Yet another tyre thread

fenrir

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Looks like it's been a couple of years.

My tyres on the xtrail got a little skatey in the rain yesterday and when I checked the outside groove only had about 3mm of tread left while the inside grooves had double that. Looks like some idiot has been cornering too hard in my car.

With ski season coming up and hopefully every weekend spent driving up it's probably time for new tyres. I did a bit of a search using the criteria "less than $250/tyre fitted" (preferably more like $200/tyre) and "must have the mountain snowflake symbol".

So far I've come up with:
Yokohama Geolander AT G015
Pirelli Scorpion All Terrain Plus

Does anyone have experience with thse? Are there any other that should be on the list given my criteria?

Thanks
 

fenrir

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What size tyres ?

What is your drive to the mountains route ?
Canberra/Jindabyne to Perisher or Thredbo. Maybe I will visit Hotham at some point.

I have gone slight larger on the xtrail - 225/65 r17 (instead of 225/60)
 

teckel

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Looks like it's been a couple of years.

My tyres on the xtrail got a little skatey in the rain yesterday and when I checked the outside groove only had about 3mm of tread left while the inside grooves had double that. Looks like some idiot has been cornering too hard in my car.

With ski season coming up and hopefully every weekend spent driving up it's probably time for new tyres. I did a bit of a search using the criteria "less than $250/tyre fitted" (preferably more like $200/tyre) and "must have the mountain snowflake symbol".

So far I've come up with:
Yokohama Geolander AT G015
Pirelli Scorpion All Terrain Plus

Does anyone have experience with thse? Are there any other that should be on the list given my criteria?

Thanks
Are you sure they have the "mountain snowflake symbol"? Pretty sure the Yokohama doesn't, and I think the Pirelli is just an all terrain type tyre also without your snowflake symbol. I certainly can't see the snowflake on pics of either tyre or see it on the specs. Maybe I'm wrong.
 

fenrir

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Are you sure they have the "mountain snowflake symbol"? Pretty sure the Yokohama doesn't, and I think the Pirelli is just an all terrain type tyre also without your snowflake symbol. I certainly can't see the snowflake on pics of either tyre or see it on the specs. Maybe I'm wrong.
Unless they've changed the specs for the Australian market compared to everywhere else on the plant they should do? It's mentioned on the global site.
 

teckel

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Unless they've changed the specs for the Australian market compared to everywhere else on the plant they should do? It's mentioned on the global site.
Can't see it here - https://www.yokohama.com.au/our-range/tyres/Geolandar A T G015?type=4x4 Tyres & SUV Tyres
Or here: https://www.pirelli.com/tyres/en-au/car/find-your-tyres/products-sheet/scorpion-all-terrain-plus
The Pirellis seem to be a mud & snow tyre, which is an all-season tyre, not specifically a snow or winter tyre with the symbol you seek.
 

fenrir

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Can't see it here - https://www.yokohama.com.au/our-range/tyres/Geolandar A T G015?type=4x4 Tyres & SUV Tyres
Or here: https://www.pirelli.com/tyres/en-au/car/find-your-tyres/products-sheet/scorpion-all-terrain-plus
The Pirellis seem to be a mud & snow tyre, which is an all-season tyre, not specifically a snow or winter tyre with the symbol you seek.
upload_2020-6-22_9-52-38.png

Looks like it's there on the Pirelli.

Listed on the Yokohama global site too:
https://www.yokohamatire.com/tires/geolandar-a-t-g015
 

dawooduck

relaxed and comfortable
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Have a look at the Falken AT3W. I have them in my Dmax tray ute and they go well as a 3PMFS "Snow tyre" in the AT range. Also good on the dirt and tar.

We have Landsail IS37 on TBC Dmax dual cab which are a full snow tyre but are also nice on the highway. Will take these off in Sept and put Wildpeak AT3W on as the summer tyre.

We have three sets of rims so the tyres are interchangeable between vehicles.

https://www.falken.com.au/product/wildpeak-at3w/
 
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Chaeron

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Don’t necessarily restrict yourself to snow tyres. Many all-terrain tyres with a wide enough pattern able to clear snow are also functional, especially in combination with 4x4, and driving to prevailing conditions.

