Thredbo bouquets and brickbats

Telezacski

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So change nothing in the service supply side, but change more?
Wow, major forward thinking here folks.

I just cant see an answer on the service supply side, I cant see a multi story car park going in apart from ascetics the approval process would be a nightmare as would trying to do anything on the golf course. We are not dealing with an area where we have open slather on town planning, their is a finite amount of space.

One solution would be to get rid of bus parking, and provide a small amount of Bus parking elsewhere. Once school groups etc get dropped off the buses aren't needed until the end of the day and the drivers generally just sit around drinking coffee so they may as well be down at the ski tube waiting. There are a few few spots along the alpine way for buses to park as well.
 

Donza

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I just cant see an answer on the service supply side, I cant see a multi story car park going in apart from ascetics the approval process would be a nightmare as would trying to do anything on the golf course would be worse. We are not dealing with an area where we have open slather on town planning, their is a finite amount of space.

One solution would be to get rid of bus parking, and provide a small amount of Bus parking elsewhere. Once school groups etc get dropped off the buses aren't needed until the end of the day and the drivers generally just sit around drinking coffee so they may as well be down at the ski tube waiting. There are a few few spots along the alpine way for buses to park as well.
The bus parking area is huge at Thredbo (in Comparison to smiggs)
Its also a bit odd considering the lack of coach bookings now, that it continues to be a bus area.
At Perisher last weekend they used the coach area as a overflow. As the coach booking numbers were so low.
 

Annabuzzy

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Imho Thredbo needs to find a way for Day visitors to spend money in the resort. If they don't, the hassle of the increased visitation far outweighs any benefits and indeed just degrades the experience for customers who actually spend money.

My tip would be to replace low tech free snow play with higher tech snow play you can charge a fee to enjoy. In one hit you'll reduce visitation and increase revenue.

Most of the snow play can be done for free in the National Park anyway.
 
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Donza

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Most of the snow play can be done for free in the National Park anyway.

This is an interesting point.
Many don't realise this. The marketing and promotion leads them towards the resort. As does the word of mouth (i know a few snow players, first timers etc from Miss P's school)
The amount of money they spent in resort was staggering (albeit at Perisher)
2 days lunches $65 and $70 , tube town which is what 30 bucks plus..then on a whim hired a snowboard for 1/2 a day . Then next day had a beginner lesson.
 

telecrag

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From memory KT said they made somewhere around $50K profit, first year.
 

Billy_Buttons

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The ultimate solution is for Selwyn to build big accommodation so the free loading punters can go there for their snow play instead of turning Thredbo into a shit fight side show.
 
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Ozgirl

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Yep!

A few friends of mine refuse to ski... can't stand their precious darling missing out on seeing snow.

Book a snow play trip - next thing the kid begs to do the real thing. All of a sudden kids in full day ski school with all rented equipment - from the resort.. ka-ching
 

LMB

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The ultimate solution is for Selwyn to build big accommodation so the free loading punters can go there for their snow play instead of turning Thredbo into a shit fight side show.
A dedicated HUGE snowplay location could CLEAN UP! Seriously! People are paying crazy money for terrible experiences in the centre of the city. If it was done right with quality set up, quality equipment, fun and diverse activities etc you could really do well.
You could even run beacon and search training as an activity. All with a modest (but cumulative) participation/hire charge.

And Xmas in 'July' theme it!!
Ca-ching
 

Donza

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Mind you the snow play experience has been aided by the amount of snow this season.
 

LMB

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Think creatively people!
A 10 deck multi level car park on Friday flat with the top deck the new higher friday flat slope integrated into the hillside.
You know it makes sense
Hell yes!!!
 

skinavy

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The overnight parking areas may go. To make room for day parking
It might end up similar to Perisher where overnight cars are parked off the hill (ie sawpit or bullocks) with people being bussed in. I don't agree with it, however its an easy solution
I also noticed traffic cones being placed over parking signs. WTF is that?
The problem isn't Thredbos alone. Perisher has blown out nearly every weekend this season. With cars parked 8kms away.
I can't see Perisher allowing Thredbo customers to park at Bullocks. There is nothing in it for Perisher.
 

skinavy

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Charging for parking might work, IF they built a multi story.

