Why all the stress about using Snow Chains

Discussion in 'Snow Talk' started by Arsas, Jul 20, 2017.

  1. Ozgirl

    Ozgirl Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2007
    Messages:
    4,657
    Likes Received:
    2,483

    Ah yes until you need em to get up nuggets!

    So many people with impractical cars and no chains who swear by the ski tube.

    One day I will laugh so hard when i get freshies and they are stuck in jindy!!
     
    alexd likes this.
  2. Ozgirl

    Ozgirl Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2007
    Messages:
    4,657
    Likes Received:
    2,483
    20 years ago when living in Tahoe we were once directed to fit chains. My friend and i were all 'we got this' and took a wheel each. Did a great job until when you had to get the hook up and over... yeah neither of us could do it. Had to pay the guy the $20 to fit them and thats all he had to do!

    Were weren't impressed with ourselves.

    Came home the next year and worked at Thredbo, went and bought a subie!
     
  3. DidSurfNowSki

    DidSurfNowSki Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2014
    Messages:
    4,194
    Likes Received:
    5,406
    Or find a friend with a subie ;)
     
    Chaeron, chicski and Marty_McSly like this.
  4. gareth_oau

    gareth_oau Old And Crusty
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2008
    Messages:
    38,554
    Likes Received:
    10,117
    Remind me how good a subie AWD is as you brake and slide into a ditch? LOL

    The only vehicles I seem to see in ditches are 4WDs LOL
     
    Chaeron likes this.
  5. telecrag

    telecrag Part of the Furniture
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2007
    Messages:
    19,019
    Likes Received:
    15,262
    Thats because its a person who has

    a) Never used it in 4WD before

    b) Never driven in snow before

    c) Is an idiot

    d) Was really unlucky
     
    alexd and Ozgirl like this.
  6. Ozgirl

    Ozgirl Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2007
    Messages:
    4,657
    Likes Received:
    2,483
    Nothing wrong with a Subie!!!

    And DSNS, I'll give you a ride up nuggets anytime.
     
    DidSurfNowSki likes this.
  7. DidSurfNowSki

    DidSurfNowSki Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2014
    Messages:
    4,194
    Likes Received:
    5,406
    Lol, anything to avoid putting the Aldi chains on the Honda Jazz ;)
     
  8. Hermannator

    Hermannator Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2010
    Messages:
    545
    Likes Received:
    130
    Really the chain gripes are centered at Hotham... Fitting chains when truly required - no problem. Chains on bitumen big thumbs down. Road mgmt/authorities still haven't learnt.

    I mean, just look at this ambiguity (from this year):


    There seems a real cowboy mentality amongst authorities (yeah we'll show dem city folk, what do they know) especially that Graham fluffy (or whatever his friggin name is in the v5665 plate toyota - "fluff"wit more like it). The only time they'll pull you out is if you go off the road and they'll tell you your car isn't suitable etc even though you had diamond pattern chains which comply but broke on the bitumen.:mad::mad::mad: Half of them wouldn't have a clue what vehicles are 4wd/Awd anyway. And how about letting the punters use snow tyres (just like fluffwit gets to use)! or at least allowing them in lieu of chains (except maybe on rare occasions where chains are the only option). And they won't even give you a jump-start. No. I helped some poor kid whose gf flattened the battery after hearing of mgmt recalcitrance earlier this season. He even had his own jumper leads.

    I used to have an AWD to reduce the instances of chain fits only for authorities to go "chains all vehicles" whenever there was 2cm of snow. So I thought stuff it, I'm going 2wd with next car as there's no longer an advantage of AWD. (Must admit this year I have only seen the AWD/4wd excepted sign thus far so maybe AWD a bonus again (to do with Audi sponsorship?) ).

    Heading up tonight so will report back on km travelled with "fit chains" directive on bitumen...

    Edit: nothing wrong with ladder chains either.
     
    dawooduck and BillyKidd like this.
  9. Marty_McSly

    Marty_McSly Addicted Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2011
    Messages:
    4,040
    Likes Received:
    2,878
    Aggressively driven 4WDs that charge around chained 2WD's.

    Shit drivers drive like shit.

    Karma is a bitch.
     