Adequate traction at appropriate speeds in marginal conditions require chains in any case.
 
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fenrir

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Have a look at the Falken AT3W. I have them in my Dmax tray ute and they go well as a 3PMFS "Snow tyre" in the AT range. Also good on the dirt and tar.

https://www.falken.com.au/product/wildpeak-at3w/
Looks like the Falken's are too big for my little car - I don't think I could go any bigger than 225/65 r17 (and the smallest AT3W I can find is 225/70 r17).

Quite happy to have an all season tyre, just looking for one that won't suck on snow. For reasons I wont go into I have ended up with some Nankang CrossSport on my car and the best description I can give them day to day is "adequate". They were pretty terrible in the snow and now that they are getting skaty in the wet due to wear I don't trust them in the forthcoming pre dawn hunger games to secure one of the limited parking places.
 
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john_k

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You should be able to get the Goodyear All Terrain Wrangler's for $250 per tyre. They seem to be a very good AT tyre for road and off road inc. snow. Also the MAXXIS tyres seem to get good reviews if you want to go cheaper. I use the Goodyear's on my Nissan Pathfinder. There are lots of EOFY special's at the moment so you have timed it well!
 
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fenrir

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You should be able to get the Goodyear All Terrain Wrangler's for $250 per tyre. They seem to be a very good AT tyre for road and off road inc. snow.
Like the Falken's the smallest Wrangler AT's are too big for my car. For small SUV's it largely seems to be oversized summer road tyres that are available.
 

telecrag

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I liked the Coopers when I had 4WD, the cross style though, LT or AT. Bit more expensive, but I got 120K out of them on the Vitara, and about 80 on the Hilux.

Now with the van I get about 40-50 max, some only 30.
 
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john_k

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As a back up and depending how long you want to keep your car you can also change the wheels! a bit of a bummer but you can then resell your wheels I guess.
 

chriscross

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My Outback came with the Geolander as new and I was very happy with their performance. Replaced them after 4 years with the Pirelli Scorpion on mechanic's advice and they have been great in mud, ice, snow.
 
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Skichic2

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I have snow tyres on my Impreza, coming up to 4th season. No idea what they are, but I recommend chatting to Tyrepower in Jindy, mine were no more expensive than normal tyres and have never slipped. They don’t get as much snow use now, but plenty when I lived down there.
 
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sly_karma

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Don’t necessarily restrict yourself to snow tyres. Many all-terrain tyres with a wide enough pattern able to clear snow are also functional, especially in combination with 4x4, and driving to prevailing conditions.
.
This is the POV I've come to take too, at least for bigger AWD/4WD vehicles like pickups and SUVs. I know there's no certification for M+S but typically the tread pattern is sufficiently aggressive for decent clearing of slush and slop. My concerns for traction are at their height when it's mild rather than icy cold - a lot more grip and consistency at -10 or below than at +1. That melting/freezing zone has a lot of excess water around and aquaplaning can be a real worry in the slush. Is that soft compound as much of a thing then? Chunky tread compound and lots of siping are what is needed.

I've been leaving the factory rubber M+S in place and selecting Auto 4WD mode all winter for a long time now. Found replacement sets of the OEM tyres used and cheap because lots of guys take them off in favour of something more fancy. They stay on the truck all year, one less thing to do when the seasons are changing and they wear better in summer than a soft winter compound will.
 

fenrir

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This is the POV I've come to take too, at least for bigger AWD/4WD vehicles like pickups and SUVs. I know there's no certification for M+S but typically the tread pattern is sufficiently aggressive for decent clearing of slush and slop. My concerns for traction are at their height when it's mild rather than icy cold - a lot more grip and consistency at -10 or below than at +1. That melting/freezing zone has a lot of excess water around and aquaplaning can be a real worry in the slush. Is that soft compound as much of a thing then? Chunky tread compound and lots of siping are what is needed.

