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Tricks With Sticks - Instructions for Ski Instructors - How to produce a well rounded beginner.

Discussion in 'Snow Talk' started by bawbawbel, Jul 24, 2019.

  1. Cam Slee

    Cam Slee One of Us

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    He's got no qualifications though.
     
  2. teleroo

    teleroo Waiting for winter... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Hook Line Sinker :D
     
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  3. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Probably because I am usually on a Teleboard, my favorite cruiser.
    Cam, we are not twitter twits here, you might like to suggest in depth the best way you have found to teach effortless transitions ?
     
  4. nezumi

    nezumi One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

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    If my mind were open enough to consider bawbawbel's recommendations, I think something would have fallen out...
     
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  5. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Where does the encrypted ABC gold go, anyway ? Into the bin ?
     
  6. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Brook has published books about computer security, he has probably double my IQ :)
    Does his "Cat Prowl" technique clarify anything to anybody ?

    "A demonstration of the telemark "cat prowl" @ Woodchuck Basin, Stanislaus National Forest, California, May 3, 2014.
    "Cat prowling" initiates a turn by using body mass to cause the skis to move into the new turn dynamically. The new inside ski is weighted and put on edge at the turn initiation, rather than later, after the skis have floated (slide). Cat prowling creates a very crisp telemark turn. I "reach", that is, feel for my new forefoot on what will be the new inside ski at turn initiation, thus placing the new back ski on edge at the very start of the turn. "
     
  7. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    won't be long..
     
  8. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Can't wait..
     
  9. Snowy Joe

    Snowy Joe First Runs

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    I don't like the way you explained that at all I'm sorry.
     
  10. Snowy Joe

    Snowy Joe First Runs

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    Who are you? This is horrid...
     
  11. Snowy Joe

    Snowy Joe First Runs

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    Professional Ski Instructors these days are asked to analyze every individual skiers movements and assess everything from head to toe, whilst also questioning and understanding the students' communication style. Then and only then should advice be given to an individual in regards to learning how to ski. Simply giving any advice in a forum like this demonstrates that a hoax instructor is giving poor advice. (bawbawbel) You may be or may have been an employed ski instructor... I suggest you resit your most basic level-one exam.
     
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  12. sly_karma

    sly_karma Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Mate you've been had by the most "interesting" troll in the business. But don't feel bad, we've all been rolled by BBB in the past. Bloke wrote the book on non aggressive web trolling, dead set legend.
     
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  13. Snowy Joe

    Snowy Joe First Runs

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    Thanks, Sly. I thought it may have been an elaborate joke... It was just toooo good at being bad...
     
  14. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    They might even offer you a free ticket for dobbing in a paid nanny of a 3 year old, who would then get taken off the Paddocks in cuffs and with a lifetime ban.
    My method is based on Skoarding (look it up in Wiki) and is not for the perfectly proficient skier at his peak.
    It is not taught officially in Oz and relies on skiers catching it like Covid :)
    When your body starts to fail you might read my book.
     
  15. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    You would know if you had any spare time.
    Resort management is high pressure, but Wickistory will no doubt be censored now that I have divulged it.
    I wait with baited breath....
     
  16. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    New member, back to basics.
    Nothing new under the sun or in the snow.
    Oz history:
    Commercial lodges often sponsored a ski instructor from Europe to teach their guests.
    About equal numbers from the "French School" and the "Austrian School".
    Austrian school dismantled the turn into many separate parts with Teutonic overkill.
    It may not survive in a Covid world.
    French school simplified movements so that it could be taught in a day.
    My way.
     
  17. Igs1972

    Igs1972 Hard Yards

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    I sometimes wonder why racers or great skiers do not use snowplough. I've never seen Lindsey Won use it. hmmmm. This begs the question: why teach it in the first place?
     
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  18. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    For every dedicated racer there are a million punters.
    The snowplough, however, is only part of an effective instructional path in the French school of rotation assisted turning. The present resort teaching makes you lean the wrong way.
    A telemark student gave me a book on French Technik which his dad had bought at Buller.
    The translation to an English version had produced more of a coffee table book than an instructional manual.
    However, the good guts is there and I will post some of it soon.
    The loss of a superior system in Oz I think must have been due to ego driven French instructors who would rather star than teach. They demonstrated advanced movements that nobody could copy.
     
  19. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    There have been watershed moments in skiing technique which, taken at the full, lead on to fortune.
    1. Skater wins langlauf at international level.
    2. Alpine snowboarder wins downhill at international level on borrowed skis.
    She proved the superior speed of flat ski against edged ski during moments of straight running.
    This we call "skittering", which is directed by subtle upper body control.
     
  20. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Another question:
    Why is the jump turn not taught ?
    Answer:
    Because it does not work using the feet first foolishness.
    A jump in a slalom ruins it because it means a loss of centering as the skier goes into the back seat to launch from his edges and cannot recover.
    A generation of feet first followers cannot emulate, or even understand, a ruande or horse kick turn.
    It involves pivoting the skis on their tips using an upper body twist and block.
    Just like the Italian Telemark, no ?
     
    #70 bawbawbel, Jul 12, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2020
  21. Cam Slee

    Cam Slee One of Us

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    All of this waffle is coming from someone who is not a member of APSI.
     
  22. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    APSI is full of "feet first" followers. A member must follow the herd or endure dissing, no doubt.
    One reason that our students get anonymity, to avoid animosity.
     
  23. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    We call it a Gliding Wedge, as part of stability on sheer ice, or negotiating death cookies.
    The other turn which you might find impossible is the Downhill Kick Turn, Which is done from a standstill when faced by a dangerous dead end.
    It requires you to rotate your upper body FIRST, which you have probably never included in your bag of tricks.

    Oops. That is the uphill kick turn.
    I meant
     
  24. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Captive audience. Good. TV channels getting away with more ad time than movie.
    After "pass pulled for causing trouble" on another forum 3 years ago, I failed new application.
    They got long memories.
    Posting there of 2019 Interski is interesting. Note progress towards French School :
    Korea - Excellent. Local instructors should visit for conversion !
    Japan - Coming around towards it.
    Australia - No sign. Still stuck in the slow.
    Several nations coming around accidentally. You will observe anticipation used on on side only.
    Who around here skis like which ?
     
  25. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    In our long turn exercises, anticipation was an optional extra, more or less.
    You could omit anticipation and produce the same turn, just using a bit more energy, and edge.
    The Korean short turn , on the other hand, cannot be reproduced without that split second timing.
    Those of you who have fully mastered our wedeln should feel good about it.
    Otherwise, you are falling further behind the new way. :)
     
  26. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    And not a slave to a style that is beyond the average holidayonly skier.

    Japan instructor suggestion:
    "Free up the rules to allow competing ski schools, it works great in Niseko. We pay an increased season ticket price to the lift companies and are then free to run our own businesses, lesson costs are lower due to competition, and the instructors take home the whole lesson fee (if you are independent).
    Similar model to how it works in France, except without the Eurotest/French bureaucracy."

    Corona might force a rethink here.. :)
     
  27. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Good question. Probably better to just let kids to progress by themselves up to and past the Racing Snowplough without the straightjacket of thinking about where their individual limbs are located.
    What "bad habits" will result ? Is supreme confidence a bad habit ?
    Actually I am just testing the herculean reconstruction of this site..
     
  28. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    The worst bad habit comes from obsolete ski instruction. "Put weight on the outside ski" starts your kid off in the wrong direction.

    From the "turnshape" site :
    "About 90% of skiers who come to an intermediate lesson tell me that they (still) turn by putting more weight onto one ski. Friends, family and even some instructors are guilty of teaching them that. And that’s probably one of the reasons why they are stuck at the intermediate level. This method of turning has severe limitations and creates countless issues down the road. Some instructor training establishments have stopped teaching it to their instructors but many continue to do so."
     
  29. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Your students will make you rich if you teach bc. Resort skiers will have no spare cash.
     
  30. Telemark Phat

    Telemark Phat Pass the butter Ski Pass: Gold

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    Look at these whole body turns with excellent anticipation. Such a great result!
     