You want the convenience of undercover parking, no snow on your precious car, the ability to change in/out of your gear undercover - it'll cost you.

If they made the entry level tall then they could do larger spots - undercover RV parking, tall SUVs with a roof box etc - few extra dollars for such luxuries. Maybe even a few reservable plug in spots at caravan park rates for the RV/campervans.

Upper deck could either have a roof to allow for full price patronage, or no roof and be used exclusively for staff parking (which would free up some on the ground spots).

Parking meters at all current roadside spots for the use of snow play day trippers, parking pass included with all accomodation bookings and season passes (multistory access extra).
No way there will be plug in for RV/caravans, that was part of the ongoing problem with Chewbacca guy. Effectively squatting in the overnight carpark and using the sport centre as his shower facilities.
 
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Donza

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I can't see Perisher allowing Thredbo customers to park at Bullocks. There is nothing in it for Perisher.
No I wasn't meaning Bullocks as a solution. I was pointing out it happens at Perisher
 

skinavy

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A dedicated HUGE snowplay location could CLEAN UP! Seriously! People are paying crazy money for terrible experiences in the centre of the city. If it was done right with quality set up, quality equipment, fun and diverse activities etc you could really do well.
You could even run beacon and search training as an activity. All with a modest (but cumulative) participation/hire charge.

And Xmas in 'July' theme it!!
Ca-ching
You mean like Corin Forest...
 

Donza

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No way there will be plug in for RV/caravans, that was part of the ongoing problem with Chewbacca guy. Effectively squatting in the overnight carpark and using the sport centre as his shower facilities.
So whats the go with ON parking down there? how is it regulated?
 

Untele-whippet

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These signs went up 5/8/17
 

Untele-whippet

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42 days straight is the max an unattended vehicle can be left in the same spot.
NPWS have control of the carparks.
People have been staying o/n in vehicles unobtrusively for decades but it got out out hand in the past few years, the back row of CP4 was wall to wall vans with parties some nights, caravans and big buses with full on smoking chimney flues in CP3, not to mention the problem of too many vehicles for the available spits on weekends, so KT after patron complaints asked NPWS to crack down.
Dawn fines after previous courtesy notes on windscreens.
 

LMB

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These signs went up 5/8/17
Oh wow.
Was that before or after the Chewie attack?

A lot of people have 'car danchi' stayed in the ON carpark in the past. It's a shame that the poor behaviour of the minority effects the good guys.

No way there will be plug in for RV/caravans, that was part of the ongoing problem with Chewbacca guy. Effectively squatting in the overnight carpark and using the sport centre as his shower facilities.
Right... yes I see that would present a problem.

However if they had it set up for it and charged accordingly with pre-booking required then they could control it. Undesirable tenant? Sorry not available. Breaking the rules? Sorry, evicted.
You mean like Corin Forest...
Dunno.
I've never been to Corin.
Is it set up like that?
Commercial operation and all?
 

crackson

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The entire industry is strangled by npws and snowy council. So the only way left to increase profits is to target the poorer demographic with fines and penalties and moving them on for wankers in bmw's.
 
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crackson

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Get snowed in to ON carpark in blizzard. Sleep in car, get fine because of a'holes living there.

Makes total sense only to a corporate wanker.
 

Donza

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The entire industry is strangled by npws and snowy council. So the only way left to increase profits is to target the poorer demographic with fines and penalties and moving them on for wankers in bmw's.
sheesh..... you should ride at Perisher
 

Donza

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The entire industry is strangled by npws and snowy council. So the only way left to increase profits is to target the poorer demographic with fines and penalties and moving them on for wankers in bmw's.
Poorer demographics at a ski hill is a oxymoron
Its not the 90's anymore.
Though sometimes it feels like it
 
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skinavy

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Oh wow.
Was that before or after the Chewie attack?

