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Tokyo warning: specific types of nightlife unsafe for travelers

Discussion in 'Japan' started by damian, Mar 1, 2011.

  1. M_G

    M_G M_G_ = Make skiing great again Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    I could just imagine. Unfortunately amongst all the good stuff there's a core of right tossers on SJ. Main reason I never bother to go there anymore. [​IMG]
     
    #51 M_G, Mar 1, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 11, 2013
  2. Sandy

    Sandy Dark Sith Lord of the Pool Room Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    What sort of stuff do they say, FT??

    (or give me a link?)
     
    #52 Sandy, Mar 1, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  3. Toto Warmlet

    Toto Warmlet One of Us

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    kaos, how bout you change the wording under your posts?
     
  4. LMB

    LMB Old but definitely not Crusty! Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Just too pompous for words.
    I've had my say...told I was silly as usual. [​IMG]
     
    #54 LMB, Mar 1, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  5. Heinz

    Heinz Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    exactly. In Japan you normally feel so safe, so you are not expecting anything untoward.

    Cregs example above of India and other places in Asia highlights this. After a couple of days (if that) in India you soon learn that most people approaching you are after something even if they are mostly simple beggars, so you are always wary.
     
    #55 Heinz, Mar 1, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  6. sara777

    sara777 A Local Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    That's a bit harsh mate. We all make sometimes choices that we later wish we hadn't made. Kaos opened himself on here with the purpose of helping others to prevent such experience, and that is very brave of him. I myself travelled a lot, but there are always things you need to be reminded off, and your mind, especially when you feel safe, goes into careless mode sometimes.

    Kaos, I am sorry for what you and your gf had to go through, and thank you for sharing that openly. You must feel like sh.t [​IMG] The main thing is that you and your g/f are ok now and nothing more horrific happened. Try to take it as an experience that does not harm your mind, just makes you stronger.
     
    #56 sara777, Mar 1, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  7. Heinz

    Heinz Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Fortunately I've not had any bad experiences myslef in Japan. Though I've never actually wandered around Kabuchiko very late at night. Thinking back the few occasions I have been there it was generally early evening.

    Have tried to reflect on how I feel it has changed in the years I have been going. Still a very small sample so don't know if it is valid representation, but anyway...

    Roppongi I think because of all the foreign embassies there was always where most of the western orientated bars and restaurants were. I remember enjoying going to a German bar/restaurant in Roppongi in the 80's and the japanese hosts were typically hospitable. Had a great night in a Reggae bar in the 90's and walked home to Shinagawa early in the morning - no issues at all. During those times I don't recall seeing any African touts around - maybe I was just in the right/wrong area? It was only the next time around 10 years ago that I noticed them - and they were there in significant numbers. Seemed quite a change - so was just naturally wary.

    Shinjuku on the other hand was always very much more japanese. On the odd occasions when I wandered around Kabuchiko in the 80's and 90's there were only ever japanese touts and they pretty much ignored westerners so it wasn't an issue at all and never felt unsafe at all. Occasionally you would get some approaching you but if you indicated you weren't interested they would back off. Even on a brief visit a couple of years ago I don't recall any African touts, though again I was only there fairly early evening before catching the subway back to my hotel.

    So just wondering if the increase in African touts in Shinjuku has just been in recent years? I would have thought foreigners would always have been going there but maybe there are more going now?

    Sandy also mentioned the 'normal' hostess bars. These had always been documented in travel guides for a long time, but there the main concerns were that it was probably a waste of time if you didn't speak the language and more importantly they were just outrageously expensive but otherwise not dangerous. They were popular for japanese businessmen on company accounts. Don't have any personal experience.

    I was unaware though of the drink spiking scams - certainly know these are common in other parts of the world - but hadn't realised they had come to Japan as well. Sad to hear.

    So take care people. Japan is still very safe, but you do need to take a few simple precautions.

    Kaos managed to encounter the very best and unfortunately the very worst experiences at either end of the one trip. Hopefully you'll know now how to avoid the latter on future trips and get more of the former.
     
  8. Heinz

    Heinz Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    [​IMG] I agree. Kaos has had an unexpected bad experience, but has had the courage to highlight it here, which many wouldn't have, so others are forewarned that this sort of stuff can also happen in Japan.
     
