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Discussion in 'Thredbo' started by D-eye, Jan 30, 2017.
I thought the whole point of mountain biking was to get those bikes in the air
I have a feeling the lease constraints on upgrading the lifts may be a funding (bank) requirement I.e not KT's choice.
Last year I came across a bank that had an issue with leases and wanted the lease to be extended so that it was 30 years beyond the end date of the loan. Note sure why the numbers were that way but we resolved it in the end.
I wouldn't be surprised if KT's bank have asked for this.
Also worth noting valley terminal has been Heritage Listed, not sure what the conditions are in terms of what can and cannot be done.
So pleased to read that!
Listed in what? The LEP?
Local significance, archival recording, put a D7 thought it after the asbestos contractors are done.
I've got a feeling they could fund the lift out of free cash flow. Be that as it may I'd be stunned if a commercial loan term exceeded 42 years.
I just had a quick look at the preliminary financial report for 15/16 for KT's owner, which is now called Event Hospitality & Entertainment Ltd. KT contributed a healthy $15,007,000 to their profit. Hence they don't really need to borrow anything to fund some modest improvements.
Perhaps another approach might be more productive. Skiers and boarders can buy stock in the company and engineer a board room coup. Telecrag for Chairman of the board - the perfect poacher turns gamekeeper scenario.
Only needs to be a 15 year loan term, whilst this would be a significant term for an infrastructure loan, but it is possible. I also seriously doubt they could find a lift from cashflow as I'm guessing it would be close to 100mil in costs.
My point is that commercial lending has significantly tightened and we have no idea what the terms of any funding would be. People are pointing the finger at KT and I'm just playing devils advocate to suggest there may be other reasons. Also consider the pressure green groups are placing on stopping additional development.
I agree Thredbo needs some investment and I hope they start with the proposed lift changes.
I know from being personally involved in at least three significant loans for people buying commercial property in Thredbo and the valley and credit was a nightmare. Given this debt would be 10 times what I was involved in I can't imagine what would be required.
I'll take the 100m back, apparently the freedom chair cost $4m so I'd say Thredbo maybe $20 by the time they fix a few other lifts.
They would still finance the cost.
Escaped Thredbo today for all the reasons mentioned above. Saw this. Tired tonight but pretty darn satisfied with my day overall. Back to Hoon Nine survival fanging tomorrow!
Overall i think thredbo has done well on the available cover. I have a couple of gripes from recent days. Holding interschool shit all over the mountain did nothing but create bottlenecks that turned into mogul fields which was totally shitting off the paying public. I can ski them and had a bit of fun but the general lowdown from the average punter i spoke to around the place (or overheard) was that the moguls were daunting and anything but enjoyable. So the question is why do the resorts prioritise this interschool garbage over keeping the everyone else happy.
Prime example was lower supertrail yesterday. Funneling the whole Kosi Lift side of the mountain through a 15m wide funnel. Meanwhile that other route down to the left was closed for shaping of some made up BS event for the private school brigade. It was downright scary for me and i can ski. Can't begin to imagine how a beginner/intermediate would have felt in the middle of all that.
Same on upper supertrail. World cup side closed so the main run was trashed. Saw some of the competitors and wondered WTF is that school shit all about? Is it a matter of signing up for the trip and getting a start? Such a wank. Stop having yourselves on.
On lower super trail Thredbo created veg strips that prevent traffic from cutting from Funnel web exit across the the more interesting descent into the Kosi chair. Does nothing for spreading traffic.
That lovers leap side is great but to get anywhere near it you have to miss the better stuff up higher.
The glades is horribly under-utilised because the main exit (beneath the Gunbarrel chair) is a ski trashing mission. Clear a few trees either side of he lift and all of a sudden you've got a whole lot more off-piste on offer.
Cut another Dream Run between Dream run and The Schuss.
The schools should send them all to Kitzbühel next summer, to sift through the trash and work out who will be possible Olympic talent. Then they can stop them from the current resort takeovers!
Increasing lift capacity without changing skiable area just means more people on the same runs at the same time. Doesn't solve the stated problem.
Agree very strongly with this despite my earlier comments on previous page about having had a good day today. A mountain crew guy actually told me that the half of lower supertrail that was roped off did not have enough snow. Trollolololololol! A lotta big bucks being spent around the village by private school families though so guess why these people get priority?
I think the race stuff is completely over the top. Small Oz resorts cannot handle it. Plus they all ski like idiots in between races anyway.
That lower supertrail mogul mine field should get groomed during the day...say around 2.30pm. Not left for overnight work. Same with skiers right at the bottom of Hoon Nine. That section is a train smash.
Overseas they groom during the day no worries.
And let the wannabe racers queue with the punters as well. That shits me no end.
They probably would finance it for tax reasons but as I think your numbers show, they don't need to borrow a cent
Yes, they'd need to cut a new run or two and install snowmaking.
This has all been part of the KT master plan for decades in one form or another. They just need to do it
The silly idiots gave the leasehold from golf course to dead horse gap, back to national parks!!!!
The race crowd are worth waaaay more than the regular paying public at this time, so business dictates that you give them priority.
Did they get any actual thing by giving up this valuable right????
Not to my knowledge.
No wonder after 20 years of planning they still can't manage to build one ski lift. Lucky they're not in the business of running a ski resort...
...no wait, hang on...they ARE in the business of running a ski resort.
Well, when the owner bought in with only cinemas as their interest at the time, then go and employ a manager that knows only how to run hotels...this is why the resort is where it is today.
