1. There's more to this forum than meets the eye!

    We have a vibrant community here conversing about all sorts of non-snow topics such as music, sport, politics and technology. Simply register to reveal all our Après topics or continue browsing and reading as a guest.

    NOTE: This notice may be closed.

    Dismiss Notice

Question Winter Olympic new events

Discussion in 'Events & FIS' started by zac150, Jan 24, 2018.

  1. zac150

    zac150 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    3,395
    Likes Received:
    4,561
    I was watching the skier and boarder cross yesterday on Eurosport’s, which I love for the carnage and they mentioned that team boardercross is being pushed as a future Olympic event.

    For those that aren’t familiar it is basically a relay where, when one athlete finishes the gate opens and a second athlete goes.

    Meh, most of the action occurs on lap one then the second is a bit pedestrian.

    This got me thinking, what events would you like to see at the games?

    I like the idea a relay but would go with a mix of skier and boarders, male and female, so female skier, male skier, female boarder, male boarder.

    Telemark - downhill tele ski racing is awesome, yep I’m biased but I like the side my side nature of the racing, the fact athletes have to do a minimum length jump mid course and the wall turn at the bottom to skating finish makes for a pretty fun event.

    Dog sledding?
    Skater cross? Not sure if this is the right name.
    Ice climbing?
     
  2. sly_karma

    sly_karma Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    20,355
    Likes Received:
    10,152
    Location:
    Penticton, BC
    As long as it's timed or measured rather than judged, I'll support it. Will also vote for the return of all spinning around events back to X Games where they belong. Slop style, halfpipe, big air, etc, you can all f*** off home. Figure skating can go and join rhythmic gymnastics and syncro swimming in whatever hell they reside between olympics.
     
    Ramshead, Heinz and MisterMxyzptlk like this.
  3. luvthabumps

    luvthabumps A Local Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2006
    Messages:
    8,748
    Likes Received:
    3,620
    Location:
    Back in MEL ( with annual trips to the 604 )
  4. luvthabumps

    luvthabumps A Local Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2006
    Messages:
    8,748
    Likes Received:
    3,620
    Location:
    Back in MEL ( with annual trips to the 604 )
  5. zac150

    zac150 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    3,395
    Likes Received:
    4,561
    I couldn’t agree more on judged event, too many politics, that and there boring as $&@“!

    The crushed ice stuff looks awesome!
     
  6. DidSurfNowSki

    DidSurfNowSki One of them Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2014
    Messages:
    8,197
    Likes Received:
    14,512
    Location:
    Canberra, ACT
    Only if they hold the targets for the biathletes. :D
     
    person s likes this.
  7. zac150

    zac150 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    3,395
    Likes Received:
    4,561


    Just for you @DidSurfNowSki (pay close attention to the opening words DSNS).
     
    Ramshead, Boodwah and DidSurfNowSki like this.
  8. sly_karma

    sly_karma Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    20,355
    Likes Received:
    10,152
    Location:
    Penticton, BC
    Tele racing is somewhat OK, since it's racing. But... it also has judges, to penalise racers who use the banned parallelemark turn. Controversy ensues. So I call "minor fail" on tele, but I'd still be happy to see it bump one of the hibbety jibbety events out of the Olympics.
     
  9. zac150

    zac150 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    3,395
    Likes Received:
    4,561
    Correct me if I’m wrong but the judging could still be challenged and confirmed by video, my understanding of the rule is a boot distance needs to be between the heel of the front foot and toe of the trailing foot so it’s a simple enough rule.
     
  10. person s

    person s Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2001
    Messages:
    33,228
    Likes Received:
    12,932
    Location:
    macdonaldtown
    or they could be the targets
     
    DidSurfNowSki likes this.
  11. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    5,758
    Location:
    Glen Iris, Melbourne


    There is a SKIMO (randonee; AKA ski mountaineering) demo at this year’s Olympics, and it’s set for trial at the 2020 Youth Olympics.

    https://www.olympic.org/news/climbi...ing-you-need-to-know-about-ski-mountaineering


    It’s HUGE in Europe, and it’s awesome. No judging, and can be run individually and on a team basis for men and women. It would play a similar role to the marathon in the Summer Olympics.

    You’ve got to love it for the awesome gear and the visuals alone.

    Killian Jornet is the current skimo god.
     
    sara777, sbm_, Froff Life and 4 others like this.
  12. W0nkey D0nkey

    W0nkey D0nkey One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2017
    Messages:
    2,283
    Likes Received:
    2,450
    Location:
    Wollongong
    Why?
    They're the only events i'll be watching.
     
    sara777, xuěboarder and LMB like this.
  13. LMB

    LMB Old but definitely not Crusty! Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    May 6, 2010
    Messages:
    27,067
    Likes Received:
    17,268
    Location:
    Perth
    Oh my goodness. PB will LOVE that!
     