I've been leaving the factory rubber M+S in place and selecting Auto 4WD mode all winter for a long time now. Found replacement sets of the OEM tyres used and cheap because lots of guys take them off in favour of something more fancy. They stay on the truck all year, one less thing to do when the seasons are changing and they wear better in summer than a soft winter compound will.
All things considered I've gone for the Scorpion AT Plus over the Geolander g015 in part because I got a good price but also because of that chunky tread. Some other great options there if I could squeeze any slightly bigger tyres but allas I have only a small car, and I've already gone as tall as I can without interfering significantly with clearance and legality.
 

snowmobile

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All things considered I've gone for the Scorpion AT Plus over the Geolander g015 in part because I got a good price but also because of that chunky tread. Some other great options there if I could squeeze any slightly bigger tyres but allas I have only a small car, and I've already gone as tall as I can without interfering significantly with clearance and legality.

I had the Pirelli Scorpion All Terrain Plus put on our Forester in 2018 for trip to Hotham, the tyres handled the conditions well.
My wife uses the Forester as a daily driver and I'm impressed with the wear of the Pirrelli's and general all round performance.

I think driving to the conditions in a all wheel drive with most tyres and decent tread you will be generally fine......different story on ice as chains are your only friend.
 
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snow drive solutions

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I know there's no certification for M+S but typically the tread pattern is sufficiently aggressive for decent clearing of slush and slop. My concerns for traction are at their height when it's mild rather than icy cold - a lot more grip and consistency at -10 or below than at +1. That melting/freezing zone has a lot of excess water around and aquaplaning can be a real worry in the slush. Is that soft compound as much of a thing then? Chunky tread compound and lots of siping are what is needed.
Good points Sly :)

An icy road surface is not always the cause of the problems on alpine roads, deep snow slush can easily turn a driver into a passenger.

On a wet country road hydroplaning or aquaplaning is dangerous, slush planing that can occur when driving on wet soft snow on alpine roads is even more dangerous. Slush planing occurs because the tyre loses contact with the road and you can not steer, or brake, the vehicle. The combination of deep slushy melting snow, a layer of water on the road surface, and possibly ice can make driving extremely dangerous, even for the most experienced driver.
It is important to have tyres with the proper tread pattern, design, depth and properties to suit these types of road/weather conditions.
When there is deep snow slush on the road, and the driving speed exceeds a certain limit, the tread pattern of the tyre may no longer pushes aside the slush and water from underneath the tyre. The contact between the tyre and the road will be lost, and so will the grip.
Wet snow slush means danger and is a frequent situation on alpine roads here in Australia. The same problem can occur on roads and especially freeways in other areas after heavy hail storms. Slush planing occurs because the tyre loses contact with the road and you can not steer the vehicle anymore. When you have to change lanes or to overtake others and you have to cross the slush barrier between the lanes the vehicle can lose side grip and can easily skid.
Slush planing is more dangerous than aquaplaning. Slush planing makes tyres lose contact with the ground with much lower speeds than aquaplaning. At speeds below 50 km/h tyres may lose contact with the ground on slush whereas aquaplaning typically occurs with speeds up from 80 km/h. Without tyre contact to the road the vehicle can not be steered any more.
Slush planing is more dangerous than aquaplaning for the following reasons:
On ordinary roads the depths of the layer of rain water is rarely more than 5-10 millimetres but slush can be much thicker, up to 40 millimetres on the driving lanes and up to 100 millimetres between the driving lanes.
Slush has got a higher viscosity than water, therefore is pastier, and can not be evacuated by tyre tread channels as easily as water, especially with summer tyres.
This video may help to explain………..
 

NightSky

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You are probably still within margins of error, but note that your new tyre size will give you a 3 km/h increase in actual speed at 100km/h on your speedometer.

Old tyre 100kmh
New tyre 103kmh
 

Telezacski

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Will be interested to hear how you go, as I like Pirelli tyres, have them on the Impreza (not snow tyres) and even on the bike. I’ve always liked the tyre feel.

mom the outback I used to love the Yoko geo landers but switched not long back to the coopers as they came with a good guarantee and have been impressed. But having driven in deep snow using the m and a tyres and happily get some for here if the Pirelli work.
 

fenrir

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You are probably still within margins of error, but note that your new tyre size will give you a 3 km/h increase in actual speed at 100km/h on your speedometer.

Old tyre 100kmh
New tyre 103kmh
It's one of the reasons why I went a size up to begin with, the speedo on the xtrail is about 6km/hr under.
 
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