Give up all hope. The board has had some pretty disgusting people on it.
Like Meredith Hellicar, the piece of crap that took jameshardie offshore to avoid paying asbestos victims.
Her ilk couldn't care less what thredbo users think.
Not strictly true, just because then made $15m pre tax doesn't mean they can afford to spend all of that in one go on upgrades. I'm assuming their shareholders want a return.
You would hope they have provisioned for replacements but who knows.
I tend to agree on the bottom of the supertrail, I think slowing people down a little in that area would be a good start to stopping it carve up as much.
The big boss of thredbo isn't even based there. They don't care one bit. It's a cash cow to prop up the hotel side of ops.
Write letters? Hahahaha.
I guess what would really help would be a couple of nice snowfalls but if anyone was contemplating communicating something to try help the nice local managers and staff get more resources, you might find the following quote from Events 2016 Annual Report a useful point of reference.
" The key strategy for the Thredbo Alpine Resort is to maintain the facility as one of the premier Australian holiday destinations. This strategy includes:
continuing to ensure the popularity, high‐quality and ambience of the winter‐time resort facility;
continuing to improve snow making capability to mitigate risk in poor snow seasons; ...."
Had a good laugh at the alpine hotel outdoor pub fire pits. A bunch of private school kids about 12 years old standing at fire. Absolutely petrified of throwing a bit of wood on the fire. Made me feel lucky to have had a simple upbringing where i got to play with fire. Money cant buy some things.
It can rent it though can't it?
Snowmaking on all tbars could have them open early like merritts.
Upper mountain snowmaking is not optional. It must be done.
Using the current guns on funnel web and grooming it daily doesn't even require money. It just needs someone to say do it now.
They'll say it's too hard and there's no winch point. That's been the excuse for 20yrs and it's not true.
Funnel web is deliberately ignored based on apathy alone.
Seems that way.
Who'd have thought Thredbo would become like PB during the latter Packer years - an aging cash cow?
interschools competitors don't get lift priority.
Thredbo Ski Race Club does, because they pay heaps and utilise Thredbo staff.
St Moritz same, they use Thredbo instructors.
Interschools is a great idea, and there are a heap of public schools there as well, just with a bit less obvious branding (although it exists).
It works fine when everything is open but is a big impost when it's not. It also sells a heap of tickets! We can't complain too hard about profits not being reinvested AND about profit-delivering activities! (Except of course this is the inturdanet and we can !!!!).
I only whine because I look out from the chair and see potential, combined with inaction. It's a let down. Summer development is going great, winter just needs to catch up!!!
With unlimited funds, my vision of a big indoor tube running down the Supertrail (with tunnels underneath for the mtb to cross) offering a year round ski run, I mean come on! Make it out of solar panels, and put turbines on all the towers so its sustainable, with a big fk off tesla battery that makes SA swoon!
Now that makes a lot of sense. That area is massively under-used. It gains a lot of new terrain for not a lot of outlay. That's assuming the National Parks will allow for the clearing of trees.
I'm ashamed to admit I went to Buller for their early opening just to shake off the cobwebs and look at their new toy. Their magic slushie machine (the snow factory) would be perfect to provide cover on the lower supertrail and the Kosi Express as the snow line seems to sit above this level most days.
Back to current conditions, are they winning the war against melt and managing to increase the cover lower down?
Today I understand the resort was 30% less busy, and as a consequence the experience was broadly pleasant. The runs are still not in top nick but not too bad.
Just finished 3 Highnoon arvo runs on some gifted RC4s ... with good edges ... rather nice .
I'm heading to Thredbo for my first time next week. What are some of the little secret spots I should look for? Also, what's the deal with parking etc. whereabouts do I get a alpine pass from? I'm a Mt Buller instructor so it's all new to me!
I don't think anyone would want to divulge their 'secret' spots on a public forum...
Bwahahahaha...good luck with that one!
Next week could be fun. There are a few overnight carparks to park in, they are free. You need to have a multi day parks pass though. They are $190 for a year, I dont know how much otherwise. Thredbo also run free buses to get you around the village. Have a great time, I hope she turns it on for you, when its on, its the best in OZ. Get a trail map, hook up with locals for 'secret' lines.
A day pass is about 30 a day . So if here for the week its value as it can be used for all parks for 12 mths .Otherwise give your leaving date when buying . Not many secret spots relevant ATM ... if not within a snowgun .
I concur with this. They also finally opened the run to the village on the other side ( I believe it's called Sundance) which meant you could avoid winds in the arvo by skiing the approx 300m of vertical from Bunny Walk station snowgums to bottom and have the lower half ENTIRELY to yourself. Show me anywhere in Oz right now where u can get 150m of vertical on smooth arvo corduroy (OK, with a death cookie or two) and have the run to yourself and no queues. Glass half full reporter out.
As i said earlier - that part of the resort is so hard to get to unless you specifically aim for it by skiing down beside rossi racecourse. And in the past has so seldom been skiable that the average thredbo person simply doesn't realise those bits are there. Is good on a fresh snow day. You can find it untracked in the late afternoon as all the serious folk can't get there from bluff / little beauty / funnel web / GCB side.
Shh...... Supertrail and High Noon ..........Shhhh. Then Merrits.
Thredbo secret runs?
Get as high as you can and stay as high as you can.
If you look at the live FF cam right now you can see the kids doing the flare run (5.45pm EST)
And now fireworks