    #58 Heinz, Mar 1, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  9. Toto Warmlet

    Toto Warmlet One of Us

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    this referred to the original heading, which has changed

    so I've taken down this comment because it is now out of context, along with others deleted the day after the post
    I apologised to kaos and he graciously accepted



    stuff deleted
     
  10. chunky

    chunky Old n' Crusty

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    The sophistication of skimming devices is truly amazing and they can be very small. They normally target ATM's in out of the way places but they are getting more brazen and if they can will target high traffic areas that may not be monitored as much.
     
    #60 chunky, Mar 1, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  11. Chuck Norris

    Chuck Norris One of Us

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Wow, just came across this thread. What a terrible story and one i wouldnt expect to hear out of Japan. Last year in Rappongi we were coerced by some big black Americans into a bar, hopped into a lift with the burly black man down to a basement floor, extremely intimidated, then got some of the best service i've ever had... i've never eaten so many peanuts and popcorn in my life, they just kept bringing it out. The guys ended up being really friendly despite fleecing us for 800 yen for a beer. Can't help but think the wrong place and it could have been us. Didnt notice the african guys though, just black american guys.
     
  12. Heinz

    Heinz Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Precisely the reason for the thread.
     
    #62 Heinz, Mar 1, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  13. M_G

    M_G M_G_ = Make skiing great again Ski Pass: Gold

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    #63 M_G, Mar 2, 2011
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  14. damian

    damian A Local

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Pull your head in.

    This trouble has been happening in Tokyo for a few years now and it keeps on happening... and will continue to do so.
     
    #64 damian, Mar 2, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  15. Sandy

    Sandy Dark Sith Lord of the Pool Room Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    As mentioned before, Japan is so safe, that it's hardly surprising that Aussies who want a couple of innocent drinks before heading back to the hotel for the night, could get trapped in this awful web..... And it was obviously NOT K@os' intention to "hang about in seedy bars".....


    And yes, these African touts have been around for 20 years or so, so it's not new....
     
    #65 Sandy, Mar 2, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  16. damian

    damian A Local

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    And even if Kaos or anyone else wanted to hang out in a hostess bar... so what? Sex is almost never an aspect of that activity, in fact, it's the commercial strategy of the Hostess not to 'put out'. It is considered legitimate nightlife by ten's of thousands of Japanese business men, workers and expat bankers etc every night in Tokyo. It is not my cup of tea, but to mockingly marginalise it as the activity of seedy bar goers who get what they deserve is demonstrating a lack of knowledge of Japanese bar culture.
     
  17. cin

    cin Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Reminds me of Amsterdam, which I would also class as an extremely safe city but had the same element from the same kinds of people. Just they were usually trying to sell you drugs instead of women and cheap drinks.
    They were definitely alot more persistent and harder to shake in Amsterdam though.
    Its actually where my signature came from. Piggy said on the first day ' when you hear people talking dutch from a bit of a distance it sounds like they are saying 'ootsie dootsie ootsie dootsie' over and over again' So whenever they would trail us trying to sell us cocaine and ecxtasy we would just nod and say ootsie dootsie. Worked really well, except one guy got a bit pissed and stormed of saying what da **** is this ****ing ootsie ****in dootsie! [​IMG] What a shmohawk
     
    #67 cin, Mar 2, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 11, 2013
  18. Toto Warmlet

    Toto Warmlet One of Us

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    fair enough, took some stuff out
    we've had bad earthquake news all the time here in NZ, think it's getting to me
    it's really pretty grim for many thousands down there
    so do japanese get targeted too?
    is this common knowledge?
     
  19. fattwins

    fattwins One of Us

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    In 1996 the same problem was here in Tokyo the good thing then was that most people didnt carry credit cards and bars couldnt take them either. Much harder to get the Japanese into this scam.
     
  20. Yamakashi

    Yamakashi First Runs

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    I think it would be pretty hard for some random gaijin to be able to hook up with a girl at a Fuzoku/Pink House because almost all places dont allow gaijin in. Another way is the "shokai" which allows them (the pimps) to be free from hassle by the cops - all they do is "introduce" the girls and nothing happens on premise, so there is hardly any way for police to bust them because the girls meet the blokes at a designated hotel.