    SkiMountaineer likes this.
  10. gareth_oau

    gareth_oau Old And Crusty
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2008
    Messages:
    38,554
    Likes Received:
    10,117
    That and naive people that think 4WD negates the need for chains absolutely.

    I like to remind newbies that 4WDs are for going and chains are for stopping.
     
    #60 gareth_oau, Jul 21, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2017
    Chaeron, coolair and Ubiquitous Steve like this.
  11. soza

    soza Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2013
    Messages:
    322
    Likes Received:
    379
    Yep the ones that fit together like a jigsaw, best addition to the snow kit yet. And i find two wheel width blocks of timber handy.... Roll up on to them and you get the chains on nice and tight first go, no having to check them a couple of km along.

    Getting an expert with them in NZ.... Six times already this season and thats on an AWD.
    Jacket, gloves, mats, 2x2 blocks and towel....all stay in the car full time now
     
    DidSurfNowSki likes this.
  12. gettingtooold

    gettingtooold Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2012
    Messages:
    3,515
    Likes Received:
    1,919
    I use an old piece of carpet. Works a treat.
     
  13. gettingtooold

    gettingtooold Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2012
    Messages:
    3,515
    Likes Received:
    1,919
    Actually my biggest piss off with chains is when you have to put them on in the morning and lack of info in the arvo when to take them off.
     
    Bertie Egg likes this.
  14. chicski

    chicski Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    1,474
    Likes Received:
    1,842
    By Nuggets do you mean Ivo's?
     
  15. Ozgirl

    Ozgirl Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2007
    Messages:
    4,657
    Likes Received:
    2,483
    No idea??

    But the big Hill - we always called it's Nuggets in my day!
     
  16. chicski

    chicski Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    1,474
    Likes Received:
    1,842
    We cyclists call it Ivo's. After Ivo's farm at the top. It's even on google maps LOL
     
    DidSurfNowSki likes this.
  17. Ozgirl

    Ozgirl Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2007
    Messages:
    4,657
    Likes Received:
    2,483
    Interesting!

    I know there is another name for it but not Ivo's!
     
  18. kylep

    kylep Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Silver

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2012
    Messages:
    1,421
    Likes Received:
    1,452
    FIFY
     
    alexd and Ozgirl like this.
  19. Ultra

    Ultra Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Silver

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2009
    Messages:
    3,080
    Likes Received:
    1,745
    i have had chains in my car for decades, never once needed them in the ski fields, (weather always ensured they wernt required) The only times i have needed them has been on slippery and slick wet outback dirt roads. try fitting them with wheels covered in 2 inches of solid sticky mud!
     
  20. BillyKidd

    BillyKidd Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Silver

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2010
    Messages:
    1,279
    Likes Received:
    518
    Errrrr......yeah, I'm perfectly happy to bitch about that. At least the chain fitting notionally serves a purpose and occasionally is even worth doing....and if you are prepared it's not, or should not be, a big deal. Inconvenient yes but doable. But the dodgy on-mountain shite "food" and amusingly named "service" at eye watering prices....I mean you can probably cope with the occasional twit from the roads board or resort. ...or even a copper insisting on the fitting of chains when there is no snow and the hint of a flurry. But the soggy chip vendors. ...they are just taking the piss.
     
  21. snowtyres

    snowtyres Active Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2006
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    72
  22. Sno Sno SNO

    Sno Sno SNO Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2016
    Messages:
    125
    Likes Received:
    62
    and for this very reason, i wonder why chains are just as mandatory going uphill as downhill..... but then we can't confuse the general population who have the car in drive and brain in neutral.
     
  23. BillyKidd

    BillyKidd Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Silver

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2010
    Messages:
    1,279
    Likes Received:
    518
    Rubber mat, rubber gloves, an old raincoat - that sounds like the start of a good Saturday night! :D
     
    Marty_McSly likes this.
  24. Arsas

    Arsas Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2017
    Messages:
    104
    Likes Received:
    102
    @snowtyres you are a typical salesman. Those videos show a car that has good wheel arch clearance, the snow is perfect, clean, white and fluffy, the tyres are clean the the car is clean.
    Please tell me when you get that is Oz?
    In Oz the majority of the time the snow has already been plowed and salted and has started turning in to brown slurpee. My tyres are never that clean and are full of that brown slurpee and the wheel arches and sides of my car are covered in more of that brown slurpee. So I'll stick with my current chains, rubber mats, gloves and old raincoat cause I don't feel like arriving at the snow looking like I was knee deep in brown s**t while giving big foot an enema.
     