  14. teckel

    teckel Pool Room Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2004
    Messages:
    41,899
    Likes Received:
    9,608
    Location:
    Narbethong, Vic
    Get rid of the judged component from moguls. No wanky air stuff. No style component. Whoever can get down the mogul course the fastest.
     
    Kelpieboy, coolair and Chaeron like this.
  15. W0nkey D0nkey

    W0nkey D0nkey One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2017
    Messages:
    2,283
    Likes Received:
    2,450
    Location:
    Wollongong
    Incorrect.
    If they call moguls freestyle. It should be.
    I can picture someone slaying the first set of moguls then throwing a steezy dub 12 blunt grab (landing switch)
    Then a tail butter 360 to land forwards again off the first mogul of the second set.. Something similar off the second jump.
     
    #15 W0nkey D0nkey, Feb 10, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2018
  16. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    5,758
    Location:
    Glen Iris, Melbourne
    Split moguls into 2 events: simple speed no tricks, trick moguls.

    Unfortunately trick moguls without speed is already superseded by freestyle, and speed moguls doesn’t look amazing enough on TV for it to survive as an Olympics event by itself.

    So unfortunately we’re stuck with this silly combo I think.
     
    crackson likes this.
  17. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    5,758
    Location:
    Glen Iris, Melbourne
    The problem lies here - to increase the complexity of the aerial trick section you need to have a non-mogul landing space. Audience expectations from ski cross and freestyle mean that when we see tricks on the moguls event we’re unamazed no matter how good it is. Unfair really.

    To land in a mogul field you can’t max out the tricks.

    So we have this current situation of less than awesome tricks, and less than satisfactory racing.

    I love the tensions intrinsic in snowsports - go too fast on slaloms and you can miss the gates. Go epic enough to win in giant slalom and you’re more likely to crash out. The same with all the jumps and freestyle events.

    Optimise your speed in biathlon and your shooting accuracy goes down.
     
    LMB likes this.
  18. person s

    person s Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2001
    Messages:
    33,228
    Likes Received:
    12,932
    Location:
    macdonaldtown
    fantastic
     
  19. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    17,101
    Likes Received:
    17,513
    Location:
    Canberra
    Killian currently ranked 6th. Italians are totaly dominating skimo world cup atm.
     
    Chaeron likes this.
  20. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    5,758
    Location:
    Glen Iris, Melbourne
    I suppose whizzing up Everest is a consolation for Killian.

    I wonder when we’ll see the first Aussie SKIMO comp? @Kletterer, @Jay Woo - set a virtual Aussie course for us.
     
  21. zac150

    zac150 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    3,395
    Likes Received:
    4,561
    Cant
    Can’t wait to watch this, will be awesome!

    @Kletterer has Killian raced all the events? He is the type of guys whose training for all his other projects wouldn’t be as specific as the guys focused on racing
     
  22. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    17,101
    Likes Received:
    17,513
    Location:
    Canberra
    Was sidelined with a shoulder operation .
     
    zac150 likes this.
  23. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    5,758
    Location:
    Glen Iris, Melbourne
    There are already lots of European races available to watch online - would be amazing to see in person.
     
    zac150 likes this.
  24. Boodwah

    Boodwah One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2006
    Messages:
    4,349
    Likes Received:
    7,060
    Location:
    StKilda,VicBC,Prom,France
    This times a million.
    As well as being totally awesome to watch, and growing bigger every year, these guys and girls are the fittest humans on the planet. Their measured VOmaxs are continuously setting new records. And yet there's no Olympic event for them!
    in addition to set courses, I would like to a new ski event where the skiers have to simply summit a peak and get back, fastest time wins.
    I've done a few skimo events in the Alps, and it's more than just the race. The camaraderie and atmosphere both pre and post race are fantastic. So I looked in to setting something up at Hotham last year - but as usual Resort management weren't interested, the public liability was all too much for them.
     
    coolair, Kletterer and Chaeron like this.
  25. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    5,758
    Location:
    Glen Iris, Melbourne
     
    Kletterer likes this.
  26. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    5,758
    Location:
    Glen Iris, Melbourne
    @Boodwah, if you were to set up a virtual course somewhere like Hotham, people could submit their GPS data and people could start setting times and we could run a virtual ladder. Eventually we’ll get the trail running crowd in behind it - only a matter of time.

    Resorts don’t negotiate with individuals, corporates deal with sporting associations. Happy to help.

    @CarveMan, I reckon if you put rando/ skimo gear on your catalogue, even if you don’t actively stock it (order in on demand) you’d get some sales, what do you think?
     