    Plenty of action in Tokyo and other cities in Japan without the trouble. I have found Osaka to be a better party scene than Tokyo these last few years. Great clubs & music, and chilled bars all within minutes from each other around Namba/Shinsaibashi. Leave the Afrikans standing on the pavement and you will have a good night.

    Glad K@os and GF werent harmed physically. Shitty lesson to learn, but could have been a worse situation.
     
  21. Lorem ipsum

    Lorem ipsum One of Us

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Sorry to hear K@os. Thankfully every time I have headed into Roppongi it's been with local ex-pats who know where to avoid. Even right near the touts there are some fantastic spots for a feed and drink that aren't dodgy. Hope you both get over it!
     
  22. fattwins

    fattwins One of Us

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Yama are the Africans in Osaka now too?
     
  23. biri_island_surf

    biri_island_surf Hard Yards

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    yes this scam is worked pretty well in most asian countries under different disguises . in manila if u are visiting some of the city's sights u will be approached by a friendly filipino who will invite u to join him / her for a free ice cold coke and more sightseeing .
    the punter passes out in some taxi and winds up pennyless and " maybe " lucky to be alive .
    heard in thailand the streetwalkers were smearing the same drug on their titties , dont know if its true ?
    for the single guys out there looking to go to girlie bars in japan , the recruiters trawl the poorer asian countries for pretty candidates , the girls do a bullshit course called cultural dancing to get their visa for japan . then on arrival they enter into the realm of the yukusa . if they cross the yukusa they return to their home country in a box . every big city has a parasite element .

    bad luck kaos , the main thing is u are both alive . " money lost , nothing lost "
     
  24. gareth_oau

    gareth_oau Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Robert Heinlein coined the expression:TANSTAAFL

    there ain't no such thing as a free lunch
     
    #74 gareth_oau, Mar 2, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  25. Sandy

    Sandy Dark Sith Lord of the Pool Room Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    There's no need to trawl poorer asian countries for pretty girls.... and it is too complex and time consuming for the Yakuza to go through the process of organising a visa, when they can pick up plenty of pretty girls in Japan without doing so.
     
  26. biri_island_surf

    biri_island_surf Hard Yards

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    thats for sure , later i will relate some real horror storys on what happens to foreigners in angeles city .
     
  27. biri_island_surf

    biri_island_surf Hard Yards

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    sure about that . just google up filipino vice trade in japan ?
     
  28. Sandy

    Sandy Dark Sith Lord of the Pool Room Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    I haven't googled that, but I'm sure the "girls do a bullshit course called cultural dancing to get their visa for japan" that you mentioned would never get a visa. It would be too much effort to try to get that through immigration.

    There are lots of Filipino women in Japan, and most of them do work as housekeepers/cleaners/maids/nannies. I'd say that if Filipino women are "recruited", the Yakuza are likely to trick them by bringing them in as a visa sponsored housekeeper.... when they arrive, they are then told that they will be a sex worker. It's unlikely that even a country Filipino girl would fall for "cultural dancing" as anything other than a stripper or worse....
     
    #78 Sandy, Mar 2, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  29. biri_island_surf

    biri_island_surf Hard Yards

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    grow up and google it .
     
  30. Go Native

    Go Native One of Us

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    The head of the Yakuza in Kutchan consulted me one night on setting up a soapland type business for the foreigners here. He asked if the foreigners would mind being with Russian girls as he said it would be difficult to convince Japanese girls from Sapporo to just come down for just seasonal work and they wouldn't have to pay the Russian girls anywhere near as much. I guess up this way it's easier to get Russian girls over than Filipinos!
     
  31. Sandy

    Sandy Dark Sith Lord of the Pool Room Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Ok, I googled it, and it says:

    "Japan would trim the number of entertainment visas issued to Filipinos from 80,000 to 8,000 a year, according to Kyodo News, which said it obtained a government action plan against human trafficking.

    Japan offers six-month residency to certified dancers, singers or other entertainers, but rights activists say the provision is abused by traffickers to bring in women -- often Filipinos -- and push them into the sex trade."