    #74 Arsas, Jul 22, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2017
    coolair and alexd like this.
  25. dawooduck

    dawooduck Pool Room
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2002
    Messages:
    50,511
    Likes Received:
    14,547
    WA expert level ...

    Stick an Quattro badge on the FWD A3 and the chain guys wave you through. 9 winters travelling to Guthega every winters day in HG holden and never fitted chains once.

    The only reason that chain fitting is the mad regime it is these days is due to the increased amount of traffic and the modern vehicles lack of road sense behind the wheel.

    Stralya
     
    #75 dawooduck, Jul 22, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2017
    whether and JoeKing like this.
  26. Marty_McSly

    Marty_McSly Addicted Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2011
    Messages:
    4,040
    Likes Received:
    2,878
    Ever been to Perisher? Road goes up and down. Both ways.
     
    person s likes this.
  27. person s

    person s Old And Crusty
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2001
    Messages:
    23,457
    Likes Received:
    5,218
    it's never worried me
    I've never owned a 4wd
    putting chains on my car has always been easy since they're Citro├źns and the suspension goes up and down
    not that it's particularly necessary
    after this morning, seeing a kangaroo being obliterated in a collision with the car in front of me, I've decided that there are much worse problems
     
    Marty_McSly likes this.
  28. SkiMountaineer

    SkiMountaineer Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2012
    Messages:
    231
    Likes Received:
    217
    Lived in EU for 9 years. Winter tyres only, no chains. Here 4WD. Drive properly you don't need chains.
     
  29. Charlie

    Charlie Still the most depraved poster here
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2002
    Messages:
    21,479
    Likes Received:
    4,730
    Yeh, they just need to change the signs
    'Fit chains here'
    (Unless you're going to drive properly,
    in which case you don't need them)
    :rolleyes:
     
    #79 Charlie, Jul 22, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
  30. Sno Sno SNO

    Sno Sno SNO Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2016
    Messages:
    125
    Likes Received:
    62
    Why yes I have, many a time... and I wouldn't consider that 'up and down'.... but thanks for the thought.
     
  31. teckel

    teckel Old And Crusty
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2004
    Messages:
    35,754
    Likes Received:
    3,300
    I presume you're a Perisher skier? Catching the tube?
     
  32. Hemsley

    Hemsley Dedicated Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2015
    Messages:
    766
    Likes Received:
    770
    Why does the BMW have them on the back and the Merc have them on the front?
     
  33. chicski

    chicski Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    1,474
    Likes Received:
    1,842
    Try it on a bicycle and get back to me ;)
     
    kylep, Chaeron and Marty_McSly like this.
  34. Sno Sno SNO

    Sno Sno SNO Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2016
    Messages:
    125
    Likes Received:
    62
    Well there is that..... Out of interest though,
    would you use chains on the bike?
     
  35. DbSki

    DbSki Part of the Furniture
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2012
    Messages:
    16,849
    Likes Received:
    4,318
    Since a car that has chains on on bitumen with no snow or ice is rendered not road worthy by the standards pf road worthiness what happens if you have a collision with chains driving on bitumen re insurance.
    They could deny it since you drove the car when it was technically not road worthy.
    And why do Police pursue any car with protruding ski racks or any other minimal vehicle fault but fail to fine anyone driving on bitumen with chains for being not road worthy.
     
    coolair likes this.
  36. chicski

    chicski Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    1,474
    Likes Received:
    1,842
    I wouldn't ride the bike up there in winter, too much traffic :p
     
  37. Marty_McSly

    Marty_McSly Addicted Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2011
    Messages:
    4,040
    Likes Received:
    2,878
    Not if it was a shaft drive bike :whistle:
     
    alexd likes this.
  38. snowtyres

    snowtyres Active Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2006
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    72
    person s and skull like this.
  39. SkiMountaineer

    SkiMountaineer Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2012
    Messages:
    231
    Likes Received:
    217
    No, I drive up to PV.
     