A lot of people have 'car danchi' stayed in the ON carpark in the past. It's a shame that the poor behaviour of the minority effects the good guys.


Right... yes I see that would present a problem.

However if they had it set up for it and charged accordingly with pre-booking required then they could control it. Undesirable tenant? Sorry not available. Breaking the rules? Sorry, evicted.

Dunno.
I've never been to Corin.
Is it set up like that?
Commercial operation and all?
Corin pretty much targets snowplay, does have a run and lift but it is mostly a commercial snowplay area (witha 'bobsled' track like the Thredbo one).

They even had a dog snowplay session last week as they're outside of a national park.
 
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Telezacski

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I can't see Perisher allowing Thredbo customers to park at Bullocks. There is nothing in it for Perisher.

I don't believe Perisher own the ski tube, they may lease buildings and have a deal with the owners but they don't own it.

My old man was on the team that did the original feasibility as an offshoot to the feasibility they did on the VFT. From memory it was always supposed to be an access point to both mountains, Perisher and Thredbo, as the roads weren't designed to carry the traffic they do.

At one stage the preferred route of the VFT was Sydney to Melbourne via the Barry way with a link from Jindy to Bullocks flat so that people could catch a train the whole way.
 

Legs Akimbo

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I don't believe Perisher own the ski tube, they may lease buildings and have a deal with the owners but they don't own it.

My old man was on the team that did the original feasibility as an offshoot to the feasibility they did on the VFT. From memory it was always supposed to be an access point to both mountains, Perisher and Thredbo, as the roads weren't designed to carry the traffic they do.

At one stage the preferred route of the VFT was Sydney to Melbourne via the Barry way with a link from Jindy to Bullocks flat so that people could catch a train the whole way.
I think they do own the Toob.
 

skinavy

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I don't believe Perisher own the ski tube, they may lease buildings and have a deal with the owners but they don't own it.

My old man was on the team that did the original feasibility as an offshoot to the feasibility they did on the VFT. From memory it was always supposed to be an access point to both mountains, Perisher and Thredbo, as the roads weren't designed to carry the traffic they do.

At one stage the preferred route of the VFT was Sydney to Melbourne via the Barry way with a link from Jindy to Bullocks flat so that people could catch a train the whole way.
According to Wikipedia it's owned by Broadspectrum (49%) Kumagi Gumi (49%) and Ken Bilston (2%). There is no mention of it having anything to do with Thredbo or the VFT. The only mentions are to do with Perisher and Blue Cow and the expectation that the Koziuscko road would be closed in winter. Regardless I would be very surprised if Perisher would allow Thredbo to use the carpark and I would say Perisher have pretty much exlusive rights (albeit they tolerate Charlotte Pass customers)
 

Donza

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Is it in the National Park? Perisher and BC are but I don't think Bullocks is. The park entry gates are after Bullocks.
Yeah its in the NP... Little thredbo river is the boundary. Crackenback isn't in the park.
However its a odd arrangement for parking ..hence the hefty charge for riding the tube
 

Telezacski

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According to Wikipedia it's owned by Broadspectrum (49%) Kumagi Gumi (49%) and Ken Bilston (2%). There is no mention of it having anything to do with Thredbo or the VFT. The only mentions are to do with Perisher and Blue Cow and the expectation that the Koziuscko road would be closed in winter. Regardless I would be very surprised if Perisher would allow Thredbo to use the carpark and I would say Perisher have pretty much exlusive rights (albeit they tolerate Charlotte Pass customers)

None of the mentioned companies are related to Perisher Blue.

As I said the study was a spin off from the VFT study completed by SMEC, not part of the VFT study. There were findings which have been largely ignored.