    If they have only a six-month residency (visa), then how would the Yakuza keep them in Japan for longer than that, to the point where "if they cross the yukusa they return to their home country in a box", since they can leave again after 6 months?

    The way to keep them in Japan, is to trick them into getting a housekeeper/nanny visa....
     
  32. Go Native

    Go Native One of Us

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Yeah Sandy no one ever overstays their visa in Japan. I'm sure all those Nigerian touts have valid visas!! With the Yakuza involved and considering how corrupt the police are here I'd reckon they could do whatever the hell they want with Filipino girls once they got here.
     
  33. Tonester

    Tonester Lift Line Nazi Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Don't mess with the Dark Sith Lord biri!
     
  34. biri_island_surf

    biri_island_surf Hard Yards

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    they wont ban me will they ?
     
  35. Sandy

    Sandy Dark Sith Lord of the Pool Room Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Who's they?? [​IMG]
     
    #85 Sandy, Mar 2, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  36. damian

    damian A Local

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Ban him for being old and putting a space before every punctuation mark [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    #86 damian, Mar 2, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 11, 2013
  37. Sandy

    Sandy Dark Sith Lord of the Pool Room Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    You're a cruel man.... cruel but fair [​IMG]
     
    #87 Sandy, Mar 2, 2011
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  38. lunchcutter

    lunchcutter One of Us

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    [​IMG]
     
    #88 lunchcutter, Mar 2, 2011
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  39. Sandy

    Sandy Dark Sith Lord of the Pool Room Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    I reckon all those Nigerian touts DO have visas, otherwise they would get rounded up and deported pretty swiftly IMO.

    I don't think police are as corrupt as you think they are. There's no need to be [​IMG]

    The laws relating to the sex industry are so lax here in Japan, that the police only enforce what is enforceable.

    For example, only sexual intercourse for money is illegal, and called prostitution. So what can happen is the "customer" meets a girl, he pays money, and she gives him a hand job. End of transaction, and perfectly legal. However, if she "likes him", they can go to a more private area, and they can do what they please as consenting adults. And also, if she doesn't "like him", she doesn't have to do anything else. How would the police enforce that? Well, they don't, because they can't.
     
    #89 Sandy, Mar 2, 2011
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  40. biri_island_surf

    biri_island_surf Hard Yards

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    how old do u think i am . unlike u damian i am not here trying to promote my business , only trying to inform people on the dangers of travelling in asia .
     
  41. biri_island_surf

    biri_island_surf Hard Yards

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    sandy this was a stupid remark , admit it
     
    #91 biri_island_surf, Mar 2, 2011
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  42. Stratus

    Stratus A Local

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    TC's younger sibling.
     
  43. lunchcutter

    lunchcutter One of Us

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    92
     
    #93 lunchcutter, Mar 2, 2011
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  44. biri_island_surf

    biri_island_surf Hard Yards

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    close
     
  45. lunchcutter

    lunchcutter One of Us

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    89
     
  46. biri_island_surf

    biri_island_surf Hard Yards

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    closer
     
  47. Sandy

    Sandy Dark Sith Lord of the Pool Room Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    Gosh you're really friendly, aren't you [​IMG]

    I'll lay odds that 99% of girls in Japan's sex industry are Japanese.
     
    #97 Sandy, Mar 2, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  48. biri_island_surf

    biri_island_surf Hard Yards

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    correct
     
  49. smitty484

    smitty484 Old n' Crusty

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    To be fair to damian, he never just promotes his business and often suggests evergreen to potential customers as another alternative for guiding companies in Hakuba.
     
    #99 smitty484, Mar 2, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2013
  50. biri_island_surf

    biri_island_surf Hard Yards

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    Re: Tokyo warning: unsafe nightlife for travelers

    its estimated that between 200,000 to 250,000 women work in the japanese sex industry . 150,000 are foreign women . 50,000 are filipino then take your pick from china / vietnam / thailand / korea / then whatever comes next . [ see google ]

    i went to a funeral many years ago on my wife's island in the philippines , the girl was a cultural dancer in japan , she crossed the yakusa , she was executed and returned to her home island in a box , her name was gemma bernaldez .

    if anyone wants to debate this with me , i will be at shiga kogan next week .