too.

    Has anyone used Toyama Airport?
     
    #31 Ramenman, Aug 4, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2017
  32. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    Yes, it's a pain in the arse. I flew there from Seoul thinking it would be an easier transit. Get out the front and there's no buses for 2 hours. So get a taxi for 4,000 yen to the station. I get the next shink to JoetsuMyoko and when I get there find the train to MyokoKogen has just left, like 2 minutes before the arrival of the shink. So then I have to wait an hour for the next train. When I get to MyokoKogen, there's no buses for over an hour and no taxis. By the time I get back into the lodge it's taken me longer and cost me more than if I'd flown into Tokyo! Hahaha, rant over...

    The plan right from the start was to market to wealthy East Asians. Koreans can leave Seoul early in the morning and be skiing that afternoon.

    There will also be shuttles from Niigata Airport too.
     
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  33. Draizuh

    Draizuh Dedicated Member

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    That terrain all appears to be the terrain falling back towards Charmant Hiuchi..
     
  34. Budgiesmuggler

    Budgiesmuggler Addicted Member
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    So that's not the main lifted bowls at Arai?


    And not exactly travelling safe in avalanche terrain...
     
  35. Sandy

    Sandy Dark Sith Lord of the Pool Room
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    The lifts from Arai stretch about 1/3 the distance from the Arai base complex towards Charmant, which is almost directly due west.
    https://www.google.com.au/maps/place/ARAIリゾート+ログ山荘+プリマべーラ(コンドミニアム)/@36.9929209,138.0785003,12.11z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x0:0x98e0f6deff3c2b80!8m2!3d36.9918235!4d138.1871121

    In this map, the highest lift is just above where the "square" (ro) is in the name description for Arai.

    Charmant is over the top of the range behind Arai, down the next valley, and up another range of hills.

    First shot shows resort base, and you can just see the mid and top station of the gondola. If you look very closely, you can just see the top station of the top lift on the ridge.


    Here's a closer shot of the top:



    You can see the top of the gondola, the bottom of the top lift, and on the ridge, you can see the top station of the top lift.
    Directly above that, in the mid distance, you can see Charmant Hiuchi.



    You can see that there is no practical way to tour from the top of Arai to Charmant.
     
  36. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    Probably won't stop someone trying!
     
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  37. Draizuh

    Draizuh Dedicated Member

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    Ummm.. What? ski touring from charmant to arai would be about the least difficult thing i could imagine. infact seeing as you obviously have no idea about ski touring ive plotted a fairly straight forward route for you.
    http://www.hillmap.com/m/ag1zfmhpbGxtYXAtaGRychULEghTYXZlZE1hcBiAgIDYiP3aCAw
    Its probably the easiest ski tour imaginable with one main descent, a short up hill, a short down hill and a short uphill back to the road next to charmant.
     
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  38. Ramenman

    Ramenman Well-Known Member

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    Dragondola is needed between Arai and Charmant Hiuchi:nerd:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragondola

    Dragondola = 5.5km
    Between Charmant and the Arai mountain=less than 4km:cool:
     
  39. Sandy

    Sandy Dark Sith Lord of the Pool Room
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    Sorry, I was more thinking in terms of going to Charmant, and returning to Arai on the same day. Like what you can do above Hakuba, for example.
    So this is the route you are proposing:

    Would you choose the gully like that on the main descent, where there can be terrain traps?
     
  40. Draizuh

    Draizuh Dedicated Member

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    Oh no! Not terrain traps! how could anyone possibly navigate complex terrain and survive? its practically suicide!
    Obviously the 2 min plot i did wouldnt be the line i would ride.
    and further more thats more than achieveable in a day. its only 8km.
     
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  41. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    @M_G Do you know if the Madarao to Myoko/Akakura bus (& vice versa) is running again this season?
     
  42. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    Yes. There will also be one to Arai.

    'opertates' from December 23rd 2017
     
  43. Crispy013

    Crispy013 Dedicated Member

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    Arai will be the new Cortina IMO.
     
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  44. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    Cheers, could only find confirming info for last season. Obviously, I didn't look hard enough, appreciate the advice.
     
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  45. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    Hope so....................leaves more freshies and smaller crowds in other locations. ;)
     
  46. Zimboo

    Zimboo Addicted Member

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    @M_G Last year when we moved accomm from Madarao to Akakura on the afternoon bus we expected to have to change buses in Myoko, but seeing there was only 4 of us on the bus the driver just drove us straight to Akakura.
     
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  47. M_G

    M_G Dedicated Member
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    Yeah, I've pointed out that the whole switch in Myoko Kogen is not a great thing but, hey, the locals generally have a tin ear to any of my suggestions unfortunately.
     
  48. Draizuh

    Draizuh Dedicated Member

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    Tiny, Overated and tracked out at 9am??
     
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  49. Ramenman

    Ramenman Well-Known Member

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    This is today's article. Korean Air has 3 flights per week from Seoul to Niigata now and will start having 4 flights from October 30th. The article mentions Lotte Arai ski resort is one of the main reasons why they will increase flights from Seoul to Niigata.
    http://www.sankei.com/region/news/170811/rgn1708110020-n1.html
     
    #49 Ramenman, Aug 11, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2017
  50. nfip

    nfip Part of the Furniture
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    Hi Zimboo @ojisan @Fozzie Bear and all .....
    Throw my hat in the ring here.
    Booked in Akakura for a week in Feb.
    Close to booking Madarao for a week before we go to Akakura as we've pretty much decided to skip Hakuba and dig in for couple of low key weeks in the Myoko slack , side and back country.
    Looks like we will find enough to keep us out of trouble around Madarao for the week ? or better putting in few extra days at Akakura.?
    Yes we will most likely have car so we can be as flexible as possible with the weather and other random stuff that will appear.
    I have been reading up a bit on this but appreciate any feedback / thoughts from crew that know the place.
    Cheers.
     
    #50 nfip, Aug 11, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2017