  27. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    17,101
    Likes Received:
    17,513
    Location:
    Canberra
    Saw a guy training in Austria the other day. He was running up the hill in crampons. We did a lap on the Gondola. By the time we circled round he was nearly at the top and in a sprint. Amazing fitness.
     
    DidSurfNowSki, LMB and Chaeron like this.
  28. Boodwah

    Boodwah One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2006
    Messages:
    4,349
    Likes Received:
    7,060
    Location:
    StKilda,VicBC,Prom,France
    I've thought of a few options, including just doing it outside resort boundaries, say daytime GAR to Twins Summit and back.
    But most of the events in the US and the Alps are apres ski night events, and they're really fun in the dark with headlamps, and en piste, followed by lots of cheese, saucisson and gluhwein.
     
    Chaeron likes this.
  29. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    5,758
    Location:
    Glen Iris, Melbourne
    Set up a just out of bounds opt-in, once-off like Splitfest, and I reckon it would snowball from there. I’d come last, but I’m in.

    Once we’ve got proof of concept you can find a sponsor, negotiate with a media house, and with a promotional package as leverage approach the resorts, playing them off against each other. Anything that lifts their profile and increases their visits would incentivise them. The Grollos would get it.

    With Hotham It’s about finding the right person at the right level of the oganisation to talk to. Merlin is an entertainment company, after all. They would buy in if they had proof of concept.

    As it is, there’s so much untapped promotional and media opportunity in existing Aus snowsports to tap into.

    Anyone that can keep costs down in producing outdoors sports competition related media and finding new ways to monetise distribution is going to make a motza. In reality Red Bull dominates here because of gains from scale (multiple sports and locations), and existing market power.
     
    CarveMan likes this.
  30. Beerman

    Beerman One of Us Ski Pass: Silver

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2015
    Messages:
    2,861
    Likes Received:
    2,667
    Location:
    Brisvegas
    I'd like to see an Olympic version of 9's Wide World of Sport Wacky Winter Weekend, but instead of the money grab at the end of the race, it's medals
    The aerial comp/pool jump could be good too, minus the judged component, distance and height for the win.
    Team tube races would also be a blast, team that finishes first with all cling ons still attached wins.

    Take that you drug cheating nations............................you know who you are.:p
     
    Chaeron likes this.
  31. Telemark Phat

    Telemark Phat Pass the butter Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2008
    Messages:
    17,970
    Likes Received:
    12,630
    Location:
    Jindabyne
    Its no different to gate judging in Alpine.
     
    Chaeron likes this.
  32. Lady Penelope

    Lady Penelope One of some lot ... Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2014
    Messages:
    3,246
    Likes Received:
    8,090
    Location:
    Canberra
    Oh, you .... I like the figure skating!

    Now for a new “sport”, they could always bring back ‘ski ballet’. Video, anyone?
     
    Chaeron likes this.
  33. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    5,758
    Location:
    Glen Iris, Melbourne


    Ski ballet men’s final 1988
     
    Lady Penelope likes this.
  34. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    5,758
    Location:
    Glen Iris, Melbourne


    There’s always snowmobile racing or snowbiking - should lift ratings in the American midwest and other places you might wish to nominate.

    Go on you know you want to - pristine, quiet, natural landscape and revheads - what’s not to like?

     
  35. sly_karma

    sly_karma Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    20,355
    Likes Received:
    10,152
    Location:
    Penticton, BC
    No it's a little less definitive than that. If you have a judge on every gate, positioned exactly the same position level with the panel, then it works ok. But usually gate judges watch 3 or 4 Gates each. So they aren't positioned properly to see separation between front heel and rear toe.

    But this whole "Tele turn only" proposition is preposterous. It's like F1 cars allowed on the track with a turbo, but penalised if they actually use it.
     
  36. Telemark Phat

    Telemark Phat Pass the butter Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2008
    Messages:
    17,970
    Likes Received:
    12,630
    Location:
    Jindabyne
    For a FIS race there is a maximum of two gates per judge. There is less controversy over gate judging in Telemark than there is over equipment rule changes in Alpine Ski Racing.

    Having to make Telemark turns on a Telemark race is no less preposterous than having to go through all of the gates in slalom. It's much faster to put on a pair of Downhill Skis and just ski straight didn't the hill, ignoring all of the gates in a good tuck. All that turning is like having turbo in your F1 car and not being allowed to use it.
     
    Chaeron likes this.
  37. sly_karma

    sly_karma Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    20,355
    Likes Received:
    10,152
    Location:
    Penticton, BC
    No doubt if there was an Olympic Tele event they would have one judge per gate and judging would be a non issue. I've timed Tele a few times including nationals. Lots of fun, relaxed atmosphere. Would be happy to see Tele displace any or all of those silly spinning events.
     