The reality is the land is leased and Perisher would have no say if National parks said sorry but that car park is to be shared with Thredbo.
 
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telecrag

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I have no problem with this. There's a whole national park to camp in. No need to camp in a lease area paid for by someone else

There is a total lack of affordable accommodation in the area, particularly for one person. The campgrounds are full (and bloody noisy) the caravan parks are full too. I really think this has become a problem, because they have made skiing itself cheap, attracting more people, but everything else more expensive, encouraging people to explore options that they have not historically done. Hence the signs. IMO its fair enough though, who want to pick up peoples shit? And if you are paying $25K a week for a rental, and see a RV setup….

Its one thing having the odd visitor sleep in their car, another to have full blown setups, doing their own cooking etc.
 

Legs Akimbo

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According to Wikipedia it's owned by Broadspectrum (49%) Kumagi Gumi (49%) and Ken Bilston (2%). There is no mention of it having anything to do with Thredbo or the VFT. The only mentions are to do with Perisher and Blue Cow and the expectation that the Koziuscko road would be closed in winter. Regardless I would be very surprised if Perisher would allow Thredbo to use the carpark and I would say Perisher have pretty much exlusive rights (albeit they tolerate Charlotte Pass customers)
They were the original owners. I think things have moved on from there.
 

skinavy

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They were the original owners. I think things have moved on from there.
Yeah looks like it. After quite a bit of google fu it looks like Perisher do own it now, according to the article below from Office of National Rail Safety Regulator. This would also suggest Perisher lease the carpark and surrounding area (probably on a 60 or more year lease), so unless NPWS want to break the lease contract, Perisher would be within their rights to not allow Thredbo to use it for parking.

https://www.onrsr.com.au/resource-c...resentations-and-case-studies/pbpl-case-study
 

crackson

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No. Junior staff buses from jindy and senior staff should park at the tip.

The ball has been dropped by management on parking yet the customers are paying the penalty.

Maybe they could make some sort of announcement regarding solving the problem in coming seasons.

Doing nothing about parking is not an option.
 
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Donza

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I don't believe Perisher own the ski tube, they may lease buildings and have a deal with the owners but they don't own it.

My old man was on the team that did the original feasibility as an offshoot to the feasibility they did on the VFT. From memory it was always supposed to be an access point to both mountains, Perisher and Thredbo, as the roads weren't designed to carry the traffic they do.

At one stage the preferred route of the VFT was Sydney to Melbourne via the Barry way with a link from Jindy to Bullocks flat so that people could catch a train the whole way.
Every state and federal election had/has feasibility studies into a train... that goes fast.
That swoop down below the snowys was put back by the 100kms plus of tunnels.
It had zero relevance to the skitube.
 
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Donza

Dogs body...
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No. Junior staff buses from jindy and senior staff should park at the tip.

The ball has been dropped by management on parking yet the customers are paying the penalty.

Maybe they could make some sort of announcement regarding solving the problem in coming seasons.

Doing nothing about parking is not an option.
Or you could drop 40 K on a wedding ...and have your makeup and hairdressers have to walk from the alpine way to FF then catch two buses..Being an hour late
Then you could have 30 plus guests staying at THA and have your wedding there as well...and have no parking .
 
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Telezacski

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Yeah looks like it. After quite a bit of google fu it looks like Perisher do own it now, according to the article below from Office of National Rail Safety Regulator. This would also suggest Perisher lease the carpark and surrounding area (probably on a 60 or more year lease), so unless NPWS want to break the lease contract, Perisher would be within their rights to not allow Thredbo to use it for parking.

https://www.onrsr.com.au/resource-c...resentations-and-case-studies/pbpl-case-study

If they do lease the car park etc it would be on the same terms as their head lease which they are trying to extend at the moment.

Pretty easy as part of the head lease re negotiations for the parks to require them to provide access to Thredbo users.
 
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