  40. skull

    skull Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2017
    Messages:
    118
    Likes Received:
    96
    How fast would they have been going?
     
  41. teckel

    teckel Old And Crusty
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2004
    Messages:
    35,754
    Likes Received:
    3,300
    Well, try driving to Hotham or Baw Baw in a blizzard, and then say that chains aren't necessary for 4WDs.
     
    The Plowking likes this.
  42. SkiMountaineer

    SkiMountaineer Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2012
    Messages:
    231
    Likes Received:
    217
    Teckel, as I said, I have driven in real winter conditions, in countries with much more difficult snow conditions. I witnessed serious accidents with friends of mine who did not drive properly over there . We only drove in 2WD with winter tyres. I was in an Audi A4 wagon and almost followed a 4WD to the top of a pretty steep snow covered road (ie they were breaking trail through 30cm of freshies on a dirt road). I was forced to stop about 100m short of the house because it was too deep and I didn't have enough clearance under the car to keep traction. So Hotham and Baw Baw? Pfffft.

    I never had any problem using gears to control speed. I have seen many people come undone because they do not drive properly in snow/ice conditions (ie use your gears and accelerate gently). Watching idiots floor it the more they slid sideways at Smiggins is always a head shaker for me.
     
    alexd, dawooduck and person s like this.
  43. Hemsley

    Hemsley Dedicated Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2015
    Messages:
    766
    Likes Received:
    770
    Anyone?
     
  44. Legs Akimbo

    Legs Akimbo Part of the Furniture
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2014
    Messages:
    16,901
    Likes Received:
    10,188
    BMW is 2 WD with drive to rear wheels. Chains go on the drive wheels.
    Merc looks like it is 4 WD, so (depending on what the manufacturer advises) chains would normally go on front wheels so you get traction for drive and steering. This statement is mildly controversial, and there is a group of people who think that chains on 4 WD go on rear wheels.
     
  45. Charlie

    Charlie Still the most depraved poster here
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2002
    Messages:
    21,479
    Likes Received:
    4,730
    Manufacturer's recommendations?
     
  46. gareth_oau

    gareth_oau Old And Crusty
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2008
    Messages:
    38,554
    Likes Received:
    10,117
    Yep The Merc uses Haldex AWD which is predominantly FWD unless wheel spin is detected when the rears engage more
     
  47. DPS Driver

    DPS Driver Dedicated Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2014
    Messages:
    2,043
    Likes Received:
    1,554
    Used chains once in 35 years of driving in and out of Thredbo in 2, all or 4wd vehicles.

    Have driven back to Jindy in an old VL commodore wagon with carnage all around, both 4wd's and all manner of vehicles sliding off the road. The old VL stayed straight and true as we weaved our way past piles of mangled cars.

    Drive properly and chains aren't really required in Aust. I've used chains more in NZ than here.
     
    alexd and dawooduck like this.
  48. Rover

    Rover Dedicated Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2003
    Messages:
    2,536
    Likes Received:
    15
    Know this road and this section very well....not too sure how this can happen unless it was operator error.
    Looking at the age of the car, I am sure ABS would be fitted so that rules out brake lock up.
    Under steer would be my bet on this, and that would relate to the speed of his approach. This corner is quite clearly marked with a speed advisory sign.
    I have seen AWD cars lose it on this corner coming down and end up over the edge.

    All too often I see cars with chains on and they think that makes them invincible.....

    The other thing I see all too often sitting on the deck of the snowline is cars with chains on rolling through Hooterville when they were removing at Dungeys
     
  49. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    27,624
    Likes Received:
    9,143
    I've used chains a few times getting to Thredbo - mainly going in early before the road's been cleared.


    Chain bays (in NSW at least) are below the snowiest risk areas so that when you drive around the corner and 100m up the hill into the snowy icy bit you already have chains on. It does mean some driving on bitumen. Yes, you guys are all awesome but quite obviously some other risk factors need to be taken into account and all you awesome people get caught up in it.
     
    Charlie likes this.
  50. Hamburglar

    Hamburglar Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2016
    Messages:
    49
    Likes Received:
    39
    Follow VICSES Bright on Facebook for some good reminders to use chains and drive safely on the road to Hotham.