    Telemark Phat likes this.
  38. dossa5

    dossa5 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2009
    Messages:
    1,435
    Likes Received:
    350
    Location:
    Ovens Valley N.E Vico
    bawbawbel would love those turns
     
    Chaeron and zac150 like this.
  39. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    17,101
    Likes Received:
    17,513
    Location:
    Canberra
    Dual Slalom or should it be duel slalom.
     
    Chaeron likes this.
  40. Legs Akimbo

    Legs Akimbo Grumblebum Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2014
    Messages:
    30,365
    Likes Received:
    24,855
    Location:
    Coastal suburban boonies.
    Dual downhill would be interesting. Some possible safety issues.
     
  41. Kletterer

    Kletterer Thredbo Doughnut Tragic Moderator Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    17,101
    Likes Received:
    17,513
    Location:
    Canberra
    You would need an exceptionaly wide course.
     
    Chaeron likes this.
  42. sly_karma

    sly_karma Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    20,355
    Likes Received:
    10,152
    Location:
    Penticton, BC
    This event is called Team Alpine. I timed one at Whistler Cup last easter, hands down the most exciting ski event I've ever seen. By the time they were down to semi finals there was a crowd of 400+ coaches, parents and athletes making so much noise the racers in the start couldn't hear the countdown beeper but fortunately they had the 'christmas tree' lights to go by. Super close racing with finishes within a few hundredths on several occasions. This event would be fan favourite at the olympics without question. The media would love the 2 male/2 female team angle. There's also some tactical choices to make, with the best seeded team in each matchup choosing their lineup after their opponent does - ie, they can match up racers for best advantage.
     
    Kletterer and Chaeron like this.
  43. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    5,758
    Location:
    Glen Iris, Melbourne
    Dual slalom would be awesome at the Olympics.

    Watching Ski cross vs.downhill - The psychology of racing solo on the clock against a field is so different to racing against others - aggression & risk vs. focus & pure technical proficiency.

    I recall from last season judging school snowsports downhill live - in a large slalom field of 120+ you could immediately see there were really only 4 people in the race.

    I can imagine them being wiped out in heats by lesser racers - at top pro level this would still happen but at a significantly lesser extent.

    However, watching ski cross live it’s also clear how the technically stronger athletes immediately pull clear from the field in heats. Still some crazy outcomes though - remember the Sochi quarter finals photo finish?



    No even snowsports racing in combined events - look at Steve Bradbury’s Salt Lake skating gold - last man standing, not the best.

     
  44. Telemark Phat

    Telemark Phat Pass the butter Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2008
    Messages:
    17,970
    Likes Received:
    12,630
    Location:
    Jindabyne
    The first thing you need to do to be the best is not fall over.
     
    Red_switch, Chaeron and sly_karma like this.
  45. sly_karma

    sly_karma Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    20,355
    Likes Received:
    10,152
    Location:
    Penticton, BC
    Dual slalom, meh. Another individual competition. Team Alpine, big thumbs up. About the only time you see it with any regularity is every two years, at the world championships. And now at Whistler Cup, was a massive success for them. But that's U16 athletes, not likely to see much TV coverage.
     
  46. sly_karma

    sly_karma Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    20,355
    Likes Received:
    10,152
    Location:
    Penticton, BC
    Yep, everyone chuckles about 'doing a Bradbury', but he worked his arse off to make it to that Games after some very serious injuries over the years previous. And then battled through heats and semis to be in the final with the best in the world. AND stayed in touch through the whole final such that he was across for the win before Ono could scramble to his feet and lunge across. The quintessential illustration of 'never say die' and choosing a strategy that minimises your shortcomings. Much respect.
     
  47. Chaeron

    Chaeron One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    5,758
    Location:
    Glen Iris, Melbourne
    Amen
     
    LMB likes this.
  48. zac150

    zac150 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    3,395
    Likes Received:
    4,561
    This is going to be great to watch but I recon it would be better if like the boarder cross relay it was a continual event so the race gate opens when the skier crosses the line at the bottom.
     
    sly_karma likes this.
  49. person s

    person s Old n' Crusty Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2001
    Messages:
    33,228
    Likes Received:
    12,932
    Location:
    macdonaldtown
    he also had a bronze from a previous team event
    and made many of the boots that they were wearing
     
    LMB likes this.
  50. zac150

    zac150 One of Us Ski Pass: Gold

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    3,395
    Likes Received:
    4,561
    There’s only one thing worse than figure skating, ice dancing! So dull after all the high energy adrenaline events.