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  31. skichanger

    skichanger A Local

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    ROFLROFLROFL Awesome! We need more of this
     
  32. Annabuzzy

    Annabuzzy Part of the Furniture Ski Pass: Gold

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  33. Tonester

    Tonester Lift Line Nazi Ski Pass: Gold

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    If it is, then I'd say Linder run
     
  34. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    [​IMG]
    Uphill kick turn needs better ligaments than mine. (some are missing entirely :ski:)
     
  35. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    I am sneaking into your subconcious, and supercharging your imagination.
    Here you are at a conference of my disciples, having ordered an apricot mogul and coffee.
    [​IMG]
     
  36. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    While you are in that enhanced state of awareness, we should get down to nitty of this thread.
    Forgetting body anticipation for a moment, we look at foot anticipation as in Harb's "Phantom Turn".
    Would Razie forgive a quote from his magnificent blog ?
    "
    Skiing and countersteering
    Pub

    Being an avid motorcyclist as well as an avid skier, I have been looking for something similar to Countersteering.

    For those that don't know, Countersteering is the specific way to steer a motorcycle or a bicycle, where, to turn left - you steer to the right first and that will "throw" the bike into the left turn! Freaky, no? Well, you do it every time...
    So, here's the countersteering turn in skiing, that I've been playing with - steps you can replicate:
    pick a slalom ski, say 12m
    • gingerly start a wide turn, say 15m
    • instead of checking your email while waiting for the turn to finish on its own,
    • push the inside knee more into the turn (down into the snow), this will start a chain of events:
    • the outside knee will follow
    • skis will tip more and increase the angle to the snow
    • forces increase on the ski, and, if you solve all the equations in Le Master's book, this force is bending them * * more and tightening the arc, to 12m or less
    • the body will instead continue travelling over the skis and into the next turn.
    • since the body is now over the skis, the skis will tip and start the next turn.
     
  37. teleroo

    teleroo Waiting for winter... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Old mate Harb prefers to express this as lifting and tilting the inside foot. But the end result is the inside knee goes "bow legged" into the turn. But it is quite astonishing to me the influence this has on the outside ski - the one that is "doing" the turn. I am a fan - disciple perhaps? of the Harb.
     
  38. sly_karma

    sly_karma Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

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    Steering the inside knee, old edging exercise. Like any good self promoter, Harb packages all these ideas as his own unique product.
     
  39. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Bit unfair ? He modified an exercise so that it tunes the tyro quickly towards early edge engagement.
    Rather than "start a turn gradually" first, the student feels an instant response from the beginning.
    Think back to your earliest turns. That is one of the "breakthroughs" you experienced ? :)
     
  40. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    The lifting part is usually missed by scoffers who dismiss the exercise. The turn from a traverse must begin with the inside ski tip above the snow. It all goes into muscle memory and the exaggeration is no longer visible.
     
  41. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    So why don't we see Harb bowleggedding ? Because he already maintains the perfect balance and centering on the new outside ski which the lifted ski produces.
    Plus his turns are always linked which allows transfered rotary impulse into the start of the turn.
    This is his "counteracting", used in a greater amount than any of his contemporaries.
    He still looks good as it makes up for his multiple artificial leg joints.
     
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  42. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    "Counteracting" and "Holding Your Counteracting" deserves edification because it really is the elephant on the groom.
    "Turns come from the feet, blah blah" censors full discussion, understanding and application.
    Rotary Impulse can be generated at any point in the turn by a twisting and blocking of the upper body.
    It does not necessarily slow you down.
    You can ski "facing downhill" and still produce a negligible amount.
    And if you must make a platform to start a turn (the motorbike analogy) you are one more poor pister.
    Lesson One might come from 1937 :
     
  43. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Where are we up to ?
    Blocking (abdominal tightening) is how we transfer a continuing upper rotation to the skis. Quite separate to a setting of the edges.
    A hard block just before transition is the most useful to intermediates.
    A slow block (over the first half of the turn) is for powder.
    Can I continue ?
     
  44. bawbawbel

    bawbawbel Easi Ski..... Ski Pass: Gold

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    Thank you.
    We will consider snowboarding technique, as demonstrated by Travis Rice not far from these postings.
    Intermediate snowboarders adopt the mantra "Always on one edge or the other !" to avoid violent consequences to their wrists or head.
    They drag around in a rough and noisy fashion for an indefinite and sometimes extensive period.
    Then they may ask "Teach me to run flat" after observing smooth and quiet performances, and successful landings from 45 degrees off line.
    No problem. They must develop ten times their balance, but, most important, directional control from the upper body. Which skiers